10k- how to improve

Sorry fo being that guy but am genuinely so keen to improve any little bits of advice would be greatly appreciated, one thing I don’t do is strength or core at all what kind of stuff could I gradually add in?

Two steps to a faster 10k:

1. Mileage

2. Emphasize tempo, progression and fartlek runs as opposed to hard reps on the track.

Sand Dunes wrote:

Two steps to a faster 10k:

1. Mileage

2. Emphasize tempo, progression and fartlek runs as opposed to hard reps on the track.

Really?! Thanks dude for a tempo or either of them what kind of length and pace am I looking at can bang out a 3 mile at around 5;50 but couldn’t imagine a longer tempo?

Notgreat wrote:

Sorry for being that guy but am genuinely so keen to improve any little bits of advice would be greatly appreciated, one thing I don’t do is strength or core at all what kind of stuff could I gradually add in?

You're young, you should be getting experienced advice.

Key to getting faster is to find someone who can advise or guide you. You will get better as you mature. Both physically and mentally. There is plenty of information out there, don't be paying anyone.

Do the miles. Avoid injury. Make sure you don't come down with an overuse problem - those tend to follow you forever. Don't become obsessive. Find you running rhythm. Become efficient. Learn how to race. Don't be afraid of losing. Don't be afraid of racing people who are better. Find out where your limits are and do not frustrate yourself with expectations. Follow a plan. Know where you are in that plan. Don't be afraid to make adjustments to the plan. Core work is great. Forget the body building stuff.

Look at videos of Herb Elliot. Look at his arm carriage. Read about how he trained. You can find lots of good stuff on these stars on youtube.

Key - know when to rest. An appropriate break / rest is as effective as a great session.

Good luck

I don't really see the benefit of a 3mi tempo at 5:50 personally. From my experience a longer run (say 6-8 miles) is going to provide the most benefit. You're more of a speed focused guy so these runs will be the most difficult but over time you should be able to do 8@5:50 as an "easy but not too easy" run and 6@5:30 for a more tempoish run.

You're not in that shape now but you can work up to it, for example doing 4-6 miles easy then 2 miles at tempo, then slowly making more of the run tempo instead of easy.

If you're looking for a tempo pace at different run lengths there is a table in Jack Daniel's 2nd edition that you can find online

Also extend that long run to 15 miles THEN gradually work the pace down to 6-6:15 pace. That'll help with tempos feeling too fast.

Cheers bud, I’m currently at a club however he want every one up to 20 years old on around 30 miles a week and I’m not dumb enough to see that that can be effective enough. So that is my only issue and I’ve discussed higher mileage with him but he said I have to keep it very low... so I possibly need to invest in a decent coach or get help on here and this seemed an okay shout.

Bleh wrote:

I don't really see the benefit of a 3mi tempo at 5:50 personally. From my experience a longer run (say 6-8 miles) is going to provide the most benefit. You're more of a speed focused guy so these runs will be the most difficult but over time you should be able to do 8@5:50 as an "easy but not too easy" run and 6@5:30 for a more tempoish run.

You're not in that shape now but you can work up to it, for example doing 4-6 miles easy then 2 miles at tempo, then slowly making more of the run tempo instead of easy.

If you're looking for a tempo pace at different run lengths there is a table in Jack Daniel's 2nd edition that you can find online

Thankyou mate, so I should be doing a long run and long tempo?

I would drop the track workout and add in another easy run. That would give you 1 hill session, 1 tempo session, 1 long run and 4 easy runs. I would also gradually increase the speed and distance of your tempo run. You need them to be at least 4 miles in length as well as, increasing the speed. When you can do a 4 mile tempo @ 5:30, you will be ready for a sub-34 10K.

Some good advice above. Remember though, you're 16. Just run. Tap into a comfortable rhythm, and don't leave your race in training. On a longer run, throw in some speed work, aka, fartlek sessions. Aim for a fast finish on those runs. Not becoming obsessive is so hard for a runner, at any level, and your time indicates you have some nice potential, but rest is where any athlete grows. Listen to your body. A lot is going to change for you in the next few years, physical and mental development. Don't be the runner who peaks at 18, and a decade after HS, is burnt out and 25 lbs bigger. Best of luck to ya.

So many runners and coaches just "overthink" how to improve ......A guaranteed way to run fast is a week like this:

mo: 6-8 miles easy

tu: 20 x 400m at 5 k race pace ..... 1 min rest or wait easy walking until heartrate is back to 120 bpm

we: 6-8 miles easy

th: 6-8 miles easy

fr: LT-pace interval at a total of 6-10 miles , rest : wait easy walking until back to 120 bpm.

sa: 10- 15 miles easy

su: RESTDAY , just do something else you like besides running.

- The Magic Wizard -

Keep doing whatever you are doing. 35.44 is an excellent run for a 16 y/o. 2 mins flat for 800 is phenomenal. Try to stay uninjured and consistent in your training - 52 weeks of 50 mpw is better than 10 weeks of 80 mpw followed by an injury period, then having to recover and rebuild.

A standard week of one tempo run, one repetition session (hills ideally) and a long run of 10 miles with filler days of 4- 6 miles easy (consistently) would be enough to continue to improve. I'm very jealous - I'd love to be 16 and in your position!

SUPERIOR COACH JS wrote:

So many runners and coaches just "overthink" how to improve ......A guaranteed way to run fast is a week like this:

mo: 6-8 miles easy

tu: 20 x 400m at 5 k race pace ..... 1 min rest or wait easy walking until heartrate is back to 120 bpm

we: 6-8 miles easy

th: 6-8 miles easy

fr: LT-pace interval at a total of 6-10 miles , rest : wait easy walking until back to 120 bpm.

sa: 10- 15 miles easy

su: RESTDAY , just do something else you like besides running.

- The Magic Wizard -

Sorry for the name change, I’m the OP. So last week I rested on Monday after my 10k. On the Saturday I did 8 miles at a nice 6.28 pace with 800ft of elevation with 2mie wu/cd. Sunday was 6mies easy with strides then today I come into town to do a progression run and it was sh*t! My splits wer 6:18,6:28,6:07,6:07. I have no idea what happened I mean I needed to poop from about a mile in and had to stop but I couldn’t get into rhythm.

I was you a long time ago, I ran 35 as a 15 year old, 33:56 as a 16 year old and 32:42 as a 17 year old. Track times improved from 4:36 mile to 4:27. Biggest improvement came when getting mileage up to 60 per week, about an hour per day at my pace (didn't always run easy but never ran hard, did run fast when I felt good but it wasn't "hard") , lots of hills, some unstructured fartleks. Only ran 10K's between seasons or in the summer (we all did back then). Ran workouts during the season but none between seasons and none specific to 10k, no runs longer than 12. A 15 mile long run for someone running 60 miles a week is way too much (25% of weekly mileage). If you have to do workouts do the basic 6-10 x800, 6-8 x 1k, 4-6 x mile once a week but alternate one week track and 1 week road or XC course. Don't start at 5:30, that's your goal pace , start at your current pace. A 20 minute tempo is good too and 5:50 pace is fine to start with., if it's easy slightly increase the length. You want to learn to run fast and relaxed, all out intervals and tempos do more harm than good. Don't be a slave to the watch or Garmin, learn to run by feel. Race every few weeks at all distances. Also, strides a couple times a week from 80-150m are always a good idea for any runner training for any distance. Good luck, have fun.

I don't really see the benefit of a 3mi tempo at 5:50 personally. From my experience a longer run (say 6-8 miles) is going to provide the most benefit. You're more of a speed focused guy so these runs will be the most difficult but over time you should be able to do 8@5:50 as an "easy but not too easy" run and 6@5:30 for a more tempoish run.

You're not in that shape now but you can work up to it, for example doing 4-6 miles easy then 2 miles at tempo, then slowly making more of the run tempo instead of easy.

If you're looking for a tempo pace at different run lengths there is a table in Jack Daniel's 2nd edition that you can find online[/quote]

Thankyou mate, so I should be doing a long run and long tempo?[/quote]

Thankyou mate, so I should be doing a long run and long tempo?[/quote][/quote]

Cheers mate I was thinking of following the advised plan above and tailor it to myself, I rest appreciate your help mate!

And I'll bet you were in Oregon high school back in the day

Mon 4-6 miles hilly fartlek (rolling hills you can have fun speeding up on or sprinting down hills--make it playful)

Tues 6-8 miles easy

Wen 2 miles easy 3 miles hard 1 mile easy

Thurs 6-8 miles easy

Friday Rest

Sat Race or 4-5 x 1k @ slightly faster than 10k goal pace. 3 mins rest between

Sun 10- 12 miles EASY. Don't try to drop the pace of this run. No need.

Hi guys, little update. Had a good week after a bad start:

Wednesday speed: 2(200,400,200,200) @800 pace

Averaged 200s in 28 and 400s in 57/8

Saturday longish run: 8 miles@6:11 pace, with 250m elevation.

Thanks for the help so far!

I know there’s no real indicator in there but is a sub 16:30 5k in two weeks possible?