Question for Coachs of top Level HS distance programs about your interaction with College Coaches

This question is for the High School Coaches of distance athletes with D1 college ability.

As a coach for 15 years I have become more and more frustrated with the poor coaching or lack of coaching that goes on in D1 schools.

Here are a few questions I have for you:

1. Of course I care where they go. I know the college system and know some schools are better than others.

2. I think that over 1/2 of college coaches are UNqualified! They went from college, to recruiter, to head coach and never had to struggle developing kids and working with injuries. I know so many h.s. coaches who could coach the pants off many top level DI coaches!

3. Hardly any coaches will EVER call the h.s. coach. They want to talk to the person they are coaching next year...the kid! H.S. coaches will only tell the coach what they want to hear. The recruiters need to know what type of kid they are getting and want to talk directly to them. IF the coach calls, yes, I ask what program/workout style they have and give honest opinion on if my athlete would thrive in their system.

4. Absolutely! See #1. Many college coaches have no clue how to coach the entire team. They have their workouts and if you don't perfectly fit, you get slower or hurt. Happens all the time. I know who those coaches are and I flat out tell my kids that.

p.s. If you want to help your kids out, look at what conference they can score in and give them a list of schools in that conference. Why go to the worste school in your conference just to run horrible (compartively) for 4 years? Go to a conference where you can score and have fun!

Thanks!!

That is what I thought.

Can you say what are of the country you are from?

I am interested in how the HS coaches from the North, Northwest, Calif interact with the College coaches, seeing how they have the better D1 programs.

I don't get involved until the student-athlete and parents narrow down their list of schools based on academics and financials. Then I'll offer my 2 cents.

1. I'm interested, but it is the kid's decision and there are other factors at play. I have opinions, but they are usually of the minority variety, thinking kids should think twice about going with the best scholarship offer or going to the team that placed the best at NCAAs that year. They're not my athlete after HS, and I think too many (especially young) coaches get overinvolved as if they are being recruited. It's great that you care about your job and create good opportunities for kids, but loosen up on the control issues.

2. What is a strong enough program? The reality is most kids still need to work their asses off to do well in college, especially at the D1 level. What's a qualified coach? Someone who has a proven track record of success, or someone whose personality really clicks with your athlete?

3. No, I have a conversation with them and find out what type of person they are, what they think is important, and usually tell them about my athlete. Training is one of the most overrated things to speak about. So what if the training program is similar, maybe something difficult will stimulate a kid's development better. Furthermore, NCAA XC is entirely different than HS, as is track. Different distances, different schedules, different age/maturity level...the training probably should be different. It just seems like an asinine question to ask.

4. No, if they want my advice, they get a bit, but it's mostly just making sure they've thought about all the reasons they like that school, and not just the program. And if a lot hinges on the program, then they should be sure that running is going to be a major focus, especially if there is a scholarship attached. I think HS coaches forget about the aspect that there is also a responsibility of the athlete to the program once they accept that scholarship.

I coached at both HS/college levels...had good times doing both. Recruiting was fun at times, and I know how obnoxious HS coaches can be sometimes. I've been at both ends of the calls, and had plenty of experience with athletes succeeding beyond their expectations, as well as with "ruining" other athletes...all depends on perspective.

I've coached both HS and College, so I've seen it from both sides of the fence. In general, I would say College coaches want nothing to do with prior attachments of their incoming athletes, which means both HS coaches and parents. The exception is pre-existing friendships and a friends-in-passing relationship designed to keep recruiting pipelines open.

However, College coaches are typically receptive to being contacted by HS coaches during the recruiting process -- assuming it's an athlete they are actively recruiting -- knowing that it's an important piece of the puzzle of advice the athlete will receive.

Dan

Having run and coached at both HS and D1 levels

No matter what program the athlete chooses, you will not be his/her coach next year. The most productive thing you can do is to present (honestly) the best case for your kids to the programs that contact you. In this way, you open doors for them. It is up to them (and their parents) to pick among the options. Grilling the collegiate coaches is no more appropriate than them calling up and grilling you... it will not help kids from your program. That does not mean that you shouldn't talk to the athletes in your program about their options (particularly if they ask).

It is not your job to find a college for your runner. If you had college coaching experience, then you can provide some factual information to your athlete about how college track and field works. Otherwise, your role is to be a supporter for your athlete, if a college coach calls you (rarely) or if the athlete asks you to write a recommendation.

If you get involved in the selection process be aware that the athlete might end up coming back home and blaming you, if he doesn't like the school or if he fails to be successful, either in the classroom and or in the sport.

As the other poster noted, the student/athlete and his guardians are the ones who make the decision.

20 year hs coach with lots of college recruit experience:

1. Yes I care, I want them to continue to grow as an athlete if they choose to pursue athletics.

2. If my athletes ask me for help I certainly will help them. I may give them half dozen universities to look at that fit their goals for academics and athletics.

3. I am familiar with most in state college training programs. From past athletes attending schools I'm aware of what does and doesn't happen. I never grill a college coach. I use this time to highlight the athlete's strengths and how I think they would perform within the program.

4. I don't discourage an athlete from attending any school. It is their choice and life not yours. But yes, I have inwardly cringed at some of the choices they've made.

1. I do care that they go to a program that is a good fit for that athlete. First and foremost is it a good academic fit for what that athlete wants for their future profession? Even elites will need skills to help them after they are finished competing. There's no guarantee that they will go on to compete at the world level and become wealthy from it.

2. D1 schools vary in the programs that they have because there isn't always emphasis on a great T&F or XC program, sometimes they are D1 because they want to compete at a high level in football or basketball. So yes, I will suggest to the athlete, "here are the schools with the good programs and here are the questionable ones." I wouldn't call it a struggle, it's really not that difficult, if you have an athlete that is good enough to actually compete at say the PAC-12 level it's fairly easy to find a good program and very talented coaches.

3. No, I won't talk to the D1 coach about the training program, but I will advise the athlete to take their training log with them to these schools when they visit and share that information. I do give the kids a list of questions to ask. If the kid is an Elite and well experienced, they already know other elites and when they visit schools and talk to the elites at that school they get a good idea of how the program runs.

4. Yes. But ultimately it's up to the athlete and the parents; what they can afford? the geographical location? academics? What's going to make them happy? I'm not going to stand in the way of anyone's happiness. There's a lot to consider for those athletes and parents, it's very stressful.

My role is to help when asked by the athlete/family. I will get involved to the extent they request and need, but as others have pointed out, it's absolutely an athlete/family decision.

My two biggest issues with college coaches are:

1. Simply not returning an athlete's emails and/or phone calls. If you're not interested, a quick email takes less than a minute. Be professional. Have a grad assistant do it if there are too many inquiries to keep up with.

2. The "better than thou" attitude a minority of college coaches have towards high school coaches. Lighten up a little. We're all professionals dedicated to helping young people. I know I can coach, but I certainly don't need to act like an ass about it.

I often cringe at what reasons HS coaches use for determining "good" and "bad" programs.

I'll chime in from the perspective of a parent of a highly recruited kid.

My son's coach had no interaction with college coaches during the recruiting process, and we didn't expect or even want him to. (My kid definitely did not go to a 'top level' high school program, though, but those are not the only programs that produce good runners, for what that's worth). I don't think we would have wanted the coach involved - there is certainly enough info on dyestat, milesplit and elsewhere for kids to read to learn what sort of questions they might want to ask coaches and team members during the recruiting process.

We did get plenty of unsolicited advice from other coaches at meets - my kid was very well known and liked and everyone seemed to have an opinion about where he should go, the reputation of different programs, etc. The problem is that no one really knows what the athlete is looking for in a program except the athlete - coach might think they are going to college primarily to run, and concentrate on the running program. But the kid might be looking more at the college, what classes are offered, tone of the school outside sports, geographic location, etc etc. Also, many coaches told us 'inside info' about the same programs that was just all over the map - some with inside info that it was a horrible program that ran runners into the ground, others saying it was the best thing ever. Just hard to know. The kid needs to make his own decisions and let the cards fall where they may.

Just my opinion.

I’m a reporter for the Medill News Service and I’m writing a story about long distance runners and injuries. I was hoping to speak to some college-bound runners or their parents or coaches for my story, and a lot of the posts in this thread reflect what I want to learn about.

If any of you coaches or parents in this thread wouldn’t mind talking to me, please email me. I'd appreciate any help you can offer.

Thanks.

(P.S. We’re the real deal, if you were wondering. Here’s our site:

http://news.medill.northwestern.edu/chicago/

)

Frustrated HS Coach wrote:

Thanks!!

That is what I thought.

Can you say what are of the country you are from?

I am interested in how the HS coaches from the North, Northwest, Calif interact with the College coaches, seeing how they have the better D1 programs.

Interesting last sentence here. I assume you've seen the results of the 2011 NCAA championships. top 5 mens teams are all from the south or the east, 7 of the top 11 teams on the womens side from the same area. For cross they are about evenly split with the majority of the top 5 womens' teams from the east

Why go to college? Especially most American colleges?

Seems a little forced to me. How about we take pressure off the kids....

I question coaches who assume college is the next step, without "coaching" their kids to more worldwide awareness.

At least support schooling that promotes teachings that does not put each kid in an envelope of a major, sending our best and brightest off to his/her cubicle in downtown industryville to make the world just keep going and going and going...

Do not let the cards fall where they may....we coaches can be better.