Official Florence DL Live Discussion Thread - W1500 and M5000 Look UNREAL!! (2-4 pm ET)

'Norway no history of doping'....maybe check out their history in winter sports, awful record in XC skiing.

Wise Old Man wrote:

What these results show is that us Americans can end our delusion that we have any man or woman with a shot to medal in Tokyo in the 1500-10K. Not Houlihan, not Purrier, not Centro, not Engels, not Fisher. Time to wake up. Also, please nobody mention Hobbs Kessler and Jakob in the same sentence for the foreseeable future.

Why are Purrier/Houlihan out of the mix? Hassan and Tsegay are NOT running the 1,500. Yes Kipyegon will win, but Muir has never run smart in a global final and then everyone's in the 3:55-3:58 range.

As for the men's 1500, Jakob and Timmy are probably unbeatable. But maybe Jakob could run the 5,000 now (though I doubt it). Even if they both run it, the bronze medal spot is completely up in the air. Makhloufi who knows? Lewandowski looks washed-up. Rest of the field is solid but nobody running 3:29-3:30 consistently.

Did anyone really think the 5-10K medals were realistic? I don't really think so. I do think Fisher can run under 13 right now, but agree that is not medal realistic.

Meh 100m results, Simbine ftw in 10.08 (-0.1).

Matadi came nowhere near his Florida(?) time.

Ujah very close to Simbine, suggests Simbine wasn’t great on the day.

Rodgers, Cissé, etc...meh

But I haven’t yet seen the race

Really? That’s two cases, that were very open and transparent cases, with one case of lip balm and one case of ventolin. That’s it.

what's it all about wrote:

'Norway no history of doping'....maybe check out their history in winter sports, awful record in XC skiing.

So true.

That discussion again... Its a known fact that the lip balm had zero impact to the performance of Johaug. She broke the rules and deserved the punishment, but you just cant compare the incident to blatant cheaters whom takes dope knowingly to get a clear advance.

what's it all about wrote:

'Norway no history of doping'....maybe check out their history in winter sports, awful record in XC skiing.

I think he was sarcastic there.

By the way, I want to see this guy whose name "STEVE The Addict" commenting here with his typical words

EPO or PEID

Is he enjoying today?

runderun wrote:

I think it's honestly 50/50 between Jakob and Kiplimo over 5k. Kiplimo has a monster kick as he's shown in races over 3k, 5k, and HM. What's becoming obvious now is that if anyone wants any chance of a medal of any colour, you're going to need to be able to hold a sub-13 pace for 4200m and then be ready to unleash the kind of kick a miler would be proud of. The game has changed so much from 2016 and even 2019. Cheptegei doesn't seem to have that kick so his only hope is going to be to grind to a sub-12:45 which I don't think he can do without wavelight

I'd still favor Kiplimo. Gebrhiwet rallied back great, but he got smoked by Kejelcha/Barega 2 days ago. Kiplimo is in as good/better form as those two which is a notch above Hagos. Luckily for Jakob, it looks like Kiplimo and Wale will be the major two big dangers if he runs the 5,000 (instead of 3 or 4 more guys who could be doubling).

Wise Old Man wrote:

What these results show is that us Americans can end our delusion that we have any man or woman with a shot to medal in Tokyo in the 1500-10K. Not Houlihan, not Purrier, not Centro, not Engels, not Fisher. Time to wake up. Also, please nobody mention Hobbs Kessler and Jakob in the same sentence for the foreseeable future.

This ^

TL wrote:

"Biggest win of Jakob's career. With no Barega/Kejelcha in the 5,000, Jakob's chances are legit at 5,000 if Cheptegei doesn't improve his form a good bit. Still got Wale and Kiplimo of course."

-------------

Jakob isn´t running the 5000m in Tokyo. The 1500m / 5000m double isn´t doable (as ROJO has complained about several times; and I agree).

This is Jim Kiler wrote:

Wise Old Man wrote:

What these results show is that us Americans can end our delusion that we have any man or woman with a shot to medal in Tokyo in the 1500-10K. Not Houlihan, not Purrier, not Centro, not Engels, not Fisher. Time to wake up. Also, please nobody mention Hobbs Kessler and Jakob in the same sentence for the foreseeable future.

This ^

I agree, but it was an unfair comparison to begin with, Kessler still in high school.

Has any Norwegian cross country skier ever gotten caught using EPO or blood doping?

Yes.

Wise Old Man wrote:

What these results show is that us Americans can end our delusion that we have any man or woman with a shot to medal in Tokyo in the 1500-10K. Not Houlihan, not Purrier, not Centro, not Engels, not Fisher. Time to wake up. Also, please nobody mention Hobbs Kessler and Jakob in the same sentence for the foreseeable future.

Hobbs Kessler might be more talented than Jakob, considering his achievements at the same "training age".

This is Jim Kiler wrote:

Yes.

Wrong.

Wise Old Man wrote:

What these results show is that us Americans can end our delusion that we have any man or woman with a shot to medal in Tokyo in the 1500-10K. Not Houlihan, not Purrier, not Centro, not Engels, not Fisher. Time to wake up. Also, please nobody mention Hobbs Kessler and Jakob in the same sentence for the foreseeable future.

what about Jakob and hocker? lol

It should be obvious to anyone following profesional sports that everyone at the highest level is suspicious to a various degrees.

It is obviously one thing when lets say your blood bags are found with doctor Fuentes or you are trained by Jama Aden, etc, however any super high level result is suspicious itself.

It helps that client has a gradual improvement trajextory and is identified as great talent from very young age, but that does not guarantee that there is no doping or at least grey stuff.

I am admittedly very much fan of Ingebrigtsens and especially Gjert and Jakob, however do note that all three brothers are asthmatics and use meds just before races. So one cannot simply say that it is entirely clean result. I and anyone else can only hope that asthma meds is the iceberg but not the tip of it.

At the end of the day, the higher the money, the more incentive, therefore, even though bball, tennis or football are skill based, I would think that the level of doping there is very much similar to endurance sports if not higher

Do we know what Hassan will do? Maybe the 1500/10K is best for her? She looks like she could triple, maybe quadruple the way she’s going. Ok, no gold, but snag a medal in the 800 just for laughs. Does she really need to rest? Ok, I’ll go back to my bronze medal delusion for the women’s 1500. Our best runner did run 3:57 at a CIA black ops site, so we have been led to believe.

boing bboing bbboing wrote:

Hobbs Kessler might be more talented than Jakob, considering his achievements at the same "training age".

Kessler has done his years of training, just not in running. The body is wearing off no matter what sports.

While Kessler is very talented, he is not as talented as Jakob.