Saucony Endorphin Speed - Firm or plush, unstable at slow paces ??

I have a question for you. First, some background...

I don't run or race on the roads anymore, but I do (reasonably) fast track workouts. My pace is 4:10-6:00 on my 150m-400m intervals. I'm mostly a forefoot striker, but I'll lightly heel touch at slower (6:00) paces.

My problem is that I have partial tears and arthritis that respond negatively to hard shoes. I'm too sore to do my next hard workout even after a rest day. A soft shoe like the NB Beacon helps some, but it just doesn't have any pop on the track. I'm more of a power runner than a gliding along distance runner.

Would you recommend the Endorphin Speed or the Pro for me? Thanks.

Like others have said, it's not particularly firm or plush, somewhere in the middle of the spectrum maybe slightly towards the softer end. The heel is a touch unstable at slower paces, but the design of the shoe propels you towards the forefoot once you get rolling. Doesn't have the same bounce as the vaporfly or anything like that, but it's nice and springy. I use the endorphins for tempos, longer intervals, and long runs where I'm trying to go faster than easy pace, and it's a versatile shoe that performs very well for all of those workouts. Probably wouldn't use them for easy days though, I personally don't think you need a plated shoe as your daily trainer but opinions on this vary.

I agree with a few other posters that the Endorphin Speed is incredibly soft, bouncy and borders on unstable in the heel. I find the Pro (both '2' models) to be a smidge more stable than the Speed and with a stiffer forefoot. I'm a 153# older runner who has been at it since the 1970s and it makes me laugh how anyone could consider the Speed or Pro firm, although I haven't run in the AF, VF or Meta models.

FWIW, I also have the Shift 2 and they are quite firm but with nice responsiveness and a little bit of pop from the toe off. All three are really quite excellent IMO. I've come to think of the Shift 2 as every day shoes, the Speed 2 as long run and 'effort' shoes, and the Pro 2 as a model I'm thinking about for a Fall marathon.

I'd recommend the Speed. I don't do too many fast workouts - I tend to alternate weekly between 12x400m and 5x1k on a tuesday and a tempo run on saturday and wear Speed for these. I'm 56 and generally run 19-20min 5k. Rarely race other distances these days.

In the past I often found 'softer' shoes were not responsive enough so tended to wear something firmer so I can still 'feel' the ground. I like Endorphin Speed because it hits the sweet spot between the two extremes. I have the Speed on long runs (10-12miles) but generally wear Shift for these and other steady runs.

Thanks for your input! I ran in the Novablast 2 today and had so much fun. After a lot of reading today, I've come to the conclusion that the plates in the super shoes are what create the firm feel for some of us. The Speed 2 foam itself is considered fairly soft, so it might be the nylon plate that makes the shoe feel a bit firm. Softness is of course relative, but most reviewers consider the Speed 2 to come alive at speed and be on the firm side the slower one runs. I am just getting back into running and an ex-sprinter, so my paces are slow. Makes sense why the Speed 2 didn't suit me.

Question. I saw that the Speed 3 just came out in July. Shouldn't the Speed 2 be available at a discount now? I can't find it on sale.

I’ve logged a number of runs in the Speed 3 and can say they are much softer than Speed 1. Step in comfort is incredible. But from first run have been disappointed. The rocker effect doesn’t seem as strong. For sure 3 is wider and more stable. Upper feels good, but a little wide for me. And laces are weirdly stretchy creating issues with lockdown.

The idea of the Speed 3 is good, but the execution isn’t quite there. I’ve gone back to the Speed 1 for now. Gonna try the discounted Speed 2’s next.

Saucony had them on sale for like $90-100 a few weeks ago

Ha! I went to the Saucony website and did a coupon search with a chrome extension and got them for $80+$5 shipping! Thanks for triggering the idea of doing a discount code search. It makes sense that they'd be closing out the old stock ASAP.

Thanks for the critique of the Speed 3. I went with the Speed 2.

I have a cumulative 1500+ miles in various pairs of Endorphin Speed 2s. They are fantastic. I'm not that fast. I've used them from the low/mid-5s all the way up to something around 9:30.

Im not exactly sure how I'd describe them re plush/etc. But I can say that I've had zero stability issues.

Again, thanks for the critique of the Speed 3. I bought the Endorphin Speed 2, liked it, and then bought the Endorphin Pro 2. Both shoes feel fast and responsive on the track for intervals. I can't tell any difference in performance. The Endorphin Speed 2 gets a very slight edge because it is a little more comfortable. I think in a 5k or a mile on the road, I'd go with the Pro 2. But I'd need to do a tempo on the road to be sure... and I very seldom run on pavement anymore.

For perspective, my intervals are short and typically done in the 4:30 to 6:00 per mile pace range.

The Endorphin Speed 2 is squishier, bouncier, and more versatile than the Endorphin Speed 1, in my experience. I loved both, but the Speed 1 was firmer and had a more limited use in my experience: I used it strictly for up-tempo and even some 5K/10K road racing.

I got the Endorphin Speed 2 a few weeks ago and I'm using it for everything but super easy runs (although it could be used on those as well) and races. Yesterday I did my long run in them at moderate pace, last week I used them for a track workout consisting of mile repeats and 800s, and I use them on regular daily type runs. I'd say this will be my all-around shoe that I bring on a trip or go to if I need one shoe that can do pretty much everything.