CDC: Myocarditis is 27 to 219 times more common in males Cole Hocker's age post-vaccination than expected

Harambe wrote:

well actually wrote:

Except you have to multiply that by the percent chance of actually getting covid. Then multiply that by the percent of the 21 were not overweight and were perfectly healthy before getting covid. That ends up being a small number.

% chance of getting COVID is near 1 with the Delta variant.

Already 35-40% of America has gotten the disease. Not unreasonable to expect the rest to get it in the next year or two.

I saw a stat that 70% of teens hospitalized with COVID had a pre-exisiting conditions. Divide by the risk by 3 and that numbers is still much larger than risk of vaccines.

Harambe, you do know that the common cold is incurable and ineradicable don't you?

Control Group Member#345763202 wrote:

Harambe wrote:

% chance of getting COVID is near 1 with the Delta variant.

Already 35-40% of America has gotten the disease. Not unreasonable to expect the rest to get it in the next year or two.

I saw a stat that 70% of teens hospitalized with COVID had a pre-exisiting conditions. Divide by the risk by 3 and that numbers is still much larger than risk of vaccines.

Harambe, you do know that the common cold is incurable and ineradicable don't you?

What's the IFR of "the common cold?"

I also only have a lowly Econ degree (though it's an MA and soon to be PhD). I'm not a medical doctor so I won't pretend to understand medical studies. All I'll say is, like with economics, COVID and studies like this one have a massive correlation vs causation problem. We're making assumptions based on correlations and treating those as causal variables. This is obviously a HUGE issue in just about every economics study, and I argue it applies to COVID studies as well.

For those that don't know what the correlation vs causation problem is. I'll give an example. For at least 100 years there's a positive correlation between stock market returns and sunspots. So, from the surface, this indicates that sunspots are a driving factor/cause behind stock market behavior. But, there's absolutely no real cause behind sunspots influence stock market returns. So, we say there's no causation behind that correlation.

[quote]sbeefyk2 wrote:

For those that don't know what the correlation vs causation problem is. I'll give an example. For at least 100 years there's a positive correlation between stock market returns and sunspots.

Smells like BS to me.

Documentation?

Comparing this to people getting vaxed, falling sick, and dying? Really?

Myocarditis 27 to 219 times more common than expected in vaccinated young males than and this guy is making a correlation is not causation argument!

I wasn’t talking specifically about Hocker in this case. It helps to read the whole thread before trying to be a “gotcha” bro.

For Hocker: You can cancel the risk of myocarditis upon second infection with the risk of mc from vaccine after infection. Those should be roughly equivalent…

I still believe the risk of testing positive dwarfs all other concerns for Hocker. I would be doing everything I could to have sterilizing immunity if I were him.

Getting vaxed after you already have the Covid antibodies is moronic

Sigh…. Prior infection with Covid is LESS protective than the m-RNA vaccines against both Alpha variant (previously the dominant strain in the US) and especially the now dominantDelta strain. This has been shown repeatedly in both clinical studies and inferentially by measuring antibody titers after infection versus vaccination.

Apart from protecting your higher risk neighbors by being vaccinated, lower risk persons face a much higher risk of a bad outcome by declining vaccination against Covid then by receiving it. Case closed. The percentage of infected young people with a bad outcome is currently most likely seriously under reported because most of the data comes from infection with the alpha variant rather than the more pathogenic delta variant. At the hospital where I practice, we are now beginning to see a much higher percent of healthy young people on ventilators then we did last winter.

As I have posted before, the sheer poppycock and BS posted by people who do not know what they’re talking about on this forum is very discouraging to this infectious disease specialist physician. I sincerely hope none of the readers will need my services. But if they do they are overwhelmingly likely to be the unvaccinated population.

The Unkle wrote:

Getting vaxed after you already have the Covid antibodies is moronic

False

vonderlasa wrote:

Sigh…. Prior infection with Covid is LESS protective than the m-RNA vaccines against both Alpha variant (previously the dominant strain in the US) and especially the now dominantDelta strain.

100% this

Have you read this rojo?

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/pdfs/mm7027e2-H.pdf

. Namely table 2.

The title is obviously misleading and 219/4337287 is a whopping... 0.005 percent. That's TINY.

phd candidate wrote:

Have you read this rojo?

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/pdfs/mm7027e2-H.pdf

. Namely table 2.

The title is obviously misleading and 219/4337287 is a whopping... 0.005 percent. That's TINY.

No, he hasn’t

well actually wrote:

The myocarditis issue is somewhat explained here, it is due to the spike protein:

...or due to being a carpet cleaner. For petes sake, three dudes talking about anecdotes..."my carpet cleaner had a heart attack, his wife's hand was shaking"...this is the spike protein.

And they are wannabe experts?

ehwgtw wrote:

Ask Julia wrote:

It doesn’t fit Rojo’s narrative at all. It destroys his narrative completely.

https://health.uoregon.edu/health-requirements

Hey pair of idiot fearmongers, how does an exemption fit with your current fearmongering narrative?

Oh, it destroys it completely!

https://coronavirus.uoregon.edu/vaccine#exemptions

Has Cole Hocker already got an exemption for the Fall Semester? Or have you completely tied yourself up in knots prematurely?

The Unkle wrote:

Getting vaxed after you already have the Covid antibodies is moronic

This misinformation that could encourage people to not get vaxed after having covid is moronic. Immunology PhD here again to debunk misinformation. I'll try to make it simple.

Natural COVID infection results in activation of a wide variety of antibody-producting plasma B cells that will turn into memory B cells that can make those same antibodies again upon reinvention. The antibodies bind to parts of the virus, the parts are termed antigens. However, the antibodies aren't always neutralizing bc COVID is a complex little virus with many parts/antigens, and antibodies get made against all those parts/antigens (regardless of whether they actually neutralize the virus) bc your adaptive immune system is indiscriminate in that way (it plays a sheer numbers game and produces an almost limitless antibody repertoire in hopes that some are useful). So you essentially active an army, but lost in the shuffle of that vast army are the few important soldiers/B cells that are actually worth anything against COVID bc of the antibodies you produce.

The advantage of the vaccine is that it results in the production in your body of the COVID part/antigen that, if an antibody is made against that part/antigens, it will be neutralizing and prevent the virus from fusing with and infecting host cells. This is the principle that had made vaccines work for decades...it focuses all the immune systems resources on activating & expanding only the specific cells that result in protection. And in turn, only these cells will have the memory recall too.

Summary: "Covid antibodies" is a useless term without context, because the antibody repertoire produced from natural infx vs vax is very different. The latter repertoire is tailored to provide lasting, specific protection via expanding B cell pops that produce neutralizing Abs. The former...good luck.

This is exactly why, on the cusp of the most important athletic even of his life so far (and who knows, maybe ever?) for him to have taken the vaccine with ZERO real idea of what it could do to him (as in reality we all have done - except we aren't Olympic level athletes), would have been about the most idiotic and careless thing he could have done.

And that is the end of this and really there is no more discussion.

phd candidate wrote:

The title is obviously misleading and 219/4337287 is a whopping... 0.005 percent. That's TINY.

Right but here is the question - could Cole Hocker guarantee (and since you are a phd candidate you will know what that means) that he would not be of the 0.005 percent? It is irrelevant how unlikely it is, it could never be ruled out (ask Christophe Lemaitre)

Because the chances of complications from the vaccine if you don't take it are 0.000%

Again, that's the end of this discussion. Hocker has done the right thing.

My family has a history heart issues, and without a cardiologist opinion on my own status, i refuse to get the vaccine.

Meanwhile this board has a bunch of intolerant liberals ready to inject door to door. Thank you intolerant a ssholes.

Part of what keeps me coming back here is the unfettered free speech. Go read the barstool comments on similar topics, pretty much the same opinions. If you want vaxxed go get it, if not leave the rest of us the f uck alone.

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

This is exactly why, on the cusp of the most important athletic even of his life so far (and who knows, maybe ever?) for him to have taken the vaccine with ZERO real idea of what it could do to him (as in reality we all have done - except we aren't Olympic level athletes), would have been about the most idiotic and careless thing he could have done.

And that is the end of this and really there is no more discussion.

Your point is very different than Rojo’s.

Rojo made up some nonsense about poor, elderly brown people overseas getting the vaccine before Cole.