Did Mike Rossi (viral marathon dad) cheat his way into Boston?

Greg Sanders wrote:

I can easily believe that Mike Rossi was capable of such a result. Nearly all of his other races were either trained through, or treated as workouts with things like mile on, 400 off built into them. On many of his training runs he produces efforts superior to his races. I can personally attest that although the publicity from the letter was a bit overblown, Mike Rossi is a upstanding guy. You have only circumstantial evidence, and there are other people who missed their photos also in the race. When all of the right things come together on the right day, incredible breakthroughs can happen. As for the supposed "impossibility" of the impressive feat due to his physique, take a look at Sri Chinmoy who lifted thousands of pounds without looking hardly capable of it.

Looks like Mike chimed in, again.

teamdoc wrote:

Not even close. Just a guy who loves kids and hates watching a feeding frenzy. Have another look at what I wrote. I think he's has received his due and that what we're seeing now from you is just as ugly as cheating for a BQ, uglier for being hidden behind anonymity, and just kind of gross.

I'm with you in not thinking his life needs to be ruined, and definitely not have his kids affected.

The big issues are justice and integrity, of course, and general lessons for races and runners.

But also, part of the challenge is solving the mystery and seeing if our human intuition matches reality. People don't like to be 'duped.' So when a running performance doesn't jive with our own deep experiences; and when people act in a way that doesn't match our expectations for a situation; we at least want to find out if we are right. And we want to learn more about what makes other people 'tick' so we can hone our ability to detect and promote honesty. We also, as a social group, don't like vocal boastfulness and hubris. None of this would have happened if he had downplayed his actions in the first place.

We're still figuring out what people *should* do in these very-public, viral situations. It moves quickly, but it still seems like an immediate, sincere apology still works best.

So, if we're right and he humbly confesses, I'm all for moving on quickly as well. I don't think he should lose his job or his family should have to deal with it, and definitely there shouldn't be any threats or harassment.

Running Vermont in a few weeks. Going to need a pickup at about mile 10, drop off at mile 23. Any takers?

I see a day not so distant in the future when our timing chips will have GPS on them. That will settle this debate for good.

Too many stories recently about people cheating in marathons. Even in my training group one guy ran with his wife's friends' bib so she could race Boston with her 4:45 marathon time. Drives me nuts. Boston is a privilege for those that work hard, don't be a jerk. Facts clearly prove is BQ was a joke.

nice that the shuttles go to both the marathon start and half marathon start,

so you just cross the marathon start, drive to the half marathon walk along and watch and cheer for some then hop in and do a 10-12 mile run to the finish

would seem hard to know when you should be jumping in though, assuming goal is BQ and you want to be sure you want to beat BQ by # minutes to be first in line for entry

534 wrote:

I would add that by his own description his training was insufficient to support the kind of improvement necessary to go from 3:40 to 3:11. On his blog he reports that he only ran "well over a thousand miles in 18 months" and "increased" his mileage to an average of 50 per week in preparation for Boston. Generously that translates to less than 100 miles per month over 18 months

I have been training hard for the last several months and I feel pretty good about where I am in the process. I've been able to increase my mileage (50 miles per week average), and I've been focussing on hills in preparation for the challenge of Boston.

For the next 18 months I have run well over a thousand miles, but I have also learned that running is only part of preparing to run a marathon.

and the most important part about this is that these increases were for Boston. Where he ran nowhere close to 3:11. Meaning he did less to prepare for his 3:11.....

StolenBoston wrote:

I'd like to modify the list, with the observation that someone wanting to BQ for the first time, in which it requires a massive PR *even at a 10k distance* within the race, would more likely run a pace to guarantee the BQ with some buffer, but nowhere near the gamble that he took. Since he only needed 3:33 (3:35, minus ~2 minutes buffer), you wouldn't expect anyone in that position to aim for anything much below ~3:25.

If he's 47, he needed 3:25, not 3:35, no? But I agree with what you are saying.

Greg Sanders wrote:

I can easily believe that Mike Rossi was capable of such a result. Nearly all of his other races were either trained through, or treated as workouts with things like mile on, 400 off built into them. On many of his training runs he produces efforts superior to his races. I can personally attest that although the publicity from the letter was a bit overblown, Mike Rossi is a upstanding guy. You have only circumstantial evidence, and there are other people who missed their photos also in the race. When all of the right things come together on the right day, incredible breakthroughs can happen. As for the supposed "impossibility" of the impressive feat due to his physique, take a look at Sri Chinmoy who lifted thousands of pounds without looking hardly capable of it.

Sure, an outstanding guy who wrote a scathing letter to his kids principal and even after she came under unfair attack continued to promote his own letter on all forms of social media. Did you see how many times he promoted it on twitter? He shared his own letter at least 8 times. Attention Seeker EVEN when he knew others were getting hurt by his actions.

Greg Sanders wrote:

You have only circumstantial evidence, and there are other people who missed their photos also in the race. When all of the right things come together on the right day, incredible breakthroughs can happen.

Not buying it.

I was in the same race and dropped out after mile 20, and for some reason I have more photos up on the website than he does.

teamdoc wrote:

Not even close. Just a guy who loves kids and hates watching a feeding frenzy. Have another look at what I wrote. I think he's has received his due and that what we're seeing now from you is just as ugly as cheating for a BQ, uglier for being hidden behind anonymity, and just kind of gross.

When he admits that he cheated, then I'm sure people will slow down. You can love kids and still question and pile on a cheater. That spot he stole from someone else, when will they be getting their due?

Anonymity? Really? Are you new to this place? And is teamdoc your real name?

Can you highlight one person from his BQ marathon who only has finish line photos? Thank you in advance of your response.

Greg Sanders wrote:

I can easily believe that Mike Rossi was capable of such a result. Nearly all of his other races were either trained through, or treated as workouts with things like mile on, 400 off built into them. On many of his training runs he produces efforts superior to his races. I can personally attest that although the publicity from the letter was a bit overblown, Mike Rossi is a upstanding guy. You have only circumstantial evidence, and there are other people who missed their photos also in the race. When all of the right things come together on the right day, incredible breakthroughs can happen. As for the supposed "impossibility" of the impressive feat due to his physique, take a look at Sri Chinmoy who lifted thousands of pounds without looking hardly capable of it.

Ev man wrote:

You're the one with the stone-thrower's hard-on here.

you we're so excited to be on top of the pack bringing this guy down, so excited about finding a new way to make him look bad, you didn't give a Fock about who else got damaged along the way. Even little kids.

Asshat.

Really? How did a photo from google cache posted in this thread hurt his daughter? Please explain. I have two wonderful children of my own, somehow I fail to see how I scarred this one for life. Sometimes the truth, such as children having no rights, seems harsh and inconvenient. It doesn't stop it from being a fact.

All I did was sent a Tweet to every journalist who published the original story requesting them to do a follow up and due diligence, which is the least to be expected, and sent an e-mail to the RD of the Via Marathon. I still fail to see any of these actions being equivalent of burning this guy at the stake. There were far worse suggestions, actions, comments by others. But "oh the children!" Please!

Greg Sanders wrote:

I can easily believe that Mike Rossi was capable of such a result....take a look at Sri Chinmoy who lifted thousands of pounds without looking hardly capable of it.

9/10

You had me going until the Sri Chimnoy reference. LOL.

So you train with him and have watched his workouts?

Can you tell him we'd like to see the Garmin evidence?

It's like Kip Litton all over again. Sock puppets everywhere!

I did the 30 prior and 30 post finishers of Rossi. The 60 total had an average of 12.35 photos taken each.

To the guy who keeps saying "This thread is on page 1 on Google" or "This thread is the top Google search result", do you not realize that Google personalizes your search results based on your browsing history? I typed in his name in Google and this thread is still on page 2. Try to do a search incognito and see what happens.

low gistics wrote:

would seem hard to know when you should be jumping in though, assuming goal is BQ and you want to be sure you want to beat BQ by # minutes to be first in line for entry

But that's exactly where he screwed up - He only needed sub-3:25 to qualify, which would have been somewhat plausible. He registered 3:11 instead which is completely and utterly implausible.

The point being that he couldn't even run a 3:25 or 3:33... his real marathon PB being about 4 hours and all.I think if he concedes he cheated than we will have nothing left to talk about. This or addressing the accusations would end this thread. for someone who did not cheat and seems to love to be heard addressing these would be easy.

gatorade&vodka wrote:

StolenBoston wrote:

I'd like to modify the list, with the observation that someone wanting to BQ for the first time, in which it requires a massive PR *even at a 10k distance* within the race, would more likely run a pace to guarantee the BQ with some buffer, but nowhere near the gamble that he took. Since he only needed 3:33 (3:35, minus ~2 minutes buffer), you wouldn't expect anyone in that position to aim for anything much below ~3:25.

If he's 47, he needed 3:25, not 3:35, no? But I agree with what you are saying.

gatorade&vodka wrote:

StolenBoston wrote:

I'd like to modify the list, with the observation that someone wanting to BQ for the first time, in which it requires a massive PR *even at a 10k distance* within the race, would more likely run a pace to guarantee the BQ with some buffer, but nowhere near the gamble that he took. Since he only needed 3:33 (3:35, minus ~2 minutes buffer), you wouldn't expect anyone in that position to aim for anything much below ~3:25.

If he's 47, he needed 3:25, not 3:35, no? But I agree with what you are saying.

Yes, you're right, 3:25.