Distance running from over a decade ago--HOW FAR WE COME

you are wrong, we are falling further and further behind.

example we only have 34 of the top men 1000 performers in the marathon in 5 years we will probably have less than 10 of the top 1000. all the events are going the same way though not as dramatically as in the marathon.

1 4:04.76+(4:06.38-1mile) Michael Stember Sacramento -->Stanford CA

2 4:06.23+(3:50.84-1500m) *Gabe Jennings (Madison, WI) WI

3 4:06.29+(3:50.90-1500m) Jason Vanderhoof (Sandown, NH) -->Wisconsin NH

4 4:08.34+(3:52.82c1.5k) *Dan McKay Hatboro-Horsham Horsham, Pa

5 4:08.48+(4:10.13-1mile) Robert Frichtel (Hemet, CA) CA

6 4:09.24+(4:10.89-1mile) *Jonathon Riley Brookline, MA

7 4:09.2? Marius Bakken Illinois exch. Student- Norway IL

8 4:09.82 Micheil Jones Livermore CA

9 4:10.10 Matt Pearson, O'Dea WA

10 4:10.49+(3:54.84c1.5k) Darren Dinneen Phill.A. Andover, -->Harvard MA

11 4:10.81+ *Sharif Karie w-Springfield VA

12 4:11.2? Matt Twiest Albuquerque -->Bates NM

13 4:11.50 Larry Henderson, Mira Mesa (12) (3.00 GPA) CA

14 4:11.73+(3:56.0c1.5k) Billy Harper Junction City OR

15 4:11.80+(3:56.06c1.5k) *Grant Robison, McMinnville, OR

16 4:12.10+Dan Sikiric - Leland, CA

17 4:12.51 Kell Giffin, Bainbridge WA

18 4:12.88+(4:14.56-1mile) Aaron Gillen (Yreka, CA) CA

19 4:12.8? Abdul Alzindani - Dearborn Fordson -->NC St. MI

20 4:12.92+(3:57.11c1.5k) Shawn Downey, Silverton, OR

21 4:13.07 Andy Tate, Stillwater Area MN

22 4:13.13 Jeremy Polson, Duluth Denfield Minnesota MN

23 4:13.1? *Brad Hansen San Fr. CA

24 4:13.25 *Isaac Hawkins, Ferris WA

25 4:13.25 *Jason Fayant, Mead WA

26 4:13.33+(3:57.5c1.5k) Andy Carmen, Elmira, OR

Read more:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2024153#ixzz1tFzJpLk8

You need to post last year's stats for comparison, otherwise these are meaningless. 1:50, 4:06, 9:03 all sound pretty fast to me.

Nope. Burke (as usual) is wrong.

The USA has tons of medal threats.

Manzano

Wheating

Symmonds

Ritz

Rupp

Solinsky

Tegenkamp

So why don't you go back to fantasizing about bedding some drugged up, Hermens-coached, boyish Ethiopian 'woman' and leave the thinking for grownups?

Slowdown90s wrote:

20 4:12.92+(3:57.11c1.5k) Shawn Downey, Silverton, OR

26 4:13.33+(3:57.5c1.5k) Andy Carmen, Elmira, OR

Wait, what kind of screwy conversion factor are they using? My 1500 pr is 3:57.5 and I call myself a 4:16 miler. I could see 4:15 if we're talking 1600. Since when is a 3:57 1500 equal to 4:12 or 4:13?

i am talking about number americans in the all time top 1000 performers and performance list, it is shrinking.

US World Oly Major medalists

Deena from Los Angeles

Meb from San Diego

Shan Row from San Francisco

Shalane from Boston

Kara from New York City/Minnesota

Jenny from Iowa/Florida

Lagat from Kenya

That's not so bad ;-]

"Sixteen American men in history have run faster than 2:10 (a 4:58 per mile pace); 38 Kenyan men did it in October." - Sports Illustrated, April 2012

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1197114/3/index.htm

Results from last year's California State Meet:

The Africans are leaving everyone behind why pick on the Americans.

I haven't found "any" good explanations for much faster times now a days.

where is Oshier now?

3200 is now an event for fast kids.

CA winner has 48 relay speed. Ran about

60 miles/week. Fernandez ran half as many miles

as Nelson.

Second big factor is the demographics.

Many millions more people in CA now, younger

population and more working class Mexican-Americans far more likely to be non-lazy compared to rich white kids.

Third factor is the coaching. Less emphasis on

jogging like snails, more emphasis on useful work.

More coaches (not enough) using those pointless dual meets as workouts. The overuse of qualifying meets actually forces good runners to peak.

The competitive UC system increases the number of kids who try track as an activity. Running is fun and kids with focus on academic success bring that energy to training.

More accurately, a very small percentage of Africans (from a handful of provinces mostly in Kenya and Ethiopia) are leaving the rest of the world behind (including most of Africa). You are right, the US is just one of all the other nations getting left in the dust. Here's something to think about: there are about 45 provinces/districts in Kenya. The best runners overwhelming hail from 2 or 3 provinces near the Rift. The runners from the other 40 or so provinces really have no better chance of beating the "Rift minority" than the Americans or Euorpeans do. So, in a very real sense the "rest of Africa (even most of Kenya)" is also falling behind. A tiny, specific sliver of humanity has just found what it can do better than anyone else on the planet. The only other sport I can think of where we see not just one nation, but a tiny enclave of one nation dominating the world is Squash, where you better be from Pakistan if you want to compete at all.

sonny douglas wrote:

The Africans are leaving everyone behind why pick on the Americans.

1 Elias Gedyon 12 Loyola/ss 8:50.03 10

2 Sam Pons 12 S Pasadena 8:50.67 8

3 Trevor Halsted 12 Davis /sj 8:51.96 6

4 Lane Werley 12 King, ML /ss 8:53.21 5

5 Heyden Wooff 12 Camarillo/ss 8:55.13 4

6 Luis Luna 11 Piner/nc 8:55.43 3

7 Ammar Moussa 12 Arcadia/ss 8:56.97 2

8 Danny Martinez 11 St. John Bos 8:57.42 1

9 Jonah Diaz 11 Palos Verdes 8:58.28

10 Chris Kigar 12 El Camino/sj 8:59.22

11 Darren Fahy 11 La Costa/sd 8:59.27

12 Kevin Bishop 11 MontaVst/ cc 8:59.82

13 Matt Carpowich 12 Torrey Pn/sd 8:59.96

14 Paul Ross 12 Clremnt/ss 9:00.35

1 Jantzen Oshier 12 Trabuco H/Ss 4:00.83 10

2 Elias Gedyon 12 Loyola/ss 4:04.04 8

3 Luis Gutierez 11 Rnch Cucm/ss 4:06.51 6

4 Matt Carpowich 12 Torrey Pn/sd 4:07.21 5

5 Chris Waschura 11 Woodside /cc 4:08.29 4

6 Connor Kaddatz 12 Dana Hlls/ss 4:09.58 3

7 Karson Fronk 12 Great Oak 4:10.63 2

That 9:03 not looking so fast is it?

and you also have to take into consideration that granville was/is the best prep 800 meter runner ever, take him out the mix and it is really bad. Same with stember in the 1600

You hit the nail on the head !

Our post high school and post collegiate coaching is dismal at best.

Nike is making some headway with its programs on a world class level.

Brooks program is developing good national class runners. ( ok , one woman is world class )

USATF does not have a clue of how to develop programs or educate.

One step forward three steps back.

Here are numbers for men on the world list at:

1500m (3:40 or better)

5000m (13:35 or better

10000m (28:30 or better)

American men on world list for the years 2000 and 2011:

2000 2011

1500m 14 26

5000m 13 20

10,000m 9 18

American distance has clearly come far in the last decade on the track.

Look at the 1500m.

In 2009 3 Americans made the WC final

In 2010 a different American ran 3:30

In 2011 an even different American got a medal

5 American milers that have been mixing current it up on the world level when they used to have trouble finding 3 that could even hit the A standard.

And Webb isn't even one of those 5.

I think this shows a difference in time trialing and racing. Also, it does not matter if the Kenyans have 30 guys faster, since they can only send 3 (as can the US). As long as we have 1 or 2 contenders, we can medal.

I prefer medals and competition over glorified time trials.