a high schooler ran 6x800 @2:24, 2:22, 2:22, 2:22, 2:20, 2:20 w/3 minutes rest

Tough to say without any other context as it's presented it's just numbers on a page/screen but I would expect a kid who could do this workout to be anywhere from 9:25 to 9:35.

If they are not able to run under 9:40 I would suggest that they just have race day issues and are not racing to a level that their fitness would suggest they are capable of.

credible source wrote:

high school xc coach wrote:

this is interesting. i have had several 10:00 minute type kids who struggle to go 6x8 in 2:35-2:40. It blows my mind, but I see it over and over again.

Granted, training weather is almost never good where I'm at.

Lots of kids are also either lazy and/or just unwilling to grind in practice. Heck I was like that.

I have never had a lazy or soft 10 minute runner

meh meh meh wrote:

high school xc coach wrote:

this is interesting. i have had several 10:00 minute type kids who struggle to go 6x8 in 2:35-2:40. It blows my mind, but I see it over and over again.

Granted, training weather is almost never good where I'm at.

This doesn't blow my mind even a little. 10 minutes in a race is with spikes, adrenaline, and probably being well rested. Put that same guy on the track for a workout in trainers 3 days after that 10:00 race, and I'm sure 10:20 pace feels no different effort-wise. So now you're asking them to run 6x800 at 2-mile race effort that day. That's just hard running.

ya. I had a kid run 5x800 in 238 to 242 with equal rest during cross. I think he actually slipped to 245 by the end. he ran 1635 for 3 miles the next week. slightly faster than 5k pace is what I have mostly always observed in a workout like this.

and we have guys in this thread thinking 6x8 with 3 mins rest basically gives a 1600 estimate? that is insane! it is extremely difficult to run 3x8 at mile pace

I work in a district with class sizes of 60, so I am lucky to have one kid at a time who can run this fast. it's a really small sample size compared to large school programs. reading stuff like this to learn what everybody else is seeing out there is very interesting and informative

meh meh meh wrote:

Depends if the kid is speedy or not.

For what it's worth I ran 50, 1:53, 4:16, 9:30, and 15:25 5k but never ran a set of 6x800 this fast. Yeah I'm sure if I ran it at race effort I could get there, but I ran my workouts in trainers with an appropriate effort level so no, I never averaged 2:21 for a set of 6x8.

So for me this would have demonstrated pr fitness and we'd be talking 4:15 mile or better since this would be great strength for me, and I'm naturally speedy.

I was about as fit as you, similar MD PRs with good speed. I probably could have run that session and it would have been nearly all out. If this kid's got any sort of wheels, he could be in shape to run a fast 1600.

Few weeks ago I run similar paces.

But 8 times with 90s rest.

What I can expect in 1500m race?

She sounds talented.

Without knowing what the kid has been doing for past 4-6 weeks, who knows? One workout doesn't tell you anything except what the kid ran that for that workout. Predicting race times off workouts isn't productive and predicted times are often overestimated. It may indicate the kid is in 'x' type fitness, but 'racing' is different than 'workout' because every meet isn't a time trial and there is no rest. An athlete may be in phenomenal shape but never get in a race to show it. Plus, what was the purpose of this workout? Where did it fall in the week, and how hard were the 2-3 days before the workout? What are the next 2-3 days looking like? How did the athlete recover? (Most important part.) What's the goal of the athlete? Are you trying to peak athlete for something 8-10days out? What energy systems were you trying to develop? Would the workout be less or more 'impressive' or 'effective' by slowing them down 3-5sec but cutting rest by 30sec? Just some thought questions to illustrate that it's near impossible to predict 'x' time off 'y' workout without considering multiple factors. When the kid actually races, whether it's 8:37 or 10:08, etc., even that doesn't prove fitness...it only proves they ran that on that day.

10 flat

I did 6x800 2:15 to 2.20 ran 4:08 for 1500 and 9:39 for 3200. Just depends if he can hold that pace. I say 9:50 to 10:10

Well it does tell you something. You are being way too extreme to say that it tells you nothing. We obviously know the guy isn't going to run 12 minutes for 3200 or 5:30 for a 1600. And unless he was jogging, he isn't going to run 8:40 or 4:00. It absolutely gives us a range of what he is going to run. 90% of high school guys couldn't do the workout.

Adding another data point - I did 6x800 in 2:18, 2:18, 2:17, 2:16, 2:17, 2:15 with 2:30 rest in trainers in high school. I was probably in 9:10ish shape for 3200 at that point - I ran 9:20 winning a tactical race a week before the workout and ran 9:03 two weeks later in a fast race.

They ran about 5 seconds slower per rep with more rest so I'd say 9:30ish.

high school xc coach wrote:

Ghost1 wrote:

Race expectations:

1600 - 4:30 -4:35

3200 - 9:40 - 9:50

high school kids with the strength to run a workout like that will typically run much faster than these times.

High school kids tend to be workout heroes and better at the shorter stuff. 3min is a lot of rest.

Bazil1600 wrote:

what can i expect him to run in the 1600m or 3200m

1600: 4:25 - 4:40

3200: 9:20 - 10:20

Hard to say because 3 minutes is a lot of rest, and you didn't say how that last 800 felt to him, but 5x800 is still a tough workout. I'd guess he could hold the 2:24 pace per 800 for a full 3200, but probably not the 2:20 pace at this moment.

I ran workouts like that in college, maybe going up to 10 reps and was a 4:00-4:05 mile guy. Problem here is we look at a single workout in isolation with little context. My workouts were never flashy. Never ran sub 60 quarters. Never hammered 5:00 minute pace tempos. Lot of people crush workouts and bomb races.

4:36, 9:54

In HS I did these two workouts which are similar

4x800 avg 2:26 with 400 jog (1:50-2 min)

4x1000 avg 2:58 rest unknown, maybe 3-4 min

The workout the guy did is a bit more volume and at a slightly faster pace than my workouts

I would guess they can run 4:28-33 and 9:35-50

Going to agree with this, although curious to know what how difficult this was for the runner? Any recent pr’s from this runner for context?

I think high 9s is too slow. It's not a super predictive workout, the rest complicates it, but I think 9:30-9:45 is a good range. Wider range, maybe 9:20-9:55. Good workout