Awkward situation during my morning run

uu.uuu wrote:

While injured one year I switched to the bike. I had a great engine from mountain running, but rode a pretty crappy mountain bike and possessed zero cycling gear. And yet, I could keep high wattage for sustained efforts. This led to some funny interactions with fellow cyclists.

Road cyclists, I found out, are crazy, competitive Passing another cyclist is evidently akin to 'biting one's thumb', especially when the person passing them looks like a goon; rocking basketball shorts, a sweatshirt, and sitting straight up in the saddle (while they sit in aero position). Seldom do they go down without a fight, or without tucking themselves in your slipstream and hammering. It's great fun, really, and there's great satisfaction in outriding a guy on a bike that costs more than your car.

Why even compare to the awful sport of cycling? If someone is faster than you, just buy a more expensive bike. When I was 21-years-old I was going all-out pedalling as fast as I could down a hill and some old guy easily age 60+ flew past me at double my speed not even pedalling. Cylcing is a less enjoyable, more dangerous, pay-to-win version of running.

matrix wrote:

This is where I felt awkward because I felt like I was spoiling his run. … On the other hand it was his choice to speed up and wind himself? After 15 minutes he slowed right down and I went past.

You don't have to think anything of it. His choice if he wants to speed up and not let you pass. Some guys are like that.

I'm an old hobby jogger. A few days ago, I was doing an easy run and heading back home. Some college dude catches me on an uphill and (huffing and puffing) says "oh, I had to really work hard to catch you."

What am I supposed to say "oh, congrats, you caught me, an out-of-shape 44 year old, running 7:30 / mile pace on an easy day?"

(shrug)

Your guy wants to spoil his run, that's his decision. Some dude wants to be proud of catching a hobby jogger - kudos to him.

Don't think too deeply about it.

You ran right behind some guy you do not know for 15 min @ 6:35 pace while he was spitting and breathing hard?

Depending on how close you were, please report back in the next 10 days to let us know if you develop any symptoms. (yes the odds are low, but...)

The reverse happened to me a bunch of years ago. There is a wonderful mile-long climb in my hometown that while not that steep, changes in grade throughout. Lots of runners & cyclists will sometimes hammer the climb, myself included.

One evening, another runner started keeping pace with me on this climb. He didn't acknowledge me, but he did come from behind and then started running next to me.

I ran faster because it was weird. They matched my surge & pace.

A bit scared now, I ran faster. They did the same.

Now worried for my safety, I laid the hammer down, and ran as hard as I could (still uphill, mind you), just to get away. They chased for a bit and then gasped and I dropped them.

This probably has nothing to do with anything, but to this day, I can't figure out what that other runner's deal was. I have no problem running with someone else, but f***ing say something.

Jason, you're still here?

I wouldn't say that your situation in Fukuoka was similar to that of the OP (although it was arguably somewhat similar to that of the guy who sped up to keep ahead of the OP). The coach (and perhaps his athlete as well) didn't want you getting involved in his athlete's workout and invading his space. Your behavior would bother a lot of people, and it wouldn't surprise me if it would be more bothersome to someone from, for example, a Japanese cultural background than it would to someone from, say, a Chinese background (I chose China semi-randomly; I don't know how Chinese people would tend to respond to your conduct). So why didn't you just respect the coach's wishes and leave those two guys alone? Just because it was a public park doesn't mean that you were behaving appropriately.

I have no doubt that many of us have been in similar situations --- sometimes on the side of the guy who is just trying to mind his own business and run his own pace, and sometimes on the side of the guy who is suddenly competing with a stranger. (Of course, there are also the situations in which both runners get a bit competitive, which admittedly can be fun if you know that you're the better runner that day and the other runner is choosing to suffer rather than give an inch.) The cases in which the other runner suddenly "finishes" his run (in the middle of nowhere) or turns onto a side path right before you pass him are just more variances on the same theme. If you're on the more comfortable side of these situations, they can perhaps be amusing, but I think you still should respect the other runner's feelings. When you start playing games with strangers, things can get way too serious or even scary. (I remember one guy on this site describing a situation in which the runner he was about to catch and pass suddenly turned off into a wooded side trail, and this guy then turned onto the same side trail just to keep playing with the guy's ego. That may be fun, but I think it borders on criminal stalking or assault.) Basic social mores shouldn't go out the window just because you're out running.

Wow, that was a really annoying thing to do. And the fast 200 proved what exactly?

a similar thing happened to me yesterday. I'm just out minding my own business running on a path through the woods I run on regularly when right when I'm starting my tempo this guy joins me from a side path and tucks in behind me. He stays right behind me but doesn't say a word, it was really weird. I felt like maybe I should say something to him but I just continued on my way. After I was done my tempo (15 minutes at 6:35 pace) and slowed down he finally passed me.

Should I have said something in this situation?

Yeah, that would be incredibly annoying.

As for the OP, I run daily on a crowded path and have seen it all. Joggers suddenly sprinting when I pass by them, runners entering the path via a side path and cutting in front of me as soon as I'm approaching, etc. I'd have no issue with someone trying to run with me if they're polite about it, but like many runners I have no tolerance for competitive bs when I'm not not trying to compete.

I think the OP handled it well and there's nothing that needs to be said in that situation..."this was an easy run for me" would come across really douchy. Be proud that you helped give him a workout.

Like I said, I stay far enough behind him to prevent distracting him from his obviously important workout.

This bring me back to the old days where people on the forum wanted shirts that were like "3.1 miles" or "recovery day" etc. to tell random joggers to leave them alone.

It happens occasionally as I'm in a big city. I pass 99% of all the runners out there anyways. And of course if I'm running on a 'public trail/path' I'm on a recovery day. So when when one wants to pass I let them - have a small victory. Let them jog ahead for a while and then when they stop I say: "that's it?/? this my recovery day lolomgbbqftw"

After I finish laughing, I jog off at my continued easy pace and run for another 10 miles or so.

You actually said that you decided to speed up in order to draft off of him, and then stayed at his pace while his coach was trying to shoo you away. At some point, having repeatedly ignored the coach's indications that he wanted to you to stop bugging them, you yelled at the coach in some foreign language, and then sprinted by his athlete while smiling like some maniac. Maybe the athlete was distracted, maybe he wasn't, but you certainly didn't seem to be acting like a well-socialized person, particularly in a country where social norms were probably quite different from your own.

old shoe wrote:

if I'm running on a 'public trail/path' I'm on a recovery day. So when when one wants to pass I let them - have a small victory. Let them jog ahead for a while and then when they stop I say: "that's it?/? this my recovery day lolomgbbqftw"

After I finish laughing, I jog off at my continued easy pace and run for another 10 miles or so.

I don't know what "lolomgbbqftw" means, but I'm guessing that it's not a confession that you're being an ass and are incapable of being otherwise, so it seems inadequate under the circumstances.

Look, if you are in a public space such as a trail or park, and you are not interfering with the path of other runners, cyclists or walkers, there is no foul.

The only real debate here is the subjective judgement of "cosmic space."

In the situation that I described, I was sensitive to the fact that the runner was doing a hard workout, and at no point did I ever come close to interfering with him. It was within my rights as someone running in the park to speed up or slow down at any point as long as I did not interfere with the coach or the athlete.

I've had runners try to keep up with me in other places such as Lumpini Park or Suan Rod Fai in Bangkok, and I enjoy the company. That's just me.

Jason Mayeroff, legend in his own mind.

mayeroff wrote:

Look, if you are in a public space such as a trail or park, and you are not interfering with the path of other runners, cyclists or walkers, there is no foul.

. . .

It was within my rights as someone running in the park to speed up or slow down at any point as long as I did not interfere with the coach or the athlete.

The discussion has nothing to do with whether or not someone has committed a "foul" or acted "within [his] rights." Rather, these are matters of social courtesy, decorum, custom, respect. There will, of course, be some differences in how various people interpret certain behavior, or where people draw various lines.

Some of the behaviors described in this and similar threads -- for example, the behavior of the guy who used the term "lolomgbbqftw" (I don't know what it means, but it shows up in a google search) -- seem so socially inappropriate as to suggest either significantly delayed social development or some level of mental illness. Your repeated refusal to comply with the coach's clear wishes, followed by your yelling at the coach in a foreign language and then sprinting past his athlete with a goofy smile on your face, seems a little weird to me, but perhaps wasn't as odd as I imagined. In any event, I'm often struck by how many people, who perhaps adhere to social norms in most parts of their lives, seem to go off the rails when they're out running.

No, you don’t owe that guy jack

mayeroff wrote:

Look, if you are in a public space such as a trail or park, and you are not interfering with the path of other runners, cyclists or walkers, there is no foul.

People just need to run on private property and Jason will leave them alone.

minding my own business wrote:

a similar thing happened to me yesterday. I'm just out minding my own business running on a path through the woods I run on regularly when right when I'm starting my tempo this guy joins me from a side path and tucks in behind me. He stays right behind me but doesn't say a word, it was really weird. I felt like maybe I should say something to him but I just continued on my way. After I was done my tempo (15 minutes at 6:35 pace) and slowed down he finally passed me.

Should I have said something in this situation?

This.

Maybe the guy simply has a tempo segment planned, too.

OP is a creep and a hypocrite.

Also, since when does spitting = effort?

old shoe wrote:

This bring me back to the old days where people on the forum wanted shirts that were like "3.1 miles" or "recovery day" etc. to tell random joggers to leave them alone.

It happens occasionally as I'm in a big city. I pass 99% of all the runners out there anyways. And of course if I'm running on a 'public trail/path' I'm on a recovery day. So when when one wants to pass I let them - have a small victory. Let them jog ahead for a while and then when they stop I say: "that's it?/? this my recovery day lolomgbbqftw"

After I finish laughing, I jog off at my continued easy pace and run for another 10 miles or so.

If someone ran past me and said that I'd laugh my tits off and he isn't mentally unwell, some people just don't have a sense of humour these days.