Penn Relays 4x800 who ya got?

malmo wrote:

How do you turn biomechanoids in to fierce human warriors?

From 1968 to 2005 (or whenever Groves retired) Penn State won how many 4X800 titles? Three or four in the mid 80s? Aside from those great teams, PSU didn't win a single DMR, 4X1500 or 4XMile - NOT ONE.

So, other than the guys who took home the Penn Relays watches, are we to assume that all the other Nittany Lions who hauled a baton around Franklin Field were biomechanoids?

A bunch of guys won individual titles in the 70s. Greg Fredericks and Bruce Baden to name a few. They were kind of soft though.

You want to talk about underperforming? Talk about Gondak's teams at UK.

He had a damn 800m factory in Lexington yet do we remember any of them individually? He probably had 6 guys under 1:48 at a given time.

Another opinion wrote:

From 1968 to 2005 (or whenever Groves retired) Penn State won how many 4X800 titles? Three or four in the mid 80s? Aside from those great teams, PSU didn't win a single DMR, 4X1500 or 4XMile - NOT ONE.

So, other than the guys who took home the Penn Relays watches, are we to assume that all the other Nittany Lions who hauled a baton around Franklin Field were biomechanoids?

You keep struggling. I never said that they have to WIN, I said that they have to step up to the plate and COMPETE, and run to their abilities, which they did. In fact, they set an AR in the 4x1500 in the mid 80s. Fact is coach Grove produced American Recordholders and all of them were competitors first, robots last. That's a lot to say, since Greg Fredericks was the most silky smooth runner that America has ever produced, yet he was the prototype of what to do when the kill-switch gets turned on.

When this new crop of biomechanoids actually runs to their ability and competes, I'll be the first to say, "that's what I'm talkin about!"

I know, I know..... I suck, I'm angry, I'm bitter, I'm jealous, I'm old, I'm stupid. I'm an asshole. All because I made an observation and offered an opinion on what needs to be done to fix it.

When they walk into Franklin Field on Saturday are the going to have the aura of the gladiators about them, or are they going to be the Christians?

"Your memory is flawed. Going into Penn Relays PSU had a huge advantage on paper. It had been laid out in detail on threads before the race."

There is a difference between 'on paper' and the runners who were actually there. Those times weren't run some years later, they were run that season.

Yes that day was rare. A competitive race where they got out of traffic and had a team pushing them the whole way. No chance for any member to slack because they were always in a competitive position.

You're really getting into this poor me type argument Malmo. I think you've bought up the words "bitter, hater, jealous" more than anyone else in this discussion.

The truth is, you can't comment on the competitive mindset of a runner, based on the exterior representation. It is completely internalized and as other posters have pointed out most runners are taught to relax, not claw and fight.

You're just trolling through this debate, cherry picking the points you can refute and blatantly ignoring the rest. Being anonymous does nothing to detract from the points I make.

"Being anonymous does nothing to detract from the points I make."

I'm not entirely sure about that. Regardless, I'll be rooting for the PSU team, just as I did last year. I'll be just as disappointed as Malmo if they don't perform well. But I'm not going to nit-pick about it either. Hell, I'll even cheer the victor if it isn't PSU. Once you realize that others have opinions too, and its a good thing when they are expressed, we'll all be better off. Fighting anonymously on an internet discussion board seems the definition of trivial to me.

Ok. So you added the AR 4x1500 team. Now what? One other squad of 4 added to the 4x800 teams. Why do you keep bringing Frederick into this discussion? Is his Penn Relays resume something we are missing?

Please list the other PSU relay teams that "competed" - define that please, since it doesn't mean first place, according to you - to your standards? Taking the paper PR time and then using that as a standard against a real racing situation is ridiculous. I have personally witnessed relay races that were flying until the anchor leg, only to see them grind to a tactical last 200 affair. So if a team gets 3rd in such a race and runs slower than their "on paper PR", by your definition, they didn't compete and failed to live up to expectations? Argument fail on your part.

Old Timer 23 wrote:

A bunch of guys won individual titles in the 70s. Greg Fredericks and Bruce Baden to name a few. They were kind of soft though.

First, neither Fredericks nor Baden were soft. Greg was supremely talented, undoubtedly the finest runner PSU has produced, and Bruce worked incredibly hard to be a mainstay on the XC team and a very tough and accomplished steepler.

In 1979, Bruce won the Penn Relays steeple, Alan Scharsu won the 5k, John Ziegler won the 10k and Tim Backenstose won the marathon the week prior to the track portion! It was a clean sweep of all the distance event. Not one of those guys was soft.

I've met most of the current crop of Lions, have seen them run in person. Beyond their obvious talent, I think they're solid citizens and I also think they are a competitive bunch. There are some exceptions, of course, but by and large, I'm happy to see PSU runners producing national caliber times once again. They have the horses to take down the 4x800, 4x1500, SMR and DMR school records. I hope I get the chance to see them do it this year or next at the Penn Relays.

Friendly Bet wrote:

Bunny Suit wrote:

((((---Virginia---)))) Wins by 50 Meters.

Heard it here first.

******FIFTY********

I'll pay you a dollar for every meter Virginia wins by. If they lose you will pay me a dollar for every meter they finish behind first place. You man enough to take me up on this?

Oh for sure... DEAL

Give me your email and it's on fool

Larry, I think that Old Timer 23 was probably joking when he said that those guys were soft....

malmo wrote:

Larry, I think that Old Timer 23 was probably joking when he said that those guys were soft....

Yeah it was sarcasm. They most certainly were not soft. They don't make em like them anymore.

I have heard Vig pulled UVA from the distance medley, only running the 4X800 at Penn hoping to repeat. Might be an advantage with 4 fresh runners...looks like Johnston leading off, Kostelec second leg, Rollers third leg and Andrews on the anchor.

That is ridiculous, I could see last year maybe as Andrews was a frosh and Johnson not as good as he is now.

But when you have a team that can compete, and they can for a wheel, you should be in those spots.

They have all legs covered and a 45.x type split from Farmer, one guy would get to go fresh anyway tomorrow.

Chemont and Malmo - Ahmen!! Time for the Lions to get GRITTY!!

FIFTY METERS

Really such a soft move by a couple of teams not going in this, anyone could be in this, I saw this as wide wide open.

Andrews might have looked pretty good there off that pace, huh?

Gibney with a monster last 150 to win his second out of two tries .Hurt last year.

I was referring to DMR in this 4 x 8 thread.

How doesn't PSU and UVA run in that event this year when it was this soft and wide open.

What did they find out "oh my, PSU/UVA is not running the DMR" so God forbid the other should go in?

Real soft move by the 4 x 8 favorites. Both would have been in to the wire in this.

Well, have to admit when I am at least a bit wrong, unlike others would on here.

PSU went Sprint Med, got 46.3 from Loxsom and 1:48.x from Foster to get the win.

PSU now solid favorite in 4 x 8 off what I see, altho Foster seemed to have to go to the wall in 1:48 today

malmo wrote:

One thing that is lacking from that ENTIRE Penn State squad is emotion. They run like robots. I want to see fire in their eyes that is never there (including Loxsom). When it gets down to the last 100m you NEVER see a Penn State runner go to the arms and claw for every inch. You NEVER see a Penn State runner refuse to lose. You NEVER see a Penn State runner dig in and reach for that extra gear, even if it isn't there. That's their big weakness -- they run like robots.

If they had just a tenth of the competitive spirit that Charlie Maguire had they'd win at Penn. Half of Charlie's spirit -- they'd be unbeatable.

2011 Championship of America Sprint Medley Relay

1 Penn State 3:17.10 Aaron Nadolsky, Brady Gehret, Casimir Loxsom, Ryan Foster (1:48.78)

Let's see: Penn Relays watches won: Nadolsky, Gehret, Loxsom, Foster 1. Malley 0.

Malmo - consider limiting your use of the word NEVER.