GPS data from runner who died in the Bay area indicates possible heat stroke

dipsey wrote:

running keeper wrote:

Why is sub 6 min mile suicide pace? Isn't that just like a jog for a Kenyan? About the zig zag, are you sure he wasn't just running in circles to get to that whole number mark, like getting to 8km instead of 7.84 km? I do that a lot of time just to get to that whole number!

He was not a Kenyan or a professional runner. So yes, a 6 minute mile pace on a hilly trail in temps approaching 100 is really fast for the average runner. He was supposed to meet family so maybe he just wanted to get in the miles quickly so he wouldn't be late. We will never know.

Did anyone mention if he was carrying water? If not, that should be a lesson for anyone on a hot run.

He did not. But the list of things we can learn is a lot longer than that, when it comes to running in the heat. There are plenty of articles you can google with a lot of similar advice, like these ones (below). Added onto that is the additional advice of what to do if you are going to run alone on trails - leave a route plan, stick to it, bring a phone, etc. Maybe that is all anyone can hope to gain from this is that it is a reminder to people of how dangerous the heat can be and how important it is to take precautions.

Shout out to everyone here (not singling out anyone in particular) to show a little compassion, hard as that might be for LRers.

Although I obviously wasn't there and don't know a lot more than anyone else, I have run in that park several times despite not living anywhere near it (re: on random business trips). Oddly enough the last time being June of this year on a some very hot days as well. I've pulled up the park maps online to try to match up these new details with my experiences. It looks like he entered from the north, but the exact trailhead is unclear to me from the story. Pretty sure I did that once too, but I had to run hilly "neighborhood" streets to do so and can't really remember much about it (from several years ago), other than it being a bit confusing since I hadn't used an obvious trailhead. Regardless, this park is hilly to the extent that running a specified pace is not really a thing = you don't set out to run 6 min miles, or any min miles per se. You're generally either running up (slow) or down (fast), with occasional but relatively short flat stretches. Think fartlek if you will. Anyway, my guess would be the reporting here is sensationalizing a bit by including the sub-6 reference as it would easy enough to hit those speeds on downhills if you're already a decently accomplished runner, which obviously he was. In no way is that meant to demean his running prowess or anything else, just trying to paint a picture of the general topography and style in which you would run it. Sadly he must have been going too hard for the conditions regardless.

Anyway, RIP Philip.

running keeper wrote:

Why is sub 6 min mile suicide pace? Isn't that just like a jog for a Kenyan?

Kenyans also like to be on the trail by 6 am when it's cool and not 106 degrees.

running keeper wrote:

Why is sub 6 min mile suicide pace? Isn't that just like a jog for a Kenyan? About the zig zag, are you sure he wasn't just running in circles to get to that whole number mark, like getting to 8km instead of 7.84 km? I do that a lot of time just to get to that whole number!

You’re being obtuse. It’s sub 6 when it’s over 100 degrees in direct sun. The women were barely doing that in Doha when it was 15 degrees cooler and no sun.

Lionel Sanders did it, and posted a video of it on YT with a tag #nolimits.

I dont know anything but I want to contribute wrote:

Has anyone creeped his GPS history to see if the paces seem consistent with past performances? Maybe he was being chased by the cougar from a few months ago.

We already did in the first thread when he went missing. His runs are still on Strava, and he was a legit stud. He frequently ran 6 minute mile pace or faster gradient adjusted pace (GAP) for seemingly normal training runs on hilly trails. He has a 10 page list of Strava KOMs/CRs, many of them on very competitive segments.

I've run in 106deg heat before.

Take water, throw pace goals out the window, consider your route carefully (make sure you are on a well trafficked route, etc).

When it's that hot, it does take 20-30 minutes before your body really heats up and you feel it. You feel fine for a while and then all of a sudden you feel wayyy off.

This guy is a nutcase for doing that kind of pace in that temp. He must've had no clue what he'd experience in that kind of heat.

Social Media Hater wrote:

The article is paywalled for me, so I cannot read. Is this the same runner who had another thread about his disappearance?

Yes. It's the same runner - Philip Kreycik. Should I combine the two threads?

Here is the original thread.

Don't know how many of us on here have experienced heat stroke, but to give you a first person account of how it goes, here you go.

Ran a 4th of July 10K road race in he 80's during a big midwest heat wave with extreme high humidity/dew point. At the time, I was a novice (i.e. stupid) at hydration, and didn't drink much at all ahead of time...trying to avoid side stitches, having to go to the bathroom, etc...

Went out hard from the beginning with no adjustment in pace for the heat/humidity. Most of the course was in full sun. No water on the course that I recall, though there may have been and I didn't want to slow down to take it (i.e. yes, I was very inexperienced/stupid/naive, as I said). I was definitely very hot, but thought I could "push through it". Approaching 5mi, I could see ahead that the 3rd place runner had stopped and walked to ask a spectator if they had water. I saw this as an opportunity to move up a spot and surged to catch/pass him. From that point on, I have no memory of the race.

Apparently I ran by my Dad at 5mi and looked okay. I completed a long loop that took me toward the finish line. Couple hundred yards away, my family saw me weaving back and forth erratically, stumbling, slowing as I approached the finish line. 30yds from the finish I stumbled off the side of the road and face planted in the sand (finish was at the beach). Convulsed/seizures/etc..eyes rolling in the back of my head...yup, all the classic signs.

The emergency medical vehicle was trailing the race, so no emergency personnel were around near the finish. Fortunately, a high school friend who had won the race rushed over to me and found some ice to put under the back of my neck and on my body, and poured cold water on me. They threw me in the back of a volunteer's statin wagon and rushed me to the hospital emergency. I briefly regained consciousness, which is my only memory between the 5mi point of the race and when I later woke up on the table inthe emergency room.

They got me in and immediately gave me an IV of electrolyte type solution. They recorded my body temp at 106 degrees. The doctor said he pumped a gallon into me, but my body was still overcompensating and sweating it out until my body temps cooled down closer to normal. Many strange things happened (including an "out-of-body type experience", among other things), but eventually I regained consciousness.

My point of telling this account it that I most certainly would have died had I not been attended to. Probably no coincidence that it was around 5mi (and just under 30min I think) when I was confused and have no memory at that point. Things just systematically shut down past a certain body temperature, and there is very little you can do to reverse the damage unless you get help from someone. He most certainly crossed that line.

fisky wrote:

Social Media Hater wrote:

The article is paywalled for me, so I cannot read. Is this the same runner who had another thread about his disappearance?

I removed my ad-block and reloaded the page twice. And then rapidly scrolled to the bottom of the page. After that, it stayed open.

Basically it said sub-6 pace for 30 minutes. Then slowing to 1.2mph zig-zagging and walking in circles. Then he stopped moving under the tree. No HR data. Just GPS, pace, and time.

Sub 6 pace in 100 degree weather in the sun when the bulk of your running is in much cooler weather, in an isolated area that you are not familiar with. This sounds like a recipe for disaster.

That's a hell of a story, CrossFan. Glad you came out of it okay and (I hope) a little wiser.

running keeper wrote:

Why is sub 6 min mile suicide pace? Isn't that just like a jog for a Kenyan? About the zig zag, are you sure he wasn't just running in circles to get to that whole number mark, like getting to 8km instead of 7.84 km? I do that a lot of time just to get to that whole number!

The pace was suicide pace due to the heat and the terrain. I hit those paces regularly, but would never attempt them in that kind of temperature, and especially not on a trail.

Webbster wrote:

fisky wrote:

I removed my ad-block and reloaded the page twice. And then rapidly scrolled to the bottom of the page. After that, it stayed open.

Basically it said sub-6 pace for 30 minutes. Then slowing to 1.2mph zig-zagging and walking in circles. Then he stopped moving under the tree. No HR data. Just GPS, pace, and time.

Sub 6 pace in 100 degree weather in the sun when the bulk of your running is in much cooler weather, in an isolated area that you are not familiar with. This sounds like a recipe for disaster.

And to increase the chances of a bad outcome, don't take a phone, don't take water, and run a different route than the one you had planned or told people you were running. Seeing pictures of him with this family was heartbreaking. There is no workout that is worth risking your health. Please use common sense and take precautions out there.

Maybe a stupid question here:

If there was GPS data on this guys run, wouldn’t that be somewhere in the database of the company that sold him the GPS device?

Couldn’t someone have gone to this company, explained that Philip was missing, and then they could have pulled this data so that he could have been found sooner than a month later?

Maybe that data is “just with the watch” until a save/export button is hit?, which is perhaps what somebody did when they found him.

If he clicked the “save” button before passing out, would that have helped the search?

If I was ever, God forbid, in a situation like this, I always thought my GPS watch would assist in people in finding me.

What am I missing here?

The K wrote:

Maybe a stupid question here:

If there was GPS data on this guys run, wouldn’t that be somewhere in the database of the company that sold him the GPS device?

Couldn’t someone have gone to this company, explained that Philip was missing, and then they could have pulled this data so that he could have been found sooner than a month later?

Maybe that data is “just with the watch” until a save/export button is hit?, which is perhaps what somebody did when they found him.

If he clicked the “save” button before passing out, would that have helped the search?

If I was ever, God forbid, in a situation like this, I always thought my GPS watch would assist in people in finding me.

What am I missing here?

There are smartwatches and other devices that connect to cell towers or satellites with paid plans like a phone. But most GPS watches are, as you say, "just with the watch" until it connects to a phone or computer using a cable or radio (Bluetooth, ANT+...).

Thank you