2:29- Philadelphia or California International?

You will have people to run with in Philly. It will be windy as hell in Philly.

I have not run either of these races, but I don't think they compare at all in terms of competitiveness. CIM wins hands down.

OK, I was curious and just looked up last years results. 17th place slipped under 2:30 at Philly.

106th place was under 2:30 at CIM. Go there.

And if you need a back-up for the next year, Grandmas has solid depth. Nothing like CIM, though, that totally shocked me. Boston and Chicago don't have that many people going sub 2:30.

Philly.

You know why? You wont need to put an asterisk on your sub 2:30.

It’s not point to point.

It’s not a downhill race.

I ran it and loved it. Windy it may be, but its a loop course and youll have company.

itdepends wrote:

I have not run either of these races, but I don't think they compare at all in terms of competitiveness. CIM wins hands down.

OK, I was curious and just looked up last years results. 17th place slipped under 2:30 at Philly.

106th place was under 2:30 at CIM. Go there.

And if you need a back-up for the next year, Grandmas has solid depth. Nothing like CIM, though, that totally shocked me. Boston and Chicago don't have that many people going sub 2:30.

Last year CIM was a huge PR fest. Was there a tailwind? I saw a lot of huge PRs that day.

It was cool and not very windy, if I remember right from talking to some people who did it.

And maybe it is the defensiveness from everyone who says CIM is easy and downhill, but when I hear people compare courses, they say CIM is on the fast side, but it's by no means an easy course that feels all downhill. Many say Chicago is far easier and faster. Weather has been iffy, though.

I've run both and PRed on both. I don't think CIM is worth the extra $1500 you would spend. Cost not considered I would lean slightly towards CIM because there are so many individuals to run with but the course is not considerably faster. Also the crowd support at Philly is much better. Not a knock on CIM but the excitement of a city like Philly is an advantage over running through farm land and strip malls towards Sacramento.

Thanks. I’m leaning towards Philly just because of $ and logistics. I ran it once before and it was super windy, but still sort of ok. If I can somehow get my half down to sub 70 next year then at least I’d have a sub elite start for CIM for 2020.

Well, that is weird.

I am 38 in August.

My lifetime goal is sub 2:30 (close but no cigar in the past).

I have an entry to Chicago but can't use it.

I'm looking hard at Philly as I live in NYC.

Philly 2017 had a pack of about a dozen guys running mid-2:28 pace through about 19 miles. The return on Kelly Drive had the group splintering, but there was some solid camaraderie up until that point. Sharing bottles, pacing into the wind, and light banter. Was an excellent experience for someone like myself, who was in the race for the purpose of getting under 2:30.

The "hills" in Philly are early in the course, as well, which I appreciate. I'm someone that likes some varied terrain instead of a pancake flat course, as I tend to cramp up without that extra muscle stimulation that hills can provide.

The only drawback to Philly in recent years has been the wind. It was atrocious in 2017, bad in 2015-16. But that's just the luck of the draw. The 2013 and 2014 races were picture perfect.

IMHO... I would go to CIM if I was making a vacation out of it or had already run Philly. Otherwise Philly is your best bet. Plus it's before Thanksgiving, which makes the holiday that much more satisfying (see: flagrantly excessive beer and food consumption).

If you want to do some training for Philly or try to work together during the race, I’m down. I’m including my email here. I’m in Montclair, NJ but I train a fair amount in the city.

2:29 will be a stretch for me, but I’m going for it. Best race to date is 1:11-mid for Houston half this January.

Thanks- interesting... does Philly allow personal bottles at aid stations for “seeded entries”/sub elites?

slo-twitch wrote:

Thanks- interesting... does Philly allow personal bottles at aid stations for “seeded entries”/sub elites?

No, I do not believe so. But given the layout of the course (which I assume you're familiar with), it is very easy to plant someone along miles 13-24 to give you a bottle. I grabbed a bottle of Gatorade from my wife around mile 17 and shared it with some of our group. Some of the other guys in our pack had people at mile 10-11 waiting with fluids as well.

Thanks. This could be clutch so I can get my Maurten fix!

Also considering Philly.

Not to hijack the thread but question for Schuylkill or others; does the seeded entry program for the event give you a separate warmup area and separate bathrooms? Or is it just starting position up front?