Is Elle Purrier in American Record shape? Is she Clean?

fghrunner wrote:

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

Purrier is a different style runner than Muir. I believe she could run 3:55-3:56 right now and 14:30. Muir while a great athlete is there off of speed only running 50 mpw. Purrier runs 80 mpw and it shows in races like today's. I think in a race with a long run for home or fast from the beginning, I'd pick Purrier to outlast Muir.

They raced like a. month ago and it was a fast from beginning and muir ran away from Elle and made it look easy, 3:55 to 3:58

That was an 800 race where Muir ran 1:58.71 to Purrier's 1:59.99 at the Sound Running Track Meet:

Muir recently ran 3:55 at the Florence Diamond League meet to Hassan's & Kipyegon's 3:53s:

Announcer (English) for this race stated Hassan would not be doing the 1500 in Tokyo.

If Tsegay is not selected for the Ethiopian 1500 team . . . and with Shelby out . . . one can make a very valid claim that Kipyegon wins Gold followed by Muir/Purrier for Silver/Bronze.

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

Barry Badrinath wrote:

Yes, I think she's clean. No, I don't think she can run 3:54.99. Maybe 3:56 low if she gets on a train? Regardless, she has enough speed to contend in the Olympics unless somebody goes crazy. I think her and Laura Muir are pretty similar athletes.

Purrier is a different style runner than Muir. I believe she could run 3:55-3:56 right now and 14:30. Muir while a great athlete is there off of speed only running 50 mpw. Purrier runs 80 mpw and it shows in races like today's. I think in a race with a long run for home or fast from the beginning, I'd pick Purrier to outlast Muir.

This is ridiculous. 14:30 is a great time for a 5000m specialist. Purrier would do well to break 15:00. If you saw the Rome/Florence diamond league you'd have seen Muir run 3:55 in a race that was fast from the gun.

Let's be honest, this is slightly clutching at straws. If Houlihan wasn't a doper, nobody would be talking up Purrier like this

What about the twenty year old Freweyni HAILU who won the Ethiopian trials with 3:57.33 in the 1500m?

https://www.worldathletics.org/athletes/ethiopia/freweyni-hailu-14836656

No.Not clean.too lean,yet too muscled at the same time.impossible for a woman.her face seems to have changed shape,too.

Truth-hurts124 wrote:

Tucker Carlson. wrote:

She is not clean unfortunately.

I think her improvements were more dramatic than Shelby's

Not quite. I'd put her about #4 or #5 in amazing improvements of caucasian runners in the last 5 years (Houlihan, Schweizer, Stafford are ahead, Frerichs 9:00 is also a candidate, and now Cranny as well)

She has obviously lost quite a bit of weight since 2018 and has only once beaten a field that was on paper superior (indoor mile record) but Koko and GDS are in the Mile race not quite the fields Houlihan suddenly could outkick in 2018 (Muir, Hassan). 3:58 is strong but it remains to be seen how she does in a field of sub 4 runners like in a DL or Olympics race. And there is also the shoes to consider that weren't a factor 2018. If the shoes get you 2 sec. in the 1500, that's 4:00 -> 3:58...

What shoe is giving you 2 seconds in the 1500? Also she didn't just run 2:58, she did it after being pushed off the track, with a slow first 400, front running the whole time, on a hot day. And she didn't even look tired, seemed very relaxed at the end. I think put her in decent conditions and she can get at least 3:55 flat right now

Jo72 wrote:

Truth-hurts124 wrote:

I think her improvements were more dramatic than Shelby's

Not quite. I'd put her about #4 or #5 in amazing improvements of caucasian runners in the last 5 years (Houlihan, Schweizer, Stafford are ahead, Frerichs 9:00 is also a candidate, and now Cranny as well)

She has obviously lost quite a bit of weight since 2018 and has only once beaten a field that was on paper superior (indoor mile record) but Koko and GDS are in the Mile race not quite the fields Houlihan suddenly could outkick in 2018 (Muir, Hassan). 3:58 is strong but it remains to be seen how she does in a field of sub 4 runners like in a DL or Olympics race. And there is also the shoes to consider that weren't a factor 2018. If the shoes get you 2 sec. in the 1500, that's 4:00 -> 3:58...

The shoes were a suggestion (I also doubt that they help 2 secs. in the 1500m), not to suggest something more nefarious...

Purrier is clean and will break Muir's clean WR.

Yes. American record shape. Very good runner. Competes well and gets after it. Doesn't wait around. brings the race to the others. Leads and makes the rest chase her.

Seems worth pointing out that UNH isn't a good running school at all -- their fastest 1500 this year looks to be 4:30. Kind of a Nick Symmonds situation, where you'd expect a lot of improvement when she moved to a pro group.

runderrun wrote:

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

Purrier is a different style runner than Muir. I believe she could run 3:55-3:56 right now and 14:30. Muir while a great athlete is there off of speed only running 50 mpw. Purrier runs 80 mpw and it shows in races like today's. I think in a race with a long run for home or fast from the beginning, I'd pick Purrier to outlast Muir.

This is ridiculous. 14:30 is a great time for a 5000m specialist. Purrier would do well to break 15:00. If you saw the Rome/Florence diamond league you'd have seen Muir run 3:55 in a race that was fast from the gun.

Let's be honest, this is slightly clutching at straws. If Houlihan wasn't a doper, nobody would be talking up Purrier like this

Purrier DID break 15:00 in the 5000 meters. In the 2019 Doha World Championships. She's in much better shape now. Her sweet spot also seems to be 1500 to 2 miles, with 5000 meters a little far for her.

JBaller33 wrote:

runderrun wrote:

This is ridiculous. 14:30 is a great time for a 5000m specialist. Purrier would do well to break 15:00. If you saw the Rome/Florence diamond league you'd have seen Muir run 3:55 in a race that was fast from the gun.

Let's be honest, this is slightly clutching at straws. If Houlihan wasn't a doper, nobody would be talking up Purrier like this

Purrier DID break 15:00 in the 5000 meters. In the 2019 Doha World Championships. She's in much better shape now. Her sweet spot also seems to be 1500 to 2 miles, with 5000 meters a little far for her.

Right she ran 14:58, but most recently, she ran 15:08 (Feb this year). She is not even close to 14:30 shape. If she was training for it I'd say she can maybe go 14:45 this year. For all the talk of American records and medals, 3:58 is a world away from 3:55. I think she can still get a medal and Kipyegon and Muir would be stupid to overlook her, but I also think Purrier needs another year to get down to 3:55.

Barry Badrinath wrote:

Yes, I think she's clean. No, I don't think she can run 3:54.99. Maybe 3:56 low if she gets on a train? Regardless, she has enough speed to contend in the Olympics unless somebody goes crazy. I think her and Laura Muir are pretty similar athletes.

She ran American record indoor mile in last year before Covid happened, right? 4:16 indoors, that's moving. Then she ran 3:58 in the final after it looked like they were farting around the first couple hundred meters getting tripped up over each other? In an olympic final if someone takes it out in 3:50 pace, I think she could latch on the pack and run 3:54 or better.

Comparing Elle's improvement to Houlihan's improvement is apples to oranges. Shelby has been running competitively since she was 5, trained hard and excelled in high school, and was working very hard in college with an eye toward running professionally after. Elle didn't start running until high school and basically was running 30 miles a week or less. She went to a second rate running program and likely wasn't doing anywhere near the level of work Shelby was in college. There was way more untapped potential in Elle, and her improvements since starting to run for Coogan have been dramatic but also pretty consistent throughout her time as a pro. Shelby seemed to have plateaued in her early to mid 20s after years of grinding, and then suddenly got much better. Obviously you can't know for certain someone is clean, but I don't think Elle's improvements are all that suspicious. Houlihan's on the other hand, make a lot more sense after a positive test.

runderrun wrote:

Right she ran 14:58, but most recently, she ran 15:08 (Feb this year). She is not even close to 14:30 shape. If she was training for it I'd say she can maybe go 14:45 this year. For all the talk of American records and medals, 3:58 is a world away from 3:55. I think she can still get a medal and Kipyegon and Muir would be stupid to overlook her, but I also think Purrier needs another year to get down to 3:55.

You're out of your element. She ran 15:08 on a 90-degree day with major humidity in Austin in February. She destroyed Weini Kelati just running FTW, and Weini ran 14:58 a week later. Pete Julian and her coach Mark Coogan are of the opinion she can run under 14:30. I'd trust them over the guy who thinks she could maybe beat Josette Norris.

Truth-hurts124 wrote:

She pretty much front ran 3:58, put her in a fast race and she could get pulled to 3:54 easily. And now the next obvious question, Is she clean? We use to think it was crazy Dibaba ran 3:50, now American women are nearing the 3:54, 3:53 mark.

She's definitely in shape to shatter Rowbury's old AR, but if 3:54.99 is still the record (and nothing has let me to believe that would be revoked yet) I think that will be tough. Basically needs to be a 1500 final just like Doha for that to happen for her, and without Hasan and Tsegay running the 1500 that seems like a tough ask. Vivian may just sit for awhile and dial in up in the last 400-800.

If Tsegay gets named to the team despite not running it at the trials there's a shot she could be pulled.

Yes, Elle ran 20-30 mpw in high school. In college she went up to 30-45 mpw. As a pro she built up to 60 mpw and rising. She added in altitude training in Flagstaff. Then with the Pandemic she was able to take it to the next level with 80 mpw, which is in line with the best of the best.

In America, where 70% of the population is overweight and a staggering 90% is overfat, we can't comprehend that someone can be lean and muscular. Anyone who looks like that must be doping or have an eating disorder.

fghrunner wrote:

They raced like a. month ago and it was a fast from beginning and muir ran away from Elle and made it look easy, 3:55 to 3:58

As was pointed out, this is false. Muir beat her in the 800 where she is superior no questioning that.