Jakob 3:30!!

SDSU Aztec wrote:

big dave22 wrote:

Boss race. Legit world junior record (lulz at the boy wonder Kwemoi who can't even finish a race anymore).

In another thread people were claiming that Kipchoge lied about his age by at least 6 years. I pointed out that someone with Kipchoge's natural ability would likely to have been world class at 18 so why would he want to shut down his career for 6 years. The answer was that it was impossible for an 18-year old to break 13:00.

So now we have an 18-year old running 3:30 and there are no age cheat accusations. Is it because Kipchoge is from a "sh*t-hole" country?

Kipchoge , in 2003, beat Kenenisa Bekele and Hicham El Guerrouj in the World Championships 5000m.

Unless you really believe that an 18 year old beat both Bekele and El Guerrouj in their primes, Kipchoge is most definitely several years older than his stated age. Which, honestly, is not a bad thing. It means that he's dominating the marathon in his late 30s.

If you re training for long distance race , your htc and hemoglobin will go down and also some hormones.

It can go down to 41% and 11%, while when you didnt train you was like 45% and 14%.

Now 1 point increase in Hemoglobin % could make you gain about 30-40 seconds in 5 k race ( Jack Daniels book).

So imagine this you have done 3 months of hard training , your body is eating itself , fat, muscles, blood cells, everything

go down, Yes of course this is an adaptation of training but is also caused because in the process of hard training

you take your body to the limit. Now with Epo if you take your Hemoglobin from 11% to 15% ,that is a normal value

but not your genetical value after months of hard training. You are going to create a totally new artificial condition for your body that help you to do a GIANT jump in your performance, but is totally artificial and unatural , you have changed your phisiology artificially. If one point increase in hemoglobin content help you with 30" in 5K, what about 4 %points?

This improvment maybe is not at an elite level but sure can happen at an amateur level.

I m an amateur runner and with training my htc is low about 41%. When I' m not training it goes up.

and is not easy to run when your htc is low.Cos especially in the hot summer your energy is very low.

In the past I ve been low as 38% and I had no energy no speed oxygen was not enough for my muscles , I could run for hours but no speed. After months of good diet and iron supplement htc went up to 45% and hemoglobin to 14%. It was like come to life again, I had power and I was fast again.

It was incredible to see Tim and Jakob run so quickly. I expected Jakob to dip under 3:30 in Monaco this year, but now the world junior record of 3:28.81 doesn't seem out of reach. Tim will likely run comfortably under 3:28.

Is like : after 3, 4 months of hard training with Epo you are going to eliminate all the negative effect of training and you have all the benefit of a 3 months of training (iNTERVAL , LACTIC THRESHOLD, LONG RUNS, REPETITIONS)but YOUR BODY thanks to epo is (FROM A BLOOD RED CELLS POINT OF VIEW)

IN A NEW AND RESTED CONDITION LIKE YOU WERE AT THE BEGINNING OF TRAINING 3 OR 4 MONTHS AGO.

Of course all this is nothing but ARTIFICIAL.

Monaco can't come soon enough wrote:

It was incredible to see Tim and Jakob run so quickly. I expected Jakob to dip under 3:30 in Monaco this year, but now the world junior record of 3:28.81 doesn't seem out of reach. Tim will likely run comfortably under 3:28.

Monaco will be slow. Tim isn’t running and it isn’t a DL event.

Coevett wrote:

well,, wrote:

Absolute nonsense. The biggest sport, by far, in Kenya is soccer. Running is a sport practised by a number of tribes on the Kenyan highland.

You have any actual statistics to demonstrate that?

Every Kenyan schoolboy might dream of being the next Lionel Messi, but the fact is the odds of that happening are millions to one, whereas every Kenyan schoolboy and his teacher knows the odds of making a decent living from running are quite good, especially with a bit of Italian assistance.

Kenyan soccer matches draw pitiful attendances. The attendance at the Junior championships in Kenya last year set a new world record.

Some of you have an almost fanatical need to believe in genetic supremacy of black men. Being called a racist by you guys is similar to an average Joe being called a fat sexual predator by Harvey Weinstein.

Historically, nearly all of Kenya's distance runners are Kalenjin.

Let me get a few things out before you start getting angry about the "genetic supremacy" of black men.

1) It is very likely that Kenyans and Ethiopians ARE superior distance runners. The actual benefits may be from genetics, living conditions, motivation, environment, whatever, but even without drugs, they likely ARE better. Honestly, just look at the EPO Era. Do you really believe that only Africans drugged up when EPO was undetectable?

2) It is also very likely that Kenyans and Ethiopians dope rampantly. Incidentally though, that doesn't really matter, given that the rest of the world does too.

3) Just like how everyone is very aware that Africans of various descents dominate athletics, we can all freely acknowledge that they are very lacking in many other respects. For one, look at Medical School Acceptance statistics:

Black students accepted and matriculating into medical school are, putting it very bluntly, inferior in all objective measures compared to Asians, Whites, and Latinos. They quite literally have lower standards of acceptance. Keep in mind, this is AFTER Affirmative Action has occurred, so they have had four years at the same high level institutions (which are universally acknowledged as being very liberal and "safe space" environments) as all other races.

Even if you take the SJW side and whine incessantly about how these "objective measures" inherently favor whites, you still need to account for the fact that collectively, Latinos (who are also an underrepresented minority) outperform them in almost every category. Even then, Latinos are admitted at a lower rate compared to blacks.

I am going to be very blunt here. I take a view that is widely acknowledged as "racist". I do not know the exact cause (whether genetics, economic status, upbringing, culture, etc.), but individuals of African descent DO overperform in athletics, and underperform academically. It makes no sense to me that people cannot acknowledge what is right in front of them. It's like trying to say that women are not athletically inferior to men, while watching a women's professional basketball team being dominated by a boy's high school team.

I doubt you would have problems acknowledging the fact that African Americans are disproportionately favored in academic admissions. Why do you have issues acknowledging the fact that East Africans are exceptionally good at distance running?

HOOWIE wrote:

What are the chances the yung Jakob's on the spicy marinara?

Considering he's been tested more in the last 4 months than Cheruiyot has in the last three years the answer is likely zero. Cheruiyot? Given what we're finding out about the E. Africans his odds are at 95% si, only 5% no.

LDoc wrote:

mooonshot wrote:

you guys are up to date on the science, right? Hematocrit of 53 means nothing. Geb had a HCT of 42-44 and still ran world class times.

I had a hematocrit of 52 as a 400m hurdler. I couldn't break 30 mins for 10k with a skateboard.

Stop answering your own posts, your own lies, with lies. You never had a hematocrit level that high.

Geb and crew fastidiously avoided avoided any kind of testing once they hit big time EPO use.

Geb was one of the best responders to EPO, besides using higher doses than the E. African cheats of today. 95% of the top E. Africans are doped. No one has run sub 12:50 clean, yet. No one has run sub 26:40 clean, yet. No one has run sub 3:27 clean, yet.

Seyta wrote:

I am going to be very blunt here. I take a view that is widely acknowledged as "racist". I do not know the exact cause (whether genetics, economic status, upbringing, culture, etc.), but individuals of African descent DO overperform in athletics, and underperform academically. It makes no sense to me that people cannot acknowledge what is right in front of them. It's like trying to say that women are not athletically inferior to men, while watching a women's professional basketball team being dominated by a boy's high school team.

I doubt you would have problems acknowledging the fact that African Americans are disproportionately favored in academic admissions. Why do you have issues acknowledging the fact that East Africans are exceptionally good at distance running?

You're really trying to have a serious discussion with Coevett? Ummmm, maybe you re-think this idea? But still... GOOD LUCK!

Jose Jimenez astronaut wrote:

HOOWIE wrote:

What are the chances the yung Jakob's on the spicy marinara?

Considering he's been tested more in the last 4 months than Cheruiyot has in the last three years the answer is likely zero. Cheruiyot? Given what we're finding out about the E. Africans his odds are at 95% si, only 5% no.

Testing means little. The likely number of those doping is known to be vastly more than those caught. "Only the dumb or the careless get caught" - Richard Pound, former head of WADA.

No says the E. Africans aren't talented you idiot. However, what we've seen for 30 years is totally artificial. The Kenyans would produce runners on par, and once in a while a bit better, than their worldwide competition. Once EPO hit the usual suspects stepped in, and the E. Africans pulled away from everyone.

The E. Africans have a higher percentage of talented people, and likely a narrower bell curve of performance as well - unless drugs are introduced, which is exactly what's happened. There is literally zero doubt.

The fact that the race card is pulled so often is proof that those of your ilk are running out of lies to hide behind. If true, equal testing is ever implemented - and if the sport hasn't totally been destroyed by then - the super-dominance of the E. Africans will dissipate, with them likely having four or five top 10 to top 20 runners 1500 - 5k, with higher percentages in the 10k and marathon.

You try to scare everyone off by inferring that anyone questioning what we see these days is racist. You're the racist. You're likely the one of the usual usual hasbro-rat or h-house trolls, and those of us who are aware know what you're up to.

Allowing the E. Africans to cheat is as much about social conditioning of targeted populations, meaning the West, as it is about being "PC". One day a lot of people rolling their eyes will be forced to wake up.

got my cup of coffee, got my 30 minutes to relax and check out sports chess and whatnot.

see a wonderful meet and awesome results. and this thread like so many others is a downer.

on this thread, it's nothing but loosers talking about everything but something positive.

ya he ran 330 but he's 0.1 seconds slower than his brother, anything and everything except a positive.

contrast that with the chess champs, where players post and it's informative and good, plus a few haters.

not like here, where 90% are negative people that really should oft themselves. and email the location of the grave so i can piss on it, if i'm in the area.

really folks. you need to go the way of the dinosaur.

brojoes, time to do something, this is a waste of time and not entertaining.

douglas burke wrote:

trollism wrote:

Kenya has a long history of blatant age cheating.

Norway doesn't.

Do you understand?

Kenya Is THEE Dominant Nation in the Middle-long Distance, What has Norway Done in Distance running besides Waitz and Kristiansen and 800 runner Rodal and now the Ingebrightsens? I mean HIGH WORLD CLASS? they have had a few other good runners, Svenoy 8:12 steepler, Bakken 13:06 for 5000, Douglas-1:43.6 for 800 runner

Kenya population - 50 million, most popular sport long distance running

Norway population 5 million, most popular sport skiing

Norway also producing a high number of brainy people and Nobel peace prize winners.

ScandisRTheBest wrote:

Kenya population - 50 million, most popular sport long distance running

Norway population 5 million, most popular sport skiing

Norway also producing a high number of brainy people and Nobel peace prize winners.

And what's your point?

Misleading. Yes your hemoglobin and hematocrit drop when you start training, but that is not because you lose any red blood cells, but because your blood volume expands earlier than more than your hemoglobin/hematocrit reponds. You lose absolutely no oxygen carrying capacity because of this, your blood just get slightly diluted. Total hemoglobin mass stays the same (/increases slowly over time) but the concentration drops. Blood volume expansion is a quick and beneficial adaptation that increases your stroke volume, thus helps performance. You can't tell anything about someone's O2 carrying capacity just by looking at % - you have to know the absolute mass of red blood cells / Hb they have.

2nd place!!!!! GOAT!!!!! White guy runner!!!!! Clearly the only clean one out there!!!!! Non-doped world record!!!!!

douglas burke wrote:

Semiler wrote:

Sondre Nordstad Moen

Good Call, I know him, but was not thinking, Thank You 59:48 and 2:05.48 is indeed World Class

Marius Bakken, 7:40/13:06. Not high world class, but world class for sure. If he was an American, he would have been the dominant 5000m runner from 2000-2005 fwiw.

longjack wrote:

got my cup of coffee, got my 30 minutes to relax and check out sports chess and whatnot.

see a wonderful meet and awesome results. and this thread like so many others is a downer.

on this thread, it's nothing but loosers talking about everything but something positive.(...)

+1

If he ran through the line and leaned he would have been sub 3:30