2 mile TT

dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

But the 1000s were pretty good.

That is like 5:30 pace. If that is 10k pace we are talking like a ~10:20-10:30 type 2 mile. Go out in 5:15 and see what happens. It isn't fast enough that you will die horribly and it isn't slow enough that you will massively negative split it.

Yeah. I tend to think of 6x1000 with that amount of rest as a decent 5000 predictor, though. So doing eight of them at that pace would indicate something like 17:00ish 5000 fitness, which I think correlates with low 10s, maybe high 9s.

We really need more context on these workouts to give you any kind of accurate guess. How hard were those 400s? People seem to be treating it as like a mile pace workout, but it could easily be 2 mile pace or slower. And, honestly, your previous PR is going to be a way better predictor than these workouts.

If I were you I would plan to take 2 shots at this TT, without putting much pressure on the first attempt. Or do a hard predictor workout -- just something to break the rust after not racing for a while.

Ho Hum wrote:

We really need more context on these workouts to give you any kind of accurate guess. How hard were those 400s? People seem to be treating it as like a mile pace workout, but it could easily be 2 mile pace or slower. And, honestly, your previous PR is going to be a way better predictor than these workouts.

If I were you I would plan to take 2 shots at this TT, without putting much pressure on the first attempt. Or do a hard predictor workout -- just something to break the rust after not racing for a while.

Exactly. Only the OP knows how those workouts feel and he doesn't mention any other PR's. If he was red lining on those 400's towards the end and only has like a 17 Min 5k PR then 10:40 would be a good time to shoot for. If the the 400's were nice and smooth and he has a PR under 16:30 then 10 flat would be a good time shoot for.

birdbeard wrote:

dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:

That is like 5:30 pace. If that is 10k pace we are talking like a ~10:20-10:30 type 2 mile. Go out in 5:15 and see what happens. It isn't fast enough that you will die horribly and it isn't slow enough that you will massively negative split it.

Yeah. I tend to think of 6x1000 with that amount of rest as a decent 5000 predictor, though. So doing eight of them at that pace would indicate something like 17:00ish 5000 fitness, which I think correlates with low 10s, maybe high 9s.

Clueless

Breaking 10 was the goal, but I knew it was going to be a slight stretch. I've run a 3200 m time trial most years since graduating high school (24 years ago). The 3*1600m in less than 5 minutes with 5 minutes recovery (800m jog) is my key indicator workout of whether I am ready for a sub-10 3200 m. This year I was able to get under 5 for each repeat but found myself stealing an extra minute of recovery before the third repeat (so 6 minutes). That's when I knew it was going to be close.

I generally race well, and think this workout would work well as an indicator for just about anyone. If you can't break 5 in a mile fairly routinely, how are you going to do it for two consecutive miles?

As for the "long" recovery, a ratio of 1:1 run to recovery is normal for a vo2 max workout, per Jack Daniels recommendations. It's also not a workout I routinely do for fitness, but is instead precision targeted to assessing whether I am ready at that moment to run sub 10.

LRC observer wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

Yeah. I tend to think of 6x1000 with that amount of rest as a decent 5000 predictor, though. So doing eight of them at that pace would indicate something like 17:00ish 5000 fitness, which I think correlates with low 10s, maybe high 9s.

Clueless

Eh, it's true for me at least. Around the time I was in shape to run 6-7x3:20 with 90s rest, I ran 9:55 and 16:42.

I agree 10:30 to 10:40. I remember back in the day running a 10:08 two mile TT and I was doing 10x400 65 to 67 back then and 6x800 in 2:20 to 2:25. Depends on how much faster u can handle but based on the track workout u listed 10:25 to 10:45 is my guess

10:04 ??? If you are running 60 miles per week and mile repeats at 5:00 I would expect you could run 9:30. I would guess if you surveyed all the sub 9:15 HS runners you’d find few of them average more than 50 miles per week with a lot of CV intervals. Read the MileSplit workouts from elite HS runners. Most average 45-55 per week, and threshold or CV pace workouts around 5:00 (albeit shorter rest). You should certainly be able to run 9:40 minimum.

dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

But the 1000s were pretty good.

That is like 5:30 pace. If that is 10k pace we are talking like a ~10:20-10:30 type 2 mile. Go out in 5:15 and see what happens. It isn't fast enough that you will die horribly and it isn't slow enough that you will massively negative split it.

I agree with this. I think you're just a touch off from a true sub-10 attempt & might do a ton of damage if you got out in 5:00ish. I would target 5:15 for the opening 1600. If it really feels easy maybe come through closer to 5:10 after a relaxed 800 in 2:36-37.

If you have someone pacing you, maybe you can get a little more aggressive & go out in 5:05-10.

10:20-10:30 in a competitive race, 10:45-11:00 for a solo time trial.

birdbeard wrote:

Yeah. I tend to think of 6x1000 with that amount of rest as a decent 5000 predictor, though. So doing eight of them at that pace would indicate something like 17:00ish 5000 fitness, which I think correlates with low 10s, maybe high 9s.

Sure. Put him down for a 17:00 5000m. But 17:00 5000m guys with decent aerobic bases (i.e. guys running over 50mpw) are running 10:30s 3200s not sub 10:00. Sub 10:00 is much closer to 16:20. or so.

JMJ wrote:

10:04 ??? If you are running 60 miles per week and mile repeats at 5:00 I would expect you could run 9:30. I would guess if you surveyed all the sub 9:15 HS runners you’d find few of them average more than 50 miles per week with a lot of CV intervals. Read the MileSplit workouts from elite HS runners. Most average 45-55 per week, and threshold or CV pace workouts around 5:00 (albeit shorter rest). You should certainly be able to run 9:40 minimum.

The poster isn't doing CV or threshold repeats. He is doing VO2 max ones. Doing 5 miles a 5:00 with say 2:00 result can't be compared to 3x1600 with 5 min rest.

dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

Yeah. I tend to think of 6x1000 with that amount of rest as a decent 5000 predictor, though. So doing eight of them at that pace would indicate something like 17:00ish 5000 fitness, which I think correlates with low 10s, maybe high 9s.

Sure. Put him down for a 17:00 5000m. But 17:00 5000m guys with decent aerobic bases (i.e. guys running over 50mpw) are running 10:30s 3200s not sub 10:00. Sub 10:00 is much closer to 16:20. or so.

Fair enough. I ran 9:55 the same time I ran 17:02 but I know everyone is different, I was a bit more speed-oriented at the time.