Men's Marathon updates and discussion - Berlin 2009

backwards wrote:

YESSSSSS!

National record! Sub 3!

I can't remember, did letsrun decide that sub 2:47 is SERIOUS RUNNER, or does running 2:47:XX qualify?

IS WANGCHUK A SERIOUS RUNNER???!?!?!?!?

NO.

no free press"elections" are a shamno property rightsNo freedom of associationNo freedom of religionyou have to wear the national costume when on the street - not a jokethey forcibly evicted 600k Nepalese in the early 90s. They had emigrated WWII through to the 70s. Why did they kick them out? they were not Bhutanese. How many were killed? Who knows. Some say 50k. Many activists still in jail.The place is absolute mind control - they didnt fear cable TV because it would "destroy" their culture. It would result in an informed populace.Bhutan is Saudi, with better PR.

genuinely interested wrote:

Please do

Off the Grid wrote:

I can rattle off a long list of things about Bhutan that are repugnant and offensive.

All this crap about "National Happiness" is right up there w/ North Korean type propaganda. The place is a sham.

What happened to Ed Torres? It looked like he was planning on running during the Flotrack interview.

Taking stock of Ethiopias performance.

Merga - not shocked that he stunk it up.. he tried to follow the advise of holding back.. but in the end the kenyans were much stronger.

Tsegaye Kebede- Not sure why he was having trouble hanging on to 2:06 pace! not just his day i guess.

Yemane Tsegaye- Nice new kid 2:08 today. 2:06 his PB is from 09 and 2:13 b4 that in 2008. Brand new ethiopian ringer.

Rest... SUCKED

Yirdaw.. did a commendable job finishing the race in 2:15

Don't be too hard on the Ethiopians. For not being much of a marathon power, they did really well to beat Japan and everyone else other than Kenya in the world cup standings. Few PBs and SBs in the top 10. 2 in the top 5 is great!

Dude, take it somewhere else, like Taiwan. This is about the marathon.

Off the Grid wrote:

no free press

"elections" are a sham

no property rights

LVD wrote:

Poor Jenkins -- he looks in a world of hurt. But it's nice to see that our guys just don't walk off the course when it's a bad day.

1247 Justin Young USA DNF

Is Geb in this race?

Tough race for America.

It was a lot better in 2007, that year the top guys skipped out just like this year, but Morgan and O'Brien from the Hansons held things together nicely. They had one ringer just in front of them, some guy named Simon Sawe I think.

The Hanson coaches take WC's seriously, realize it is important to represent one's country with dignity, and accordingly get a bunch of guys training together in order to ensure that at least a couple are really ready to go on championship day. That sounds like, gasp, an African country!

This year's team had the feel of something that was just 'thrown together.' ie, I doubt any of these guys two years ago were thinking that they'd end up representing the US in Berlin, in the marathon.

yyy wrote:

Merga is perfect of a guy who is setting WRs (15K) and running

fast in the spring marathons, but who fades at WC/OG. This is a clear indication of a guy who is doping.

I don't follow your logic. Explain.

I've heard rumours that he went missing fo two+ weeks in early spring and that there is an investigation going on.

more likely to be tested in Berlin than in road races.

It should of course be "a perfect example of a guy",

I should proofread by posts more carefully.

wak999 wrote:

Is Geb in this race?

Yes, but him and Wanjiru got into a fist fight and DNF

Ed Torres couldn't even be bothered to go to the starting line! Too busy partying up in Berlin? How long will this guy skate along with Reebok apparel charity due to having a twin bro who's earned a sponsorship? Is just making the team enough for Reebok to keep him in shoes?

the dude with the funny hat wrote:

Tough race for America.

It was a lot better in 2007, that year the top guys skipped out just like this year, but Morgan and O'Brien from the Hansons held things together nicely. They had one ringer just in front of them, some guy named Simon Sawe I think.

The Hanson coaches take WC's seriously, realize it is important to represent one's country with dignity, and accordingly get a bunch of guys training together in order to ensure that at least a couple are really ready to go on championship day. That sounds like, gasp, an African country!

This year's team had the feel of something that was just 'thrown together.' ie, I doubt any of these guys two years ago were thinking that they'd end up representing the US in Berlin, in the marathon.

Agreed, the other thing is that the Hansons had they been called upon this year would have done a great job again! I realize Sell has to go to New York, as do all the other big-shots with sub-2:11 PBs. But at Boston this year behind Sell the Hansons had a really solid group finishing at 2:17-2:20! That would have been worth 2:14-2:17 on this course. Not saying they would have done anything amazing, but there would have been at least one guy in the top 20 and 2nd/3rd would have been easily top 30.

The Hansons are as close as the USA can get to having a proper 'national team,' a group that trains together in a structured program with focused goals for both individuals and the group.

And can you imagine if we actually got our top national guys training in that kind of program? Again, like an African nation!

People talk about:

-genetics

-wanting to escape a life of poverty

-running 20k to school and back as a child

Obviously we can't change any of these things.

But what if we just get our guys training in groups? Is that really so hard to do? How stupid are we?

The Hansons have shown how to do that, but the problem is they are doing it with guys who are untalented even for Americans. I am not in the 'Sell has no talent' camp. That guy has talent. But after him that team is a bunch of 30:00 10k runners. Can you imagine if we got the 27:22-27:50 guys into that kind of system? I mean, props to Salazar and Schumacher, those guys are doing everything they can. But the concept of depth is totally missing from their strategies to develop American distance running.

Nate Jenkins is an example that all the work in the world won't make you competitive on a world stage. This "anybody can do it with work" mentally in the US system creates teams like we had today. We need to create interest young and only select the best. 2:11+ is worth nothing. These guys are hobby runners.

Is it my understanding that the US team was selected from a race in November 2007?????

What kind of bullcrap is that????

Shouldn't there have been some kind of fitness trial before leaving US shores?

Even if it was over 10 miles....they could have extrapolated the Portugese tables...or better yet - the McMillan table.

Is USA LDR (and Glenn Latimer) pissing away my membership $$$$ by sending a team that is not championship ready???

Some guys (especially Dan Browne) ran decent/respectable...but we all knew Nate Jenkins, Cabada, and Ed Torres were not even close to 2:15 shape.

Why send a team, just to field a team.

USA T&F - more money than God????

How say u?

PS. Don't give me that championship experience bullcrap.

US runners get more opportunites (NY, Boston, Chicago to name a few) to get that elite level experience than say a Madagascan.

OH, SO YOU WANT TO SOCIALIZE DISTANCE TRAINING?!?!? OKAY, COACH HITLER!!!

Just a reminder that Hanson runners Mike Morgan ran 2:23:28 and Kyle O'Brien ran 2:28:28 at Worlds in 2007 - both times were slower than Browne (2:16:49) and Gabrielson (2:18:41) today.