Daniels Marathon Plan work for slower runners?

In his marathon chapter Daniels writes about this: long runs should be measured in time. If you are a slow runner, then shooting for the magic 20 miles in long runs can take 3 hours or more, and that is just too much. That will be a disproportionate amount of the weekly mileage and it will take too long to recover and the injury risk will increase. Few elite runners do 3 hour long runs.

Yes it works fine for me. I used this book for everything so far as a relative newbie and late starter (48-started running competitively 3 years ago).

I started with 5k training and ran for 9 months with shorter races then did the full 6 month cycle of "Plan A". I started off around 40 mpw and used 70 mpw for peak mileage but only hit that twice as I was sick one week.

Remember the peak mileage is called for just 3 times and the rest are 70-90% of that (50-63).

My typical long run was 18 miles but the long TLT run would hit 20-21 and the M pace run is 19 (2up- 15 @ MP -2 down). Some weeks did exceed the 25% rule and some of the TLT runs were 2:45. I just made sure I went very easy a few days before and after those taxing runs.

My 5k pr was 20:42 and 10k was 44:38 (soft winter pr). I went out very easy (8:21 1st mile) in the marathon, settled in to 7:30-35 pace, then faded a bit late to finish in 3:21.

Since then I've run 3:16, 3:15 and 3:14.

In retrospect, I probably ran too hard in the first cycle by using my 5k pr for my vdot and would suggest using a vdot -2 from your 5-10k times.

You will be fine with a 17 mile long run.

See the following Hanson's plan which (for beginners) has a maximum of 16 mile long runs and the attached article "Smashing the Myth of the 20 Miler":

http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=4447&PageNum=1

Not running >3:00 will allow you more MPW, more consistency, and better recovery, which is much better than running a overly long workout which will really only deplete you after the 3:00 mark.

I use Benji Durden's idea for long runs: work up to a long run which is 30 minutes short of you goal race time.

i.e., a 4-hour run if your goal is 4:30 in the marathon. Run some shorter races during training to get an idea of your potential marathon time.

The Utabomber wrote:

I use Benji Durden's idea for long runs: work up to a long run which is 30 minutes short of you goal race time.

i.e., a 4-hour run if your goal is 4:30 in the marathon. Run some shorter races during training to get an idea of your potential marathon time.

Have any sub-2:30 guys had success with this philosophy (aside, obviously, from Benji himself)? I am shooting for a 2:25 marathon debut this fall but I really don't think I respond well to training runs longer than 2 hours.

I am around 14:50/31:00 level for 5k/10k and I also can easily run 90-120 mpw. 90 mile weeks feel like nothing, and even on the 120 mile weeks I get tired from the quality days more than the sheer volume. ie, lots of mileage spread over the week is no problem, but man if I run more than 2 hours and the pace is at all reasonable then I feel the effects for days and in some ways even weeks afterwards.

How should I prepare my body for the stresses of 26.2 miles?

The Utabomber wrote:

I use Benji Durden's idea for long runs: work up to a long run which is 30 minutes short of you goal race time.

i.e., a 4-hour run if your goal is 4:30 in the marathon. Run some shorter races during training to get an idea of your potential marathon time.

Benji said he did runs of 2:30-3:00 at 6:40 pace and his plan calls for 3:00 + adjustment (up to 30 minutes for 44+ min 10K runners).

Thanks so much. I really appreciate the responses.

Kevin52 wrote:

I just made sure I went very easy a few days before and after those taxing runs.

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great advice for anybody I think....if you are gonna bust your ass in a workout, rest up *before* as well as after. The mental challenge of succeding (15 @ MP is a LOT of work) can be daunting. But if you succeed in one of these workouts, the confidence is worth it.

Not for me. I find that if I'm too rested for long runs and hard workouts, I am more likely to hammer them and need more recovery than if I do them in a slightly tired state. Makes it more like the real marathon too.

Off the Grid wrote:

Kevin52 wrote:

I just made sure I went very easy a few days before and after those taxing runs.

.

great advice for anybody I think....if you are gonna bust your ass in a workout, rest up *before* as well as after. The mental challenge of succeding (15 @ MP is a LOT of work) can be daunting. But if you succeed in one of these workouts, the confidence is worth it.