For everyone playing the blame game on who's fault this is. It's the coaching staff. I ran for PSU last fall and a couple races in indoor and they knew there were issues with numbers, they even had football players run meets, they had injured guys jog random events, and last year they put everyone in a 60m just so they had another countable meet. The talent the school has been able to lure through grad transfers has allowed people who don't deserve their jobs to keep them.
This is really sad to hear that this happened to two different individuals this season. Really unfortunate. NCAA should allow them to compete (or maybe compete unatttached). With all the stupid exceptions we make for people clearly manipulating the system (e.g., national doping programs) there's no reason these individuals shouldn't be granted some leeway here.
it's always amazed me Portland State even bothers to have any sports programs. i went to a Big Sky school and visited every campus and Portland State doesn't even feel like a college.
Its basically one big commuter school, bunch of 40-somethings getting specialty degrees. and one of the smallest and most lethargic student bodies ever, bunch of rich lazy stoners who couldn't get into Oregon.
i bet if they shut down the entire sports department nobody would even notice.
What's crazy is I see POrtland State competed at over 20 meets this year. Who in the hell even noticed they didtn't have 14 people and decided to call them out on it. Someone with an axe to grind or do you have to submit a form or something.
But this is a joke. The NCAA SHOULD NOT punish the athlete. The athlete qualified for NCAAs. Let him go. Period.
I love how you arbitrarily decide what rules need to be strictly followed and what ones to just over look. Whatever makes for a good fake RoJoke Rant.
Now how does a college track team not compete 14 athletes in enough meets?
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
What's crazy is I see POrtland State competed at over 20 meets this year. Who in the hell even noticed they didtn't have 14 people and decided to call them out on it. Someone with an axe to grind or do you have to submit a form or something.
But this is a joke. The NCAA SHOULD NOT punish the athlete. The athlete qualified for NCAAs. Let him go. Period.
You should already know this, but this is one of the biggest things that coaches need to keep track of during the season. The easiest rule to follow. You put a couple of guys from campus into some events just to get a mark and it's a done deal. I see colleges do this all the time and that's why you see someone with a 10 foot shot put or something.
What's crazy is I see POrtland State competed at over 20 meets this year. Who in the hell even noticed they didtn't have 14 people and decided to call them out on it. Someone with an axe to grind or do you have to submit a form or something.
But this is a joke. The NCAA SHOULD NOT punish the athlete. The athlete qualified for NCAAs. Let him go. Period.
You should already know this, but this is one of the biggest things that coaches need to keep track of during the season. The easiest rule to follow. You put a couple of guys from campus into some events just to get a mark and it's a done deal. I see colleges do this all the time and that's why you see someone with a 10 foot shot put or something.
Do schools really not have 20 guys on the track team? You really can't find a couple of 50s 400 guys from HS who want to keep training? Of 4:30 milers?
feel horrible for the poor kid. wish the NCAA would reconsider but if they do it sets a dangerous precedent.
a dangerous precedent to...get rid of stupid rules? or rewrite rules so athletes aren't punished for things that arent their mistake?
Neither; both of these would be great options. But waiving the rule in this instance, unless they're going to flat out change it immediately, means that every coach could consider violating the rule going forward if their athlete was going to plead for mercy at the end of the season.
Track is seeming less a less of a team sport. Few duals are held. To get marks, a few athletes are being sent to a meet that caters to their event. In other meets, to keep within their budget only 15 or 16 athletes are sent. Athletes are being held out to continue training. It doesn't feel like college track when athletes show up only for the conference meet and NCAAs. I am glad that the minimum rule exists and would like to see the number increased from a minimum of 14 for the good of the sport.
When schools change divisions, athletes aren't able to compete at NCAAs. While I feel for the athletes affected in the cases of too few meets, I would rather see athletes being able to compete in the higher division when their schools move up.
feel horrible for the poor kid. wish the NCAA would reconsider but if they do it sets a dangerous precedent.
a dangerous precedent to...get rid of stupid rules? or rewrite rules so athletes aren't punished for things that arent their mistake?
If they got rid of this rule it would HURT collegiate track and field. We would see a ton of track teams have only have 12 athletes per gender and only go to 4 meets per year because they can save a ton of money.
It would result in less opportunities for athletes. Less scholarships too, because it would incentivize some teams to focus on one event group instead of fielding a full track team.
Having gone through agony on this very subject (getting enough women, in our case, to enough meets) this year, I empathize strongly.
We had enough individuals crap out on us that we had to locate not one but two additional last-minute meets--one of them after Conference. Not fun, but that's the coach's and compliance officer's job.
I emphasize the compliance officer because this is exactly one of the things that s/he is supposed to be tracking--granted that the coach has the ultimate responsibility.
You're a bad coach if you're breaking that many athletes. Retire bro
They could have easily figured this out, especially with U Portland across the river that has been holding indoor meets!
This has been a rule FOREVER. Iona, Portland, Santa Clara, always find a way to get this done.
Please follow this link below the the great Lenny Korir’s tfrrs. You’ll notice the dude threw SHOT PUT at an indoor meet to help his team hit the requirement.
We had a similar issue happen with my school's Women's team back in the late 80s. The letter of the law stated you needed X athletes compete in Y meets (I don't remember the exact numbers). Given the variable talent levels of the women on the team, our coach split the team up and sent them to 2 separate meets on the same day (with appropriate competition for each group). Technically, we didn't meet the requirements since the individual meets had less than the X required athletes. But the spirit of the law wasn't violated since we had over X women if you added both meets held at the same time in different locations.
The initial outcome was that ALL sports were banned from post-season play for 1 year. No conference, no IC4A, no NCAA. My school appealed this decision which was rescinded but only after ALL sports lost their Fall post-season opportunities. The success of the appeal was the fact that the spirit of the law had not been violated.
It’s been a long time since I coached, but that form isn’t due to your conference until the end of the season. technically the season doesn’t end until after the NCAAs as some schools the NCAA Regional or Nationals is a countable meet. You can also count a meet as more than one meet by doing a “Double Dual”. Since that forms isn’t due yet for the year, it’s not outside the rules for them to go back to one of the non-scores meets that they had 14 competitors and contact two other schools and agree to score two duals and that is now 2 countable meets. Again, it’s been a long time but this is simply using the rules that are in place to your benefit. When I first started at Toledo we only had 15 women or so on the team so we had to be creative within the rules. Also, if a runner DNF or FS or Fouls out, they count. Not sure if they can find that. There’s still time to appeal this. Looks like one of the meets they had 13 athletes. Could potentially appeal that meet if someone was entered but didn’t compete due to illness/injury. I definitely would exhaust all options as there’s still a week.
The NCAA changed a lot of these rules since you were fired. Double duals are no longer allowed.