Should HS runners get "special" training from their former coach?

it's their prerogative to get private coaching, but it almost never works out as planned. there is a perceived added value with the private coach, but almost 100% of the time it's because they are being paid.

private coach and regular HS coach can both be excellent, but when they work independently the kids get screwed. there is a fairly high profile coach in socal that entices a fair amount of the best talent to work with him. he doesn't produce anybody, he simply works with the kids that are already the best. by association it makes him look like a genius. total hack that should stick to training adult boxers, but maybe he had to expand his market after the balco fiasco took away his secret weapon.

Although I will concede that balancing a private coach and school program is incredibly difficult, you must look at it through the eyes of the student-athlete who wants the best for him or herself.

However, you are blatantly either an angry Massachusetts high school coach whose top athletes decide to train with that club or an angry high school runner or parent whose is just starting trouble for the sake of it.

Being a former athlete from that program, I believe that the head coach is one of the most insightful and knowledgeable coaches in the sport and there is absolutely no one else I would trust more. Not to mention the fact he is a great guy who cares about the athletes long term progression as opposed to the normal high school coach who just wastes kids talent for silly dual meet points. I owe a lot to that man for his support over high school and if you are too ignorant to see the success in athletes he is coaching year around you can see lots of state titles and all american accolades. Before clamoring on about this on the internet,I recommend asking anyone who has trained under him what they thought and probably 95 times out of a 100 it will be good.

At a hugely successful high school in the South, this is what has happened. Their private "coach" coaches the good ones and charges a pretty hefty fee. No idea what the school coaches actually do. This guy cherry picks the best kids from around the area also and coaches them. He's no hack, though. He's a good coach. But he seems to operate totally outside the bounds of what school coaches are able to do in terms of the rules even though on race day he basically pretends he's the team coach.

Grant Fisher uses a private coach....just sayin'

Grant Fisher also doesn't run relays for his team during track season even when they have another 800 stud and could probably put together a state champ 4x8, just saying.

I'm what some would consider a good coach, I've won some state titles, we don't ever lose our conference. I have a long ways to go and I don't consider myself great by any means. That said if had an athlete that wished to be coached by a private running coach, I would say good luck to them but inform them that they would not be on my team. You just can't have that kind of attitude in your program. If it was a private coach for say lifting, agility or a PT to help them improve, then sure. But how can I as a coach make a well rounded plan for this athletes improvement that encompasses everything and then not know what else they may be doing with someone else.

Indoor? wrote:

Grant Fisher also doesn't run relays for his team during track season even when they have another 800 stud and could probably put together a state champ 4x8, just saying.

And we all know that the most important aspect of the development of our top high school runner right now is to win the State 4x800m title!

This only works in special circumstances:

1) the school does not have an event coach in the area; This could be distance, could be hurdles, usually something like the pole vault. Some small private schools may not even have a track program so they train with another school.

2) the original coach is fine with it. Lots of times a coach just wants the most success possible and will sign off on letting someone else coach the athlete; if there is an agreement, it's fine. Believe it or not, good coaches, even ones with big egos, will let kids outside their event area train with someone else.

3) There is a well ironed out plan and understanding: Like, at the state meet, this person may not be able to run only one race, or they do actually have to run the conference meet.

Some of the best athletes in the country were "privately" coached and this was done the right way with ZERO conflict.

Also-- many top programs in the NCAA like New Mexico, Florida State, Oklahoma State, and others have had foreign athletes use private coaches.

In a nutshell, if this is done the wrong way, it is a disaster. It's up to the coach in charge to make the decision and if they do a wishy washy job enforcing what they want, that's when problems arise. Either tell someone "no" or make it work.

I agree there are some dirtbag private coaches out there. I don't even like to call myself a private coach, but I have been called that and will give my thoughts.

1. I never approach athletes; anyone I have coached has come to me and asked for guidance.

2. I never work with an athlete unless they don't have a coach or their coach is okay with it (usually because they are just there for a stipend and DGAF).

3. I don't charge anything. My career is in the finance department of an energy company - coaching is just a passion.

4. I don't dictate which meets they run at but I do try to influence what races they run at track meets as that is an important part of their training and development.

I feel like many high school coaches hate private coaches. While some of that vitriol is warranted, I also think that there is a misplaced feeling of entitlement that you should get to coach any talented kid that is walking the halls of the high school you work at.

jay walter weatherman wrote:

Indoor? wrote:

Grant Fisher also doesn't run relays for his team during track season even when they have another 800 stud and could probably put together a state champ 4x8, just saying.

And we all know that the most important aspect of the development of our top high school runner right now is to win the State 4x800m title!

Say what you will, and maybe this flies in the face of development but as a human being in the good old USA, if I were in that situation, I'd take a small step back from my development, run 1 more 800 if it meant that 3 of my friends/classmates/teammates got to say they were state champs for the rest of their lives.

The energy department post was great, that's exactly what I do. If someone asks me to coach and it is cleared, I will do it.

The problem with Fisher has been festering for years in that program. If coach put his foot down or just opened the door, they would not have the problems they have today.

Well they don't seem to have any huge problems from the outside. He is doing well and no one can really blame him.

That school has won the state mile title 5 times in 11 years and have had the cross country champ what will be 3 times in the same span.

The best team? The one of the state xc champ in 2002, when Fisher's private coach wasn't there.

How did the entitlement offered by that school's private coach help the last kid who went to Georgetown?

cali blues wrote:

it's their prerogative to get private coaching, but it almost never works out as planned. there is a perceived added value with the private coach, but almost 100% of the time it's because they are being paid.

private coach and regular HS coach can both be excellent, but when they work independently the kids get screwed. there is a fairly high profile coach in socal that entices a fair amount of the best talent to work with him. he doesn't produce anybody, he simply works with the kids that are already the best. by association it makes him look like a genius. total hack that should stick to training adult boxers, but maybe he had to expand his market after the balco fiasco took away his secret weapon.

For those interested the mentioned "coach" is Darryl Hudson. It seems that Hudson wouldn't get cleared to work at a high school so he poaches athletes in the private sector. I totally agree that parents think that the more they pay the better their athlete will become but unfortunately this isn't true.

"Mosley said that when former strength and conditioning coach Darryl Hudson asked him to go with him to visit Victor Conte's Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative, he didn't want to go. But Hudson convinced him to take the trip, he said. Mosley, who testified on the matter in front of the BALCO grand jury"

This doesn't sound like an coach that I would want any of my athletes around.

Most of the best high schoolers in the Nashville area are coached by a private coach. That includes the Brentwood "program."