I downvoted it because Lagat is most definitely not “the epitome of what’s wrong with the system” but one of it not the greatest American distance runners ever.
His 3:27.40 should not be the American record, though. We agree on that.
Oh, sorry! I didn't mean Lagat was the problem. I meant the way USATF handled it was the epitome of the FUBAR way they do things. Lagat is a Kenyan who became a US citizen. I have no problem with that. My complaint was that USATF counted times he ran before he was running for the USA as the best US times. That is just idiotic (not Lagat). Lagat is not the problem, USATF is.
This would be akin to a school giving someone its school record for a time they ran at a previous school, before transferring.
Wayne from Winnetka wrote: Nuguse ran the North American Area Record "AR"
Ran a continental = AR = NACAC area in this case = North, Central American and Caribbean record. "North American" only speaking and writing in short.
Also calling US record as AR is really stupid and only creates confusion. The whole world agreed on NR.
These are the rules, you like or not. You can also make your separate North American lists for the US and Canada only, but sorry, what for? Because Bolt, Shaunae Miller-Uibo and others are laughing.
I don't think people were saying that... we were saying that something can't be the Area Record without automatically being faster than all the national records in that Area, by definition.
How can Nuguse have the NACAC/AR without having the US record? That is how idiotic and moronic USATF is when they give Lagat, running for Kenya, the US record. How could a national record be faster than the AR where that nation is located?
It would be like a German having the European record but not the German record. So dumb.
Yes, they can because world records, area records and national records are tracked by different organisations with different rules for ratification. You could feasibly have a national record faster than the world record because a national federation might have more lax requirements for ratifying national records than World Athletics.
I can give you a similar example from another sport. Until last year when David Popovici broke the 100 freestyle world and European records the French 100 freestyle national record was faster than the European record.
I'm sure his contract has a bonus for setting American records, so I wonder if he got the bonus this time or not. He and Nike may not have anticipated hitting a gray area like this.
I think whether or not someone is a citizen at the time of their performance should be the dispositive factor. There are plenty of Americans who compete for other countries (Mondo, Fahnbulleh, Parsons), if they set an American record I think it should be recognized as such (as long as they are American citizens). As someone mentioned Wanders’ times qualify as both French and Swiss records. Any other policy involves arbitrary line-drawing, like what if someone is a dual citizen but has never competed on the world stage for either country (which country are they eligible to set records for?) or what if they compete in both countries’ national championships but wouldn’t be allowed to set a national record in one of them?
Lagat fairly set the record under the rules at the time so they can't just strip him of the record because they later changed the eligibility rules.
Lagat set the 3:27 record AS A U.S. CITIZEN. There were no rules at the time except the USATF deciding they needed several months to process his citizenship granted by the U.S. government. That is pure idiocy ... the USATF making up their own citizenship rules -- based on their snail-pace paperwork processing (it's in the to do at some time box). Those "rules" including telling a U.S. citizen to compete for another country -- SO STUPID
The "new" USATF rules remove that nonsense and align with when the U.S. government grants citizenship. Their paperwork can wait to catchup ... how it should have always been. Newer people at the USATF realized how lame the old rule was.
Lagat's 'record' was ratified as the American Record 14 YEARS after he ran it.
Alan
Exactly. And the rules were changed knowing it would impact (and probably because of) Duplantis.
Duplantis simply pointed out holding on to poorly thought out "rules" needed to be corrected. Blame the morans who told a U.S. citizen to run for another country because of paperwork delays.
American Mel Sheppard won the Gold medal in the 1500m in the 1908 Olympics. Who was the next American to win Gold in the 1500m in the Olympics?
A - Matthew Centrowitz in 2016
B - Bernard Lagat in 2004
The correct questions is: Who was the next American CITIZEN to win Gold in the 1500m in the Olympics? A: Lagat in 2004 who was told to run for Kenya by the USATF.
