Did Mike Rossi (viral marathon dad) cheat his way into Boston?

Why wait when this Rosie Rossi approved racing plan is so much more effective?http://www.turtlesagainstcancer.com/wp-content/gallery/boston-marathon-2012/9-2-Shortcut.PNG(btw I agree w/ your assessment)

Mr.Owl says Mike who? wrote:

...The sad thing is your legit marathon at Philly (3:43) if really run off of 15 mpw suggests that if you put in a couple of years of solid mileage and worked on your times at shorter distances, you probably could've gotten a legit BQ....probably not 3:11 but a BQ none the less. It might have taken 2-3 years but it could've happened without cheating.

Something substantive to add wrote:

Rossi cheat wrote:

Barb McKeever is the race director for Lehigh, not Mr. yasso. That was incorrectly included in at least one of the articles

That's correct, Gerry Yasso is not the RD, he's the VP of Resource Development for Via of the Lehigh Valley. So essentially he's a bigwig with the title sponsor of the marathon.

I wonder what other things the kooky witch hunters have gotten wrong during the course of this selfish and hateful riot.

Rossi cheat wrote:

Just an update. I emailed the Lehigh race director yesterday, and she said that they anticipate wrapping up the investigation by the end of May. Sounds like they are taking it more seriously now and not just passing it off to USATF. I do wonder if they have all the evidence spreadsheets from LetsRun, SaraB etc

excerpt...."we are in the process of interviewing more than 100 runners, including Mr. Rossi. A five-person panel of community leaders who are also marathon runners will review the evidence and make a recommendation on what action the race committee should take. We expect to conclude the review by the end of May."

[

so the Race director has delegated her "discretion" to a panel of 5 marathon community leaders

CON MR:

1. athlinks PRs inconsistent with progression to 3:11

2. lack of photos inconsistent with 3:11

3. social media behavior inconsistent with BQ achievement (shoulda touted)

PRO MR:

1. appears in finish photo and video

2. can argue his personality etc. is irrelevant to decision

3. can argue should be a high standard to DQ a finisher almost 8 months after the fact (e.g. hey I would have saved data from my GPS etc.)

4. 8 months after fact, other runners are not going to be able to say with certainty they did or did not see him, but only do not remember seeing him

at the end of the day, I think they are going to say an investigation 8 months after the fact will not result in a DQ unless clear and convincing evidence of cheating is available

so it will all boil down to: is the lack of appearance in photos clear and convincing evidence for the 5 person panel?

I think he walks

if I was voting on MR by now I am biased so I would vote guilty, if I was voting in the abstract I would think 3:11 v. 3:45 seems unlikely but really who cares? And I would vote not guilty mostly because it is 8 months after the fact. Kinda like retesting an "A" sample 2 years after a "B" sample is destroyed, clearly shows a problem but the individual's right to a fair hearing is so compromised after the passage of time.

So I guess I vote yes on shame and no on DQ.

I no longer care.

If he does get a DQ and a Boston DQ, he'll simply play the persecuted victim card for the rest of his life, while wearing his Boston Marathon hat, jacket and shirt.

I've already got what I wanted out of this: RDs taking cheating more seriously (complete with more race mats) and the general running public having a greater fear of being outed and humiliated for cheating.

I don't think, as distasteful as his media behavior may be, that that should have anything to do with it whether he is DQ'd or not. That is subjective, although I think his media behavior is in poor taste and that he should be DQ'd (unless there is some strong exculpatory evidence we do not yet have), that is besides the issue.

I think the strongest evidence against him is the lack of even one photo of him along the race course, excluding the start and finish lines. If the photographer(s) can say that they captured pictures of every racer along the course, which appears to the case, then I and any reasonable person, short of some other explanation or eveidence for lack of one single photo of him on the course, then that in and of itself is grounds for DQ. His race time when analyzed against all his other race/training times, the conditions during the race, and even his lack of posting about this race in contrast to all his other races only helps to add more circumstantial support for a DQ.

The panel also will likely or should consider the integrity of the race and that it is used as a qualifying race for the Boston Marathon. His only arguments that would be compelling enough is that he provides some sort of GPS data from his watch and/or photographs taken of him somewhere on the course. Short of that, it is very likely that he will be DQ'd.

Part of what makes this thread so interesting is the fact that is obvious he didn't run it, and he is putting up such a big fight in trying to deny it. Those who do not run, who are probably a majority of his social circle, were probably fooled by it. It is becoming an epic back and forth which will obviously end poorly for MR, whether he is DQ'ed or not (he will be).

There is also part of me that is empathetic towards him, not in terms of this race, but for his mental state and his family. He can continue to dig himself into a huge hole and his reputation will be forever damaged. Seeing that the RD has indicated it will take another week, this gives MR an opportunity to turn things around for himself personally.

He needs to just come clean. Say what he did, how he did it, apologize and offer some kind of action that can somehow turn it into a positive. If he does that, he will stem the tide of negative publicity and maybe help him and his conscience. If he continues do deny and attempts to play the victim card while lashing out in anger, his world will feel very small. People are forgiving, but one must ask for forgiveness first to receive it The key is he must do it before he is DQ'ed, if he waits, it will lose any sincerity and will be viewed as a result being caught, not admission.

Do the right thing, Mike. You can still make this a positive outcome.

what should be the reasonable cut off for how long back one can go conduct a hearing on these types of allegations? Like a year? Does seem like at some point it gets past the realm of fairness to anyone. I'd say a year. Yup that's it a year.

not Lance Armstrong wrote:

what should be the reasonable cut off for how long back one can go conduct a hearing on these types of allegations? Like a year? Does seem like at some point it gets past the realm of fairness to anyone. I'd say a year. Yup that's it a year.

Fairness?

Someone is changing a checkbox on a computer record somewhere to indicate whether or not he completed a race that no one is going to look at other than Mike himself.

This isn't jail time, getting fired from a job, or a scarlet letter that is tattooed on someone's neck for the rest of their life.

Mike likely received a communication simply stating the allegations that were brought against him with a list of evidence given to the RD.

He would then likely be asked to respond to the individual items with any evidence or proof to refute any part or all of the claims against him.

Here is where I disagree completely with you. If he is ever given even a small piece of rope he has proven he knows how to use it. Given this large rope I'm sure he over explained and babbled to the point where he hurt his case beyond repair. It's all about Mike , always has been always will be.

NotABQer wrote:

He needs to just come clean. Say what he did, how he did it, apologize and offer some kind of action that can somehow turn it into a positive. If he does that, he will stem the tide of negative publicity and maybe help him and his conscience. If he continues do deny and attempts to play the victim card while lashing out in anger, his world will feel very small. People are forgiving, but one must ask for forgiveness first to receive it The key is he must do it before he is DQ'ed, if he waits, it will lose any sincerity and will be viewed as a result being caught, not admission.

Do the right thing, Mike. You can still make this a positive outcome.

My advice to him would be the opposite: just shut up and say nothing.

Anything he says now is just adding fuel to the fire.

If he admits that he cheated, he will have to explain why. Any explanation will come off sounding self-serving and douchy.

His best possible outcome would be to get a DQ (which will satisfy a lot of his opponents), and issue the world's shortest statement indicating that although he does not agree with the ruling, he accepts it.

And then shut up on the subject of running for the next 10 years.

He'll be a punchline for jokes in the running community for years, but people who don't run marathons have no idea who this guy is.

not Lance Armstrong wrote:

what should be the reasonable cut off for how long back one can go conduct a hearing on these types of allegations? Like a year? Does seem like at some point it gets past the realm of fairness to anyone. I'd say a year. Yup that's it a year.

I am not sure, but while this doesn't rise to the level of the Olympics (which just stripped yesterday a relay team of their gold medal from the 2012 Olympics) or of that of professional bike racing (Lance Armstrong), I do not think that perhaps a year is unreasonable. Cheating is cheating and time does not diminish the offense.

Let's be honest, I do not think this is going to start some sort of trend of pouring over the results of every race run. Moreover, if you are talking about some 5k, 10k or half a marathon, it is likely not to get any attention unless someone who won the race is called into question. However, since this race is used as a means to qualify for the Boston Marathon, I certainly think a year is reasonable both for the integrity of the race in question and the Boston Marathon.

What I've noticed on my social media feeds is that his open letter to the principal has become, like too much else in America, a lightning rod for politics - every rightwinger on my fb feed, for example, has posted positively about his letter. Especially the culture warriors. That entire group believes they are the most oppressed people in America. If MR gets DQ'd it's going to fit right into that narrative. I doubt that MR is that smart, but, he couldn't have planned this any better than what's about to happen. Before this is done, he'll have his own show on Fox and be pulling down six figure speaking fees.

Off topic, but just wanted to say that the lady suspected of cheating in another race has been discussed in a different group and someone who ran in the same race has reported her to the RD. She would have had to run past them and didn't plus there's other evidence. So if nothing else, this thread has served to find another possible cheat.

Has anyone mentioned how reedonkulous it was that he listed "culinary arts" as a topic that his kids "learned more about in a week than in a lifetime at school"?

Culinary arts? Seriously? I don't want my kids learning that at school at the expense of academic subjects. I want them to learn math, english, science, foreign language, etc, etc.

Rossi cheat wrote:

Just an update. I emailed the Lehigh race director yesterday, and she said that they anticipate wrapping up the investigation by the end of May. Sounds like they are taking it more seriously now and not just passing it off to USATF. I do wonder if they have all the evidence spreadsheets from LetsRun, SaraB etc

excerpt...."we are in the process of interviewing more than 100 runners, including Mr. Rossi. A five-person panel of community leaders who are also marathon runners will review the evidence and make a recommendation on what action the race committee should take. We expect to conclude the review by the end of May."

That's a step in the right direction, but still indecisive by the race director. There is no need to interview 100+ people, or assemble a panel of community leaders. It's the same beating around the bush as asking USATF to do it for them. Again, contrast this with other marathons actions against cheaters.

This thread is dying a slow death and it is all fading away. Looks like Rossi wins.

crete wrote:

Has anyone mentioned how reedonkulous it was that he listed "culinary arts" as a topic that his kids "learned more about in a week than in a lifetime at school"?

Culinary arts? Seriously? I don't want my kids learning that at school at the expense of academic subjects. I want them to learn math, english, science, foreign language, etc, etc.

That was one of the douchebaggier parts of that very douchebaggy letter. He wants his kids to get academic credit for going to a restaurant? Ya, there lots of valuable things kids can learn outside of school, that doesn't invalidate school learning.

Link wrote:

What I've noticed on my social media feeds is that his open letter to the principal has become, like too much else in America, a lightning rod for politics - every rightwinger on my fb feed, for example, has posted positively about his letter. Especially the culture warriors. That entire group believes they are the most oppressed people in America. If MR gets DQ'd it's going to fit right into that narrative. I doubt that MR is that smart, but, he couldn't have planned this any better than what's about to happen. Before this is done, he'll have his own show on Fox and be pulling down six figure speaking fees.

Yes, and this is just one angle of interest in the story that super-charges the cheating claims. Fact resistant Americans go crazy for his kind of nonsense. It's America 2015, mediocrity, ignoring rules, cheating, former glory, God, Country.

The outcome you describe is possible. There's nothing that can be done about fact resistant Americans. They love to inflict pain on themselves with a religious fervor.