Caster Semenya update

I never thought that people can be so naive. That Caster has not competed in Europe and therefore SHE does not deserve to win a gold medal is just appalling, it is just an indication that Europe is not a power house when it comes to athletics. Africans will still dominate athletics for the next century whether labeled MALE and/or FEMALE. The current 800m record holder Jarmila Kratochvilova who is a European is a MALE by my observation. Love HER or hate HER, Caster is our champion and we are proud of HER.

You mean proud of HIM. Clearly a man. Did you watch the interviews? Don't be lame.

Mantake wrote:

I never thought that people can be so naive...Love HER or hate HER, Caster is our champion and we are proud of HER.

I'm not sure what people are being naive about. That anyone is playing the race card in this situation is just as ridiculous to me.Maybe Europe could return to being a powerhouse if they return to letting some partial men compete in the women's races

Mantake wrote:

I never thought that people can be so naive. That Caster has not competed in Europe and therefore SHE does not deserve to win a gold medal is just appalling, it is just an indication that Europe is not a power house when it comes to athletics. Africans will still dominate athletics for the next century whether labeled MALE and/or FEMALE. The current 800m record holder Jarmila Kratochvilova who is a European is a MALE by my observation. Love HER or hate HER, Caster is our champion and we are proud of HER.

This is a long but extremely interesting article concerning the new wave of PED's and gender issues in sports.

http://dir.salon.com/story/news/sports/2002/03/21/genes/index.html

Like Jarmila Kratochvilova

what part of 'return' didn't you understand

Yah wrote:

Like Jarmila Kratochvilova

why doesn't bekele sign up for the women's 5000m in the next olympics, when he stomps the field and sets a new wr by nearly 2 minutes - people will demand a gender testwill people claim racism again?come on

Mantake wrote:

I never thought that people can be so naive. That Caster has not competed in Europe and therefore SHE does not deserve to win a gold medal is just appalling, it is just an indication that Europe is not a power house when it comes to athletics. Africans will still dominate athletics for the next century whether labeled MALE and/or FEMALE. The current 800m record holder Jarmila Kratochvilova who is a European is a MALE by my observation. Love HER or hate HER, Caster is our champion and we are proud of HER.

prettywoman wrote:

The world record holder is essentially a man as well due to the crazy amount of steroids the Germans were using at that time. I'm sure she had facial hair and a deep voice as well.

Which German was that?

wineturtle wrote:

I can see a prudish white RSA track official with no medical training tasked with the distasteful job of viewing the genitalia of a black taking a perfunctory glance at some thing like this and saying female.

Except that a visual inspection as a means of a sex test has long ago ceased to be used.

If not from visual observations, then on what basis is the IAAF going to initiate a gender test? If it's sudden improvement in times, then I think Semenya has cleared that hurdle. However, there isn't a defined formula to prove the latter, so what's left? Failed drug tests?

victor victoria wrote:

If not from visual observations, then on what basis is the IAAF going to initiate a gender test?

Since I presume you read the document previously linked, I'm surprised you didn't pick up on section B, item 2:

"2. The gender issue is likely to arise as a result of:

a. ‘challenge’ by another athlete or team as brought forward to authorities at an athletic event, including the President of the meet, technical delegate, medical delegate;

b. ‘suspicion’ raised as to an athletes’ gender as witnessed during an antidoping control specimen collection;

c. an approach made to the IAAF/regional AAA or National federation by an athlete or his representative for advice and clarification."

But what you are asking about is what would initiate the gender test, not what the gender test would actual comprise, as suggested by the previous poster who seemed to think a quick look at the 'naughty bits' is currently the way it is done.

Mypoint-

Mentions all over internet of RSA officials,

parents&kin, schoolmasters, friends etc saying we looked and are satisfied she is a she. Mentions of detailed medical proof are not present. The quotes of verification by RSA officials sound,IMO, more like observations or conclusions by folks with no expertise in complex gender assignment cases and not about a series of involved medical tests by a panel of experts- as is now required.

Which is why the IAAF is involving these medical experts and not going by the assertions of these non-expert folks! Duh!

(And where has it ever been legitimately suggested Caster has undergone gender re-assignment? People seem to make up all kinds of scenarios.)

Dang... it just isn't the Blacks that get tested...

http://www.akawilliam.com/tennis-player-sarah-gronert-passes-gender-test/

runamile wrote:

Which is why the IAAF is involving these medical experts and not going by the assertions of these non-expert folks! Duh!

(And where has it ever been legitimately suggested Caster has undergone gender re-assignment? People seem to make up all kinds of scenarios.)

I have made no such comment, reading my posts on this and other sites you will find I never ventured an opinion on Semenyas gender and certainly no mention of surgically duplicitous actions on her part.

Plus suggesting I am unaware of or have not read IAAF rules and policies on this or any issue I comment on is pure folly.

Duh!

This is not a race issue. I am a black man, and yes I said that. One ignorant person does not speak for all. Goodness

That's my point. 2 a. and c. speak of a challenge or approach by an athlete, etc. What are they going to base their challenge on BUT their visual observations of the athlete (in Semenya's case, she has male characteristics) or the athlete in question's sudden improvement. Challenges HAVE been made on these observations, and many people are saying Semenya's rights have been violated because of it.

Victor Victoria wrote:

That's my point. 2 a. and c. speak of a challenge or approach by an athlete, etc.

Not disagreeing.

If you'll look above, the poster previous stated:

"I can see a prudish white RSA track official with no medical training tasked with the distasteful job of viewing the genitalia of a black taking a perfunctory glance at some thing like this and saying female."

He seems to think that the visual inspection is what constitutes the sex test, not, as you are saying, the initial question raising that starts the whole process.

Mantake wrote:

I never thought that people can be so naive.

Love HER or hate HER, Caster is our champion and we are proud of HER.

Speaking of naive.

I find it interesting when people are so delusional and wanting of a champion that they will cling to someone no matter how ridiculous the situation. It reminds me of the Greeks in Athens how they were jeering because Kenteris and Thanou weren't competing. As though they weren't blatant drug cheats. It would be like Germans proudly looking to Marita Koch as a symbol of their athletic success. Of course, I'm sure there are some in Germany who do feel that way. Just like those in the US who believe FloJo's records are legit. But the scale of the self-delusion in S. Africa regarding Semenya seems to be on another level.

And the idea that race is a big driver is ridiculous. What continent are all those Kenyans and Ethiopians from? There hasn't been a big backlash against their performances, even though they have left the Europeans similarily in the dust.