Did Eliud Kipchoge beat the best 5k field ever in 2003 Paris and best marathon field ever in 2015 London?

Yousri wrote:

false and falser wrote:

You can't rank a guy higher than another guy he always loses to.

Really? Why is Federer almost always placed in front of Nadal then even though his record against Nadal is 23-10 in favor of the Spaniard. Please explain!

Yes really. Your argument has nothing to do with what I said. I said "always loses to". 23-10 is quite far from " always". Off the top of my head, Bekele has only lost Kipchoge 2 times on the track and once on the roads?

Furthermore, your usage of "rank" is not the same as what we're talking about. You are talking about yearly rank or ranking during a single tournament. We're talking about career rank.

Even if you were talking about career ranking, you are still wrong. Federer has WON big matches and tournaments. Before today, has Kipchoge actually won anything besides that 2003 race?

Kipchoge won the Chicago and Rotterdam marathons last year.

Kipghoge has turned the tables back in his favor from Bekele...

A long time in coming!!!

Ranking Kipchoge ahead of Bekele hasn't become any less idiotic.

1-2 Punch wrote:

Kipchoge won the Chicago and Rotterdam marathons last year.

Thanks, any other races? Any big wins during track?

Would rather see Kipchoge race Mo Farah in the 10000m at WC's instead of doing the marathon there. A 63 second 400m at the end of a 2:04 marathon is pretty legit- it shows there's still some speed there. I wouldn't be surprised if Kipchoge is in 26:50 shape right now.

false and falser wrote:

1-2 Punch wrote:

Kipchoge won the Chicago and Rotterdam marathons last year.

Thanks, any other races? Any big wins during track?

george oscar bluth wrote:

Ranking Kipchoge ahead of Bekele hasn't become any less idiotic.

That's unkind of you to say, GOB. Bekele is my favorite athlete, and I think it's pretty much consensus to say that he's the greatest track athlete of all time. Kipchoge has an overall better road-racing record. I would rank Kipchoge ahead on one crtiteria -- range, on which I think he's second only to Geb. Tergat in third and then Bekele.

If Bekele runs some 2:04s he moves up.

The best part about Kipchoge is he is not a skeleton.

Kipchoge In a 10000 -We've seen that. I think he is a great runner; one of the greatest. But he tired the 10000 and didn't make the teams or produce a great result. It just goes to show that we should not assume that all of these top marathoners would be 12:40/26:30 types. Kipchoge was not doing that Then he moved up and dominated the marathon. Gebremeskel, Jelian, Muchiri, Tanui, Edris and probably the world XC champ are the best opponents to Farah.

The Waterboy wrote:

Would rather see Kipchoge race Mo Farah in the 10000m at WC's instead of doing the marathon there. A 63 second 400m at the end of a 2:04 marathon is pretty legit- it shows there's still some speed there. I wouldn't be surprised if Kipchoge is in 26:50 shape right now.

You can Google him to find that he's won 2 world athletics final 3000m races, 4 Golden League and 1 Diamond League track races. Add to that San Silvestre and Carlsbad 5000 road races - yes, I know you asked about track races but previously it was asked if he'd won anything.

I personally don't think there is any reason to rank Kipchoge ahead of Bekele as far as lifetime achievements but to pretend that Kipchoge is not one of the all-time greats is silly, particularly given the class of fields he defeated in his two best races. Because of the long-term dominance of Bekele and Haile, some really great runners were not able to get Olympic Golds and win a ton of track races - Kipchoge, Shihine, even Tergat to an extent - but these are guys who were right there in the mix always. Kipchoge has 5 Olympic and World Championship medals. As far as range and longevity, he appears to have surpassed Bekele although that's not completely settled.

Farah and away wrote:

false and falser wrote:

Thanks, any other races? Any big wins during track?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTaMdJVFdhw

Wow, would be nice to see Kipchoge take on Farah this summer...guess the potential money in the WMM is a lot better though.

Bad Wigins wrote:

The best part about Kipchoge is he is not a skeleton.

I thought they had to starve to activate their running prowess?

I'm a huge Kipchoge fan, but the greatest 5000 field ever assembled was the 1997 Zurich GP. Haile Gebrselassie's 12:41 beats Daniel Komen's 12:44, with Paul Tergat in 3rd in 12:49.

What is important is that Kipchoge proves those top guys are in fact sub 13 and sub 27 type talent.

Paris in 2012 saw six men break 12:50.

new talent levels wrote:

What is important is that Kipchoge proves those top guys are in fact sub 13 and sub 27 type talent.

Why is that important?

starved to excellence wrote:

Bad Wigins wrote:

The best part about Kipchoge is he is not a skeleton.

I thought they had to starve to activate their running prowess?

They do, but marathoners have to starve the most. Many of them are undead.

Mr. Obvious wrote:

new talent levels wrote:

What is important is that Kipchoge proves those top guys are in fact sub 13 and sub 27 type talent.

Why is that important?

Because you need that sort of speed to win these tactical 2:04 races. This is the future of marathons.