Old School wrote:
You've all missed the point---it was never about times with Pre. I ran with him, watched most of his races---it was all about heart, toughness, dogged determination, the ability to go into a place of pain you and I will never know. There is no question with the advancements since 75, that Pre would rule. No question.
RunninFreak wrote:Sure Kennedy has a faster time then Pre but with advancements in track and field, along with physiology being diferent now, does Pre even stand a chance against Kennedy does Pre's 13:21 stand up to a sub 13 minute performance 25+ years later???
May be a dumb question but I was curious what other people thought.
I think this is a good fun debate. So I'll add some stats to liven it up:
When Pre died, the 5,000 record was (I believe) Puttemans 13:13. Pre's best was 13:21 or 13:22 (I forget which was "offical"). Thus Pre was eight or nine seconds behind the best ever time when he died.
Kennedy in his prime ran 12:58 with the world record going from 12:45 (or so) down to an eventual 12:39. Thus Kennedy at best was at least 13 seconds behind the record and now remains 19 seconds in arrears.
This stat is just to show how each measured up against the world records of their respective time period. Very difficult to compare beyond this, as far as times, since everything is relative to the environment (tracks, shoes, etc.).
This may open up a whole new debate about drug-aided marks, but that is fine. Possible drug use is always part of it.
As far as what Pre could/might have run, consider this: Pre's last race was a 13:23 in May. During the months before that, he had gone to Colorado for a few weeks to train at altitude (with Shorter) for the first time in his life. Upon returning to sea-level, he felt lethargic in a few tune-up races (plus the stress of handling the Finnish tour). But then he goes out and runs less than two seconds off his best ever, with lots of opportunities for world-class competition/chances to run fast still to come that summer.
Track & Field News headline while covering Pre's European campaign of 1974: "Pree Running Like Hell, But Not Winning Anything."
In 1974, Pre ran several American records while losing races in Europe. In 1975, Shorter (and others) convinced him he needed to get away from Eugene--and the temptation to run too fast too early--and instead train like the Europeans in order to beat the Europeans, namely, extending his training period and using altitude. In other words, like Shorter always says, find out what the people who are winning are doing and do that in your own situation. Viren did altitude training and beat Pre. So Pre does altitude training...?
Pre had run fast, was going to run even faster, and--for the first time in his career--was doing everything right, as far as what it took to match and maybe beat the Europeans. This is not an emotional call on my part, just logic: in 1974, Pre did this in training, he started the season here timewise and ended up there. In 1975, he did even better training and started at a higher point. Where would he have ended up? Barring illness and injury, that 13:23 was the tip of the iceberg for that season. THAT'S one of the real tragedies.