whats so hard about LOGIC?
El G was in the DREAM time of EPO use, and he MAXED out at 3:26.00.....and not on the mythical 2+ seconds new monaco track
this is where you and others keep failing in LOGIC, at least now you and ex and others are ADMITTING that EPO works and that its been being abused in kenya since the 90s....
here is what you, ex and others still dont want to grasp
- how effective EPO is
- why the WRs arnt 12:00 5k, and why europeans didnt crush it in the EPO era
kiprop is a 3:29 guy on LEGIT 1500m race
51 3:29.18 Asbel Kiprop KEN 30.06.89 1 Ad-Dawhah 09.05.2014
this is from the classic 1500m all time list that everyone acts like i have never seen
do you see that? 3:29.18
el G did 3:26's on slower tracks than monaco. what does that tell you? it tells me kiprop isnt as fast as all you fanboys think, why is this important? because you guys dont seem to get it that El G got to DOPE non stop, without fear his whole career.
he maxed out human potential for 1500m. you guys seem to have this sick belief that he was clean and thus he could have run 3:22 or some sh*t if he had EPO
again i have to show you guys this stuff and maybe this time instead of calling me a moron or idiot...LOOK at it
El G
1998 3:26.00 Roma (ITA) 14 JUL 1998
1997 3:28.91 Zürich (SUI) 13 AUG 1997
1996 3:29.05 Bruxelles (BEL) 23 AUG 1996
1995 3:31.16 Köln (GER) 18 AUG 1995
1994 3:33.61 Nice (FRA) 18 JUL 1994 (he was 20yrs old)
so at 24 he had dropped 7.61 seconds.
kiprop
2015 3:26.69 Monaco (MON) 17 JUL 2015
2014 3:28.45 Monaco (MON) 18 JUL 2014
2013 3:27.72 Monaco (MON) 19 JUL 2013
2012 3:28.88 Monaco (MON) 20 JUL 2012
2011 3:30.46 Rieti (ITA) 10 SEP 2011
2010 3:31.78 Rieti (ITA) 29 AUG 2010
2009 3:31.20 Roma (ITA) 10 JUL 2009 (supposedly 20)
2008 3:31.64 Roma (ITA) 11 JUL 2008
2007 3:35.24 Osaka (JPN) 29 AUG 2007 (supposedly 18, but what do we know about kenyans age cheating?)
so lets take his 20 to 24 like el g, 3.48 seconds. now lets assume he was *20 in 2007
then at *26 when he finally ran 3:27.72 (at monaco) so his improvement in 6 yrs, 7.52 seconds
my bet is he ran 3:35.24 and that showed lots of promise, so thats when he was taken in and shown the ropes of EPO and being a "professional".
3:35.24 IS FAST, but because of EPO it causes you guys to think its SCRUB status
thats a 3:52 mile..just slightly faster than alan webb did at 18
In 1966, at age nineteen, Ryun set world records in the mile (3:51.3) and the half-mile (1:44.9)
so at 19 jim ryun ran 3:34.04 1500m equivalent, and at 20 he set the WR 3:33.1....he never ran faster. yet El G and kiprop ran about the same time as 18/19 yr old ryun, then dropped 3-4 seconds, then WAY fast
3:33.1 Jim Ryun (USA) 1967-07-08 Los Angeles, United States
3:32.2 3:32.16 Filbert Bayi (TAN) 1974-02-02 Christchurch, New Zealand
3:32.1 3:32.03 Sebastian Coe (GBR) 1979-08-15 Zürich, Switzerland
3:32.1 3:32.09 Steve Ovett (GBR) 1980-07-15 Oslo, Norway
3:31.4 3:31.36 Steve Ovett (GBR) 1980-08-27 Koblenz, West Germany
3:31.24 Sydney Maree (USA) 1983-08-28 Cologne, West Germany
3:30.77 Steve Ovett (GBR) 1983-09-04 Rieti, Italy
3:29.67 Steve Cram (GBR) 1985-07-16 Nice, France
3:29.46 Saïd Aouita (MAR) 1985-08-23 Berlin, Germany
3:28.86 Noureddine Morceli (ALG) 1992-09-06 Rieti, Italy
3:27.37 Noureddine Morceli (ALG) 1995-07-12 Nice, France
3:26.00 Hicham El Guerrouj (MAR) 1998-07-14 Rome, Italy
as you can see jim ryuns record lasted 7 yrs, that amount wasnt match again till the EPO era started, and now the WR has been sitting there for 20yrs!
yes there is diminishing RETURNS, but dont be so f*cking blind and ignorant. there is a LIMIT to how fast a human can run, and its right around 3:31-32 without PEDS, so with PEDs you can only get so much faster before you hit the physical and physiological limits again. the neurons in your body can only fire so fast, muscles can only contract and extend so fast, your body can only create, and breakdown ATP so fast, there is a LIMIT. no one is running 3:26.00 on a legit 1500m track and then getting 7 seconds with EPO. no the limit is prob 3:31-32 CLEAN. El G got the the absolute limit on what a human can do, because he was able to use EPO for YEARS to max things out.
same with komen, geb and kb....and most likely kipchoge.
when kipchoge drops the marathon record into low 2:02, it will never be broken, just like paulas record
5-10% gains is what non elites get. but if you got them to the highest fitness level they could ever hope for and then dope, the best they can hope for at maximum FITNESS level is 3-4%. its not like their new fitness level will drop again, thats not how it works. what im talking about is the non elite was say 75% fit when he did the test and got a 10% gain, and he was only a 4:20 miler at that level. then he takes it serious and gets into 100% fitness, then gets EPO...at his 100% lets say he was 4:08 in the mile, well now he can see if he can get that sub 4! but the next year he thinks man im a 3:59.99 guy, EPO will give me another 8 seconds!! awesome!! and he keeps running 3:59.99-4:02 and thinks "hmmm bummer EPO doesnt work"
every human has a LIMIT, and HUMANS as a species have a limit, just like other animals. you dont see a cheetah going 80mph, now they are maxed at 75mph, you dont see thoroughbred horses running faster cause we have maxed them out long ago, you dont see pronghorns going faster than 55mph, cause that is their limit. if El G has set the human limit at 3:26.00, then there is no way that is getting beat unless there is a track that is 2-3 seconds fast, and we can get a human again down 3:28 at a legit track....kiprop was 3:29.18, and best monaco he could get was 3:26.69, thats a long way from 3:26.00 that wasnt on the monaco track.
you hit your maximum clean ability the best you can hope for is 3-4%. thats IT....you dont get to keep on maximizing your gains year after year. if your not in the best shape you can hope for, yes you will get a bigger % gain, and prob have to do it again for maybe a few years since you werent at your best.
anyways at least you guys finally admit EPO works and kenyans have been abusing it. i mean without all the fussing and arguing, tell me ex and rek...since you guys both agree that EPO works, but you dont think 4%...what then? you think its only 1% gain? and that kiprop was a 3:28.69 guy clean?