Strava changes - great analysis by DC Rainmaker: "Today, Strava sold its segmented soul."

woker upper wrote:

Forgo one overpriced Starbucks drink a month if you wanna whine about $5 a month.

So you admit $5 a month is overpriced for Strava.

Runner10287 wrote:

Recreational cyclist however can make it a point to attack popular segments in town on a daily basis as you can hammer for portions of a ride without having to slow down to a crawl to recover.

I've been thinking about this thread.

I wonder if cyclists are just more used to variable power output than runners. For no reason other than...that's how it is. Runners could become just as comfortable with varying their power output during even easy runs, but that run might include some flat-out stopping or walking. When you stop pedaling on a bike, you keep moving, so it seems like a more reasonable thing to do. The cost to the ego is much lower, for some reason, than admitting you need a quick break from running.

Another thing to consider is that runners don't have very much hard running available in their legs, because of the pounding nature of running. Cyclists' legs absorb virtually zero shock, even as they go faster. Grabbing a segment doesn't usually mean they'll have to recover noticeably longer before a hard workout.

uhhh any other non-subscribers NO LONGER seeing GAP (grade-adjusted pace) this morning? That would be a huge change for us hill folk.

I am re-reading Stava's press release, and I don't see it being mentioned. GAP is being rolled out to the iOS and Android apps for subscribers, but I don't see any mention of making a subscriber feature out of GAP on the web interface...

Anyone else not seeing GAP?

Segment hunting just lends itself much better to cycling than running. Unless you are training all week for the sole purpose of taking down segments on a weekend long run.

I have used it for years. I have always paid because its cost is minimal and it supports something that is specific to running and cycling, both of which I like. They have operational costs so why should they give the service away for free? Stop being such a bunch of cheap ass runners and just pay the very small fee. be happy you got to demo it for free for so many years

trailracing wrote:

I have used it for years. I have always paid because its cost is minimal and it supports something that is specific to running and cycling, both of which I like. They have operational costs so why should they give the service away for free? Stop being such a bunch of cheap ass runners and just pay the very small fee. be happy you got to demo it for free for so many years

Strava isn't a charity. They need to create real demand for their product. They are in charge of shaping potential customer's behavior. I hate this acting like we owe strava something. If we say something about Strava, by definition it is valid. It's Strava's problem to make us happy, not the other way around. I will make a purchase when I damn well please, on my terms, not as some favor to a failing startup.

WFH mileage wrote:

Pretty $hitty. Segments were literally the only reason I signed up for the site. Everything else can be done (arguably better) by tons of other services (Garmin Connect, etc.).

So you want something for free.

truth hertz wrote:

WFH mileage wrote:

Pretty $hitty. Segments were literally the only reason I signed up for the site. Everything else can be done (arguably better) by tons of other services (Garmin Connect, etc.).

So you want something for free.

Why are you seemingly moralizing about that? Yes, that's how the market works. People buy the stuff they want to buy, or they don't. The person you are responding to is saying paying for Strava isn't worth it (based on their own personal preferences!!), considering the free competition

That's just market forces, baby. Don't shame the individual, as if desiring a free solution is immoral. What are you trying to say, that wanting something for free is what poor people do, and you judge?

Is it really free when they have the right to sell your data to marketers?

Runner10287 wrote:

I don't see many people structuring a run where they go with a plan of hammering segments like a fartlek run. So unless you can maintain 5:00 pace for 10 miler on a consistent basis it's not really a realistic pursuit on your daily runs.

There is a guy in my area who did that for nearly every run for most of a year. He drove all over the county to pick up as many as he could in this fashion. Also seems to be some competition between North Central College runners over some segments.

Trail Zealot wrote:

uhhh any other non-subscribers NO LONGER seeing GAP (grade-adjusted pace) this morning? That would be a huge change for us hill folk.

I am re-reading Stava's press release, and I don't see it being mentioned. GAP is being rolled out to the iOS and Android apps for subscribers, but I don't see any mention of making a subscriber feature out of GAP on the web interface...

Anyone else not seeing GAP?

I don't think it was ever displayed in the mobile apps before, but yeah, it is gone from the website now.

It's true that Strava are entitled to utilize the market anyway they see fit in order to drive a profit. However what I haven't seen much discussion around here is that they are attempting to do so by charging for features which have been free for the best part of 10 years.

It's not like it's anything new they're trying to sell themselves on, or offering improvements to the basic service, it's just taking the basic service and saying you now have to pay for it. Their attempts with Summit features obviously failed.

So I guess this must be something of a final gamble in terms of an independent collated (Garmin, Polar, Apple, etc) fitness network. If people won't pay, like someone said earlier, Google will hoover up the marketplace instead.

I'm doing that right now. A bunch of dorks are losing some of their KOMs. I've created segments mainly to track my own progress on some of my regular routes. Now that I can only see my PR, it doesn't matter and I'll delete them. I can track my progress on Garmin Connect, so I don't need that functionality on Strava, and thus I don't need the segments I created on Strava anymore

Question?ssss wrote:

I'm think of nuking all the segments I created. Discussions seem to indicate I am not the only one considering this option.

r2k83 wrote:

Trail Zealot wrote:

uhhh any other non-subscribers NO LONGER seeing GAP (grade-adjusted pace) this morning? That would be a huge change for us hill folk.

I am re-reading Stava's press release, and I don't see it being mentioned. GAP is being rolled out to the iOS and Android apps for subscribers, but I don't see any mention of making a subscriber feature out of GAP on the web interface...

Anyone else not seeing GAP?

I don't think it was ever displayed in the mobile apps before, but yeah, it is gone from the website now.

GAP is gone. Kudos, Strava!

Doug Heffernan wrote:

I still won't sign up for a premium membership, but yes... I've been screaming about this for years. How is it that Strava can't program something that autoflags a segment where someone "ran" a mile+ at sub-3 pace?!

They fixed this. It's just that it only flags new activities.

Je suis Francais wrote:

Basically yanking a ton of features from the free domain into the paid domain is surely one way to become profitable, but it could also cause a userbase rebellion when a competitor emerges.

Not a chance. Why would anyone ever sink over $100 million into trying to "compete" in a market that is apparently not worth much, especially against an entrenched competitor with a massive userbase. Strava has been at this for the better part of a decade, and it's demonstrated that this market is not a gold mine.

I'm not sure if Strava's approach is the right one, but I don't blame them for trying it. They've never made much on selling data or on advertising. This is pretty much the alternative. Most people won't pay because most people really don't care about most of Strava's features, but I would think that anyone who actually misses any pulled features would have no trouble dropping the measly subscription fee to get them back.

The only issue I see is possible resentment, but I think under the circumstances, that should be a manageable problem. They basically said, "look, if people don't start subscribing, we might not exist." And the fee is tiny. It's hard to feel like the big tech guys are exploiting you under those circumstances.

I've been paying for Strava for years without issue. The realities of the situation are that (as another poster has said) venture capital is not available like it once was, and growth stage companies have to shift towards profitability. The options are either you pay $5 per month, or get the feed clogged up with ads.

It is clearly superior to the Garmin and other similar apps due to its ubiquity, ease of use, and social functions. If it wasn't superior, no one would use it. I can't believe that DC Rainmaker of all people would decry this move, when all he does is review and then hauck gadgets!

Yes they do some sponsored posting, but those are usually challenges that you do to get a coupon of some kind. Also those are very different from the insanity of ads that clog up sites like, oh I don't know...... LetsRun.com

Je suis Francais wrote:

Runner10287 wrote:

How is that cheating if they covered said distance in said amount of time?

It is cheating because it is not how OP wants everyone to play the game. I'm sure strava LOVES dealing with the whining coming from the strava-competitive demographic, it's why they got into business.

Sounds like OP should start building their exclusive app, with RULES!

They are also tying the total elapsed time to actual run time on segments. This kills all the people who cheat at segments by sprinting a section of a segment and pause their watch until they are ready to sprint the next section of the segment.

I was a subscriber before and I will continue to be a subscriber to Strava.

Strava is worth it.