Video Highlights 2015 Boston Marathon
April 20, 2015
justAnumbersGUY wrote:
For fun, I wrote a script to go through the photo website and find any other participants who were only photographed at the finish line, or not at all. Here's a list of bib numbers.
I'm not trying to be a jerk, but with all the posts already in the thread that point out runners who only had pics in the lost and found of the webpage...unless you do some more research, your information is fairly useless.
justAnumbersGUY wrote:
For fun, I wrote a script to go through the photo website and find any other participants who were only photographed at the finish line, or not at all. Here's a list of bib numbers.
Umm, you're perhaps a climate scientist?
That would be pure goodness. It would help connect the dots
guessing game wrote:
Sam F. wrote:There's one of me (I finished 11 behind him) on a bridge and I think it was at 16 or so. I remember a bridge where I knew I was done at 16 in 2013 and I'm almost certain that was it where that picture is. Also, the humidity was really high that day. Temps started low and got warmer. I can tell by looking at my pictures that I was really soaked.
I mentioned it in a different post, but I thought I was in shape to break 3:10 by a few minutes. My race results don't indicate a ton, because I left myself go and Via was where I kind of finally got close to being back. But I went 2:57 in 2011, 3:08 in 2012 and I've been below 3:10 probably 15-20 times, so I know when I'm in sub-3:10 shape. I had a couple of issues at Lehigh Valley, but it was not a PR day.
Went 3:25 at MDI (really hilly course) the next month and ran 3:19 in Philly, threw in the towel at 14 and had a bad positive split. 3:14:00 at Boston this year. If you stalk my NYC I ran that with a slower friend for fun.
If you went out fast and crashed and he only beat you by 2 minutes then logic would say that he likely rolled you up at some point in the course, but I'm guessing you never saw him.
He had to pass me if he stayed on course because he went through the start after me. I didn't really crash — I was on track for 3:10 through about 18 and started to struggle. Hindsight it might have been the heat, not sure. I couldn't describe anybody who I saw that day. I just remember it started to cook as the day went on. In a way, like Boston was in 2014, where it wasn't bad at the start, but it got warm later. There was humidity too, though.
Oh, FWIW, I have my GPS data. ;) I was actually going to protest my time over two seconds if I needed them but I made it in by seven. That's a discussion for a different thread, though. :)
Invisible Man wrote:
local person wrote:Can you link to a specific one? I'm from the area and know most of the course. If it is the one looking down at the runners from the left side, with water on the other side, that's maybe a mile from the finish. Probably 25.
Here is a link to the photo search. Enter the winner's bib #1199. There are plenty of pics of him. Maybe you can pinpoint where the last photographer was positioned, assuming he didn't move during the race.
http://www.racephotonetwork.com/QPPlus/SearchBibNumber.aspx?EventID=1557975&_AccountNumber=2770
I know all but one spot. I think there were more spots than this.
From first to last:
Wide road shot: between 5-6 (closer to 6 is my guess)
Bridge shot: right after mile 7
Paved path: not sure
Sam, what are your feeling about the relay theory? So many people going in and out at certain points it'd be hard to discern if someone was just stepping on/off because of the relay. Was there really congestion at the relay check-points? Also, with the relay, how does the race not have multiple mats? Must have gone old-school with their relay splits.
I disagree. I would say it is quite useful.
If those numbers are added to Rojo's spreadsheet and people take on the task of researching all of those bib numbers you could find that:
a.) photos are found in the lost & found, or
b.) runners with those bib numbers have been seen in the back ground of "x" number of photos
then that would be pretty damning evidence that every single runner in the race could be found in more than one photo with the exception of this alleged cheater.
FWIW maybe this map on the marathon's site could help.
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?msa=0&mid=zKqjMzsZw3nQ.k4svOuGMsFdk
Tried my best using it in tandem with Google street view but I couldn't triangulate where the "paved path" photo was snapped.
Nice idea Rojo, but wrong approach. You can't use absolute differences. You must use percentage of difference. 40s to a pro is a lot more than 40s to a chump.
Look up bib 1199 here
http://www.racephotonetwork.com/QPPlus/SearchBibNumber.aspx?EventID=1557975&_AccountNumber=2770
Photo 5-474 is taken at MLK and Lehigh Street, around the 10K mark
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.59773,-75.466926,3a,75y,255.85h,74.24t/data=
!3m4!1e1!3m2!1symoMXuqJJbQa2XEaWbuWwg!2e0!6m1!1e1
And photo 11-1037 is taken on Hamilton Street, crossing the Lehigh River, around mile 7
!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sEHsS_RALIzvlynaolGGzkg!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x89c43a52c2130d25:0x1924cd6302f1225d!6m1!1e1
For the next 18 months I have run well over a thousand miles, but I have also learned that running is only part of preparing to run a marathon.
So he was also doping.
MarathonMind wrote:
OK, of all the incriminating circumstantial evidence presented so far, this stands out to me as the most incriminating:
On his blog he reports that he only ran "well over a thousand miles in 18 months" and "increased" his mileage to an average of 50 per week in preparation for BostonBecause it is fairly well established that to run your optimum marathon you need to run at least 60 (preferably 70) mpw, then one can safely say that only reaching "an average of 50" will NOT allow you to run the race of your life in an extreme outlier of a performance. Especially for someone who is 47 and has only been running for 3-4 years, and has not had a single previous comparable performance as the marathon in question. There is just no way that happens unless you are an undiscovered rare talent, and there is absolutely no evidence for that being the case with Mr. Rossi of Rydal.
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury....
His performance looks very fishy, but I think part of your argument is off base. If you've been running 20-30 miles per week and worked up to averaging 50 you could very well have "the race of your life". It may not be your optimum performance, but it very well could feel like it to you. Any runner is going to see improvement relative to their training. If you've never trained at what is a true optimum level, you're not going to know your ultimate potential. That doesn't mean you couldn't see significant improvement. You probably would. I'm not saying I think he ran 3:11 (my guess is he didn't), but I don't follow half of your argument.
He ran the Philly half two weeks after Lehigh Valley, He jogs it out for a 2:20. Rossi is not recorded by the mi 10 timing mat:
http://running.competitor.com/cgiresults?eId=4&eiId=215&seId=709&pId=147903
The course goes out and back on the banks of the Schuylkill. Before mile 7, there is a bridge that crosses the river and spits you out just after mile 10. He also ran a PR in the 5k on the same day. I assume that it is possible to do both races.
captain sparrow wrote:
justAnumbersGUY wrote:For fun, I wrote a script to go through the photo website and find any other participants who were only photographed at the finish line, or not at all. Here's a list of bib numbers.
I'm not trying to be a jerk, but with all the posts already in the thread that point out runners who only had pics in the lost and found of the webpage...unless you do some more research, your information is fairly useless.
Actually he posted some really useful information. Now we just need to find these people in the lost & found - I know #1444, the top runner on that list, has already been found. If we could show that he's the only runner out of 1000+ not photographed on the course it would be pretty damning.
Stinky McCheesefart wrote:
runner felice wrote:http://www.phillymag.com/news/2015/05/05/did-boston-marathon-dad-mike-rossi-cheat/OMG he's gonna sue us!
I'm done. I don't want to get sued.
crunchthenumbers wrote:
Actually he posted some really useful information. Now we just need to find these people in the lost & found - I know #1444, the top runner on that list, has already been found. If we could show that he's the only runner out of 1000+ not photographed on the course it would be pretty damning.
I agree with you guys, and take one for being lazy and also not thinking!
So our smoking gun is going to be that he is the only one who is not photographed anywhere?! I actually like it...
ilanarama wrote:
I decided to take the challenge of looking for other results and started with Siobhan O'Connor, who finished just behind Rossi.
Interestingly (to me) her races also don't support a 3:12 finish time, though she doesn't have any 2014 races, so perhaps she just got really good really quickly. I see a 1:14:49 10M (7:28 pace) in November 2012, a 3:49:54 Philadelphia Marathon a week later, and a 3:54:46 finish at the Philadelphia Marathon in November 2013.
Were there photographs of her (bib 1997) on the course?
Yes, there are photos or her on the course. 3 other times + the finish.
Plus while there are two people with that name, people are saying they've run:
1:29:49 3:20:47
Valley Spotter wrote:
Look up bib 1199 here
http://www.racephotonetwork.com/QPPlus/SearchBibNumber.aspx?EventID=1557975&_AccountNumber=2770Photo 5-474 is taken at MLK and Lehigh Street, around the 10K mark
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.59773,-75.466926,3a,75y,255.85h,74.24t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1symoMXuqJJbQa2XEaWbuWwg!2e0!6m1!1e1
And photo 11-1037 is taken on Hamilton Street, crossing the Lehigh River, around mile 7
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Lehigh+St,+Allentown,+PA/@40.606366,-75.45418,3a,75y,288.15h,71.34t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sEHsS_RALIzvlynaolGGzkg!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x89c43a52c2130d25:0x1924cd6302f1225d!6m1!1e1
I was close then. I think the last one is at mile 22 before the last relay point, although it could be right after too. The paved section before that doesn't have grass and the last two miles of the course you can see the river.
Where does this go now that at least a few "news outlets" are picking up on it and USATF has been asked to investigate?
Nowhere good for Mike.
1) Unless he provides real proof that he ran, he will go down in history as a cheat. He can tell his little kids today that he ran and everyone is wrong but they will grow up and the online record will remain. Some day they will look at all of this and won't like what they find.
2) People who ran Lehigh will get wind of this and will start to review their own photos. There very well could be a smoking gun found as the number of photos under review grows. Someone could have a photo of someone finishing a relay leg and he could be in the background (not running a marathon). Mike should be very nervous about that.
3) Nobody will get sued. (I love people who mistake slander and libel, by the way). A defamation suit would be a parade of evidence that he didn't run. Imagine a jury going through all the photos that he isn't in and hearing from experts about race pacing and so forth. Not going to happen.
4) Other media outlets will pick up on the story over the next few days. Once a few crack the seal, others pile on.
What ugliness did I miss?
Precious Roy wrote:
He ran the Philly half two weeks after Lehigh Valley, He jogs it out for a 2:20. Rossi is not recorded by the mi 10 timing mat:
http://running.competitor.com/cgiresults?eId=4&eiId=215&seId=709&pId=147903The course goes out and back on the banks of the Schuylkill. Before mile 7, there is a bridge that crosses the river and spits you out just after mile 10. He also ran a PR in the 5k on the same day. I assume that it is possible to do both races.
oh, this looks suspicious, too.
0-5k at 8:01/mi pace
5k-10k at 15:40/mi pace (AKA he is blowing up big time)
10k-Finish at 9:43/mi pace (some how un-blows up)
weird.