Are there any shortcuts for marathon training?

Yep!

HRE wrote:

I've mentioned this before on similar threads. Yes, it's possible depending on what you do with the 3-4 days. A friend of mine ran 2:17 on a 3-4 day a week schedule. He did a 20 on the weekend, a couple 10s during the week at close to his marathon pace and maybe a hard 5 or another 10 on a fourth day, or maybe not. There are a some other similar examples that I know of from over the years as well.

All you need is a 20 miler and two 10 milers to reach 92.5% of your potential. Good luck!

I heard burritos are pretty effective for the 1500.

I don’t see why they wouldn’t help with longer stuff too?

No. Unless your original plan was to run your best marathon after 15 years of dedicated training. A shortcut would be doing it after 8 years.

All of the things you mention work for somebody. All of the "do's" stand an excellent chance of working for you, but there's only one way to find out and there are no (legal) shortcuts.

You could even design a pretty decent training plan that just alternated back and forth between the two sides: do a long run one week, don't do one the next; do vo2max one week, don't do any the next; do MP one week, don't do any the next; and so on. (Save the caffeine for race day, though.)

STRONK wrote:

Yep!

HRE wrote:

I've mentioned this before on similar threads. Yes, it's possible depending on what you do with the 3-4 days. A friend of mine ran 2:17 on a 3-4 day a week schedule. He did a 20 on the weekend, a couple 10s during the week at close to his marathon pace and maybe a hard 5 or another 10 on a fourth day, or maybe not. There are a some other similar examples that I know of from over the years as well.

All you need is a 20 miler and two 10 milers to reach 92.5% of your potential. Good luck!

At what intensity/pace?

We would need HRE here to confirm, but I think the 10 milers are at marathon pace/comfortably hard and the 20 miler is easy pace.

shortcut wrote:

Are there any shortcuts for marathon training?

No, there aren't any shortcuts for marathon training. I tried that once and I paid dearly.

If you want to run as fast as possible, there is no shortcuts.

If you want to run a faster "just finish the race", then yea there is.

If it makes sense.

If you are looking for shortcuts run a Half Marathon.

For a Marathon you need consistent training for at least 6 month better 12 month.

Minimum mileage 25-30 per week.

One longer run a week in the later part of your training.

This will get you to finish a Marathon in a healthy manner.

If you want to run a faster Marathon you have to do a lot more.

shortcut wrote:

Seems most coaches, plans and techniques agree on how to train from 800 up to half marathons.

For marathons, things go haywire here.

- Do long runs / don't run long.

- Do 20 milers / no need for long runs.

- Do vo2max works / don't do vo2max.

- This is big one: run at marathon pace / don't run at marathon pace.

- Fuel your runs / don't fuel

- Use caffeine/ don't.

- Do long reps. Don't.

Seriously while all these may work or not work.

Are there any shortcuts for marathon training?

Ask an expert-Rosie Ruiz

shortcut wrote:

Seems most coaches, plans and techniques agree on how to train from 800 up to half marathons.

For marathons, things go haywire here.

- Do long runs / don't run long.

- Do 20 milers / no need for long runs.

- Do vo2max works / don't do vo2max.

- This is big one: run at marathon pace / don't run at marathon pace.

- Fuel your runs / don't fuel

- Use caffeine/ don't.

- Do long reps. Don't.

Seriously while all these may work or not work.

Are there any shortcuts for marathon training?

Depends on the goal. If you are just trying to finish vs run it as fast as possible.

You need long runs.

You need few 20M as part of that.

You need to get a few long runs where you work into MP.

You need to practice fueling, so you can do it on race day.

Long reps help keep some turnover, break up the day to day routine.

Caffeine- totally up to you and your gut.

Danielson, man who asks for marathon shortcuts not ready for marathon.

STRONK wrote:

Yep!

HRE wrote:

I've mentioned this before on similar threads. Yes, it's possible depending on what you do with the 3-4 days. A friend of mine ran 2:17 on a 3-4 day a week schedule. He did a 20 on the weekend, a couple 10s during the week at close to his marathon pace and maybe a hard 5 or another 10 on a fourth day, or maybe not. There are a some other similar examples that I know of from over the years as well.

All you need is a 20 miler and two 10 milers to reach 92.5% of your potential. Good luck!

I would agree with this. If you had the base already built up, cutting all the easy milage out would still get you 90% of the way there

Captain Sully wrote:

For a Marathon you need consistent training for at least 6 month better 12 month.

Minimum mileage 25-30 per week.

One longer run a week in the later part of your training.

This will get you to finish a Marathon in a healthy manner.

If you want to run a faster Marathon you have to do a lot more.

Excellent post. If the goal is to finish a marathon, a healthy person needs almost no training.

To achieve perhaps 80% of your potential, the minimal plan you outline would be fine.

To get closer to 100% would require a lot more. And, as another poster suggested, all the components the OP listed would have a place.

Over the years I've run a couple dozen marathons, and have tried a few "shortcuts." To just "finish," like 4 hours, I've done only three "long runs." Literally -- no other training in the prior months. Four weeks before the race, a 12-miler. Six days off. A week later, 15. A week after that, 18 miles. Rest two weeks. Run marathon (well, run 22, walk-run 4). That was in my 20s and 30s to maintain "a-marathon-a-year" streak.

Better results many years later with three months of two runs per week. Average weekly mileage only about 12 miles, but working up to a 20-mile long run. Result: 3:25, even splits, no walking. At age 57, that "age grades" to 2:52.

Better still, a year later, after consistent training averaging 40-45 mpw, max 60, with VO2max and LT workouts, and a long run every 9 days -- 3:07, which age grades to 2:36.

It's difficult to compare, but at age 23, averaging 45 mpw, max 70, with an unstructured mix of hill repeats, track intervals, progression runs, long runs (including two full marathons during the previous 10 weeks), arguably a weaker result -- 2:40

shortcut wrote:

Are there any shortcuts for marathon training?

Yup, Rossi it.

Are there any (legal) shortcuts for marathon? Of course there are! If you by "shortcut"

means training half the mileage of the high mileage brigade and reach at least as good results.

But how to do it effectively and perform it then? Well.......very few know that Art of coaching.

Figure out how to fatigue your body to the exact equivalent of running 20 miles and then run 10k at race pace. Repeat as often as possible.

STRONK wrote:

Yep!

HRE wrote:

I've mentioned this before on similar threads. Yes, it's possible depending on what you do with the 3-4 days. A friend of mine ran 2:17 on a 3-4 day a week schedule. He did a 20 on the weekend, a couple 10s during the week at close to his marathon pace and maybe a hard 5 or another 10 on a fourth day, or maybe not. There are a some other similar examples that I know of from over the years as well.

All you need is a 20 miler and two 10 milers to reach 92.5% of your potential. Good luck!

He's kinda right. (I would add a 6 -7 day paper after the last hard day till marathon)

STRONK wrote:

Yep!

HRE wrote:

I've mentioned this before on similar threads. Yes, it's possible depending on what you do with the 3-4 days. A friend of mine ran 2:17 on a 3-4 day a week schedule. He did a 20 on the weekend, a couple 10s during the week at close to his marathon pace and maybe a hard 5 or another 10 on a fourth day, or maybe not. There are a some other similar examples that I know of from over the years as well.

All you need is a 20 miler and two 10 milers to reach 92.5% of your potential. Good luck!

It works if you're Bernie Allen, I guess. If you dig (and by dig I just mean use the search) you'll find that HRE has changed this story over the years so at this point it's hard to say what Allen really did in training.