Is chondromalacia INCURABLE for older types?

bump. anyone?

cartilage loss is permanent. some people are able to "arrest" the progression by correcting mechanics and strength imbalances, but the existing damage is irreversible.

Why don't you see a podiatrist or other real live doctor and get it looked at and know for sure? I got orthotics prescribed and it saved me. I was mid 30's then but it sure hurt like hell and I am sure I have some damage as it bothers me occasionally even now. But get a professional opinion (and help) and perhaps you can continue running.

I'm a chondromalacia sufferer and I'm young. 22 years young i left the sport of running a while ago never lost my interest though, at the moment I'm still suffering on zero miles a week. First you should be glad if it passes even if it means never running again. First you should go and see if you need insoles. Maybe your arch colapsed or your knee's finally have had it with your abnormal foot mechanics.

Find a therapist in podology. And let him have a check. For some insoles are a DIRECT CURE when it comes to chondromalacia.

In other cases: it cures the knes but stresses your body elsewhere, it doesnt cure your legs you should look further.

Am i an overpronator, supinator?

YES ---> possibly surgery (search for hyproCure)

NO ---> time to go to a therapist to lengthen your quads.

Shortend quads are most of the time the reason for such a pain.

In the meantime leave running for what it is. Go to the pool and learn how to swim. very similar to times and performances etc... also bike some helps to strengthen the muscles as well(but stay in the pain limit.

It could take years to have it all figured out. But don't give up. Start making all the appointments you can NOW.

--> podology(podotherapy) (don't know the word for such a therapist in English)

--> physical therapist (that gives you stretching exercises and helps your knee)

--> (if insoles don't help go for hyprocure)

I have worn insoles for 2 years now and slowly but certainly worsened my chondromalacia to the point where i ave pain every day. I'm looking for 2 more different insoles. IF it doesn't help I'm going to(let) operate my foot.

And as i said i don't mind about running anymore at this moment. And maybe I'll run again but as cross training for maybe a triathlon.I'm a swimmer now.I also go to the gym 2 - 3 days every week. And i have an ergo meter. I use it almost every day for short durations it is not healthy for my knee to bike. But i go 6-15 minutes hard. Note though that it is much more healthy then 6-15 minutes of running. I'm actually much better looking lately i packed some muscle but I'm still as fit as my running days(vo2max). I can produce 5 watt/kg on my short sessions which is equivalence of a vo2max of a 3 sub hour marathon runner (60 ml/kg/min +).This is what is the equivalence of max speed for 6 minutes that 5 watt/kg. I can hold it longer. So I'm sure I'm well fit.The swimming also helps of course (otherwise i never got the results on as little biking) i swim a lot now, 20 000 yards a week. 5% body fat at 180 pounds.Of course if you can bike without pain you can get as fit with just a bike or ergo meter. For me swimming is good. And the ergo meter is in function of the swimming and for the case i ever wanted to do a triathlon.Anyway good luck i have 2 more appointments tomorrow.And chondromalacia it' has little to do with age whether you can recover from it. It is which degree you have level 1 -- level 4. Level 4 is going to become local arthritis and sooner or later a new knee eventually. All other levels are treatable. Just make sure that in the period between now and the research you hurt your knee as little as possible.Take anti-inflammations after biking. which will not only decrease pain but also shorten the break down after activity.Also stretch after every activity.Best of luck and now you are not the only one.

I think it's very curable, but you have to do the right things. As stated earlier, you need to see a specialist (I'm a believer in PTs--they'll set you straight) who can diagnose the issues causing the chondromalacia.

I've had this problem off and on since my late 20s and have found that it can be managed by strengthening the quads and making sure your alignment is correct (orthotics and strengthening). In my early 40s I had chondromalacia followed by patellar tendonitis in both knees. It took several rounds of PT and othotics, but have been healthy for 3-4 years now.

Thanks everyone who has responded so far.

Tikes story makes me realize I could be a lot worse off. AK-49's story gives me hope.

I can bike no problem so I should at least be happy about that.

Is it REALLY irreversible? Cartilage still grows until you die right? In theory shouldn't you be able to eventually regrow the cartilage under the knee cap?

Yes, I suppose I should see a doc but I've often noticed that people get more information from real runners about running related stuff than doctors who act like they could care less.

If it is TRUE chondromalacia, it can't be "cured", only treated. That term means "softening or weakening of cartilage", and once cartilage is going/gone it can't be replaced (yet). Surgeons are working on techniques that irritate the cartilage to re-grow (but that means injuring the deepest layer, the only one with blood supply).

If you've had an MRI you'll know if it's the cartilage that's gone and not just a painful area underneath the patella.

I've seen many patients that say they have chondromalacia, but it turns out it's just a pain under their patella, usually from a muscle imbalance leading to a tracking problem.

Bob Lob Law wrote:

I've seen many patients that say they have chondromalacia, but it turns out it's just a pain under their patella, usually from a muscle imbalance leading to a tracking problem.

Now that really gives me hope. I have tried strengthening my VMO's and doing exercises etc. to no avail. But, I wonder if it's a biomechanical thing (like I have Mortons foot-a longer 2nd toe) that could cause this.

You know what gives me hope, an AK-47 (not 49).

I'm 25, have "chrondomalacia" and can BARELY run anymore, and certainly don't enjoy biking. If I "cop a feel" of my VMO, my bad one is maybe 50% of the size of the other one, but I don't know of a single exercise that can actually make it better (without aggravating the joint).

Does anyone think it would be worthwild to go back to my doctor and "whine" to her that I've been through therapy, I've been to an orthopedic surgeon, 4-5 rounds of physiotherapy, and yet nothing seems to be getting better? I feel like my current physio is just making me come back to "drum up business", and at this point I'm paying out-of-pocket, because my extended health insurance has expired for the year.

Hi, I have had chondromalacia since puberty. My knee doctor said i should outgrow it by the time i'm 22 fully grown, but its only been getting worse. I am now 24. My knee doctor is reluctant to operate but i am getting very frustrated with the pain. All he wants me to do is exercises that cause extreme pain. Insoles just make the pain worse too. Surely there must be some surgery to fix the problem, i dread to suffer this for years to come. What about a knee replacement like they do for the elderly. Would that help?

Hi, I have had chondromalacia since puberty. My knee doctor said i should outgrow it by the time i'm 22 fully grown, but its only been getting worse. I am now 24. My knee doctor is reluctant to operate but i am getting very frustrated with the pain. All he wants me to do is exercises that cause extreme pain. Insoles just make the pain worse too. Surely there must be some surgery to fix the problem, i dread to suffer this for years to come. What about a knee replacement like they do for the elderly. Would that help?

Hi, I have had chondromalacia since puberty. My knee doctor said i should outgrow it by the time i'm 22 fully grown, but its only been getting worse. I am now 24. My knee doctor is reluctant to operate but i am getting very frustrated with the pain. All he wants me to do is exercises that cause extreme pain. Insoles just make the pain worse too. Surely there must be some surgery to fix the problem, i dread to suffer this for years to come. What about a knee replacement like they do for the elderly. Would that help?

Try this ...

http://sportscenteraustin.blogs.com/the_view/the-runners-knee-bible.html

Doug Kelsey, the PT who wrote this program, is ahead of the rest when it comes to patellofemoral problems.

AK-47 gives me hope wrote:

You know what gives me hope, an AK-47 (not 49).

I'm 25, have "chrondomalacia" and can BARELY run anymore, and certainly don't enjoy biking. If I "cop a feel" of my VMO, my bad one is maybe 50% of the size of the other one, but I don't know of a single exercise that can actually make it better (without aggravating the joint).

Does anyone think it would be worthwild to go back to my doctor and "whine" to her that I've been through therapy, I've been to an orthopedic surgeon, 4-5 rounds of physiotherapy, and yet nothing seems to be getting better? I feel like my current physio is just making me come back to "drum up business", and at this point I'm paying out-of-pocket, because my extended health insurance has expired for the year.

I would suggest getting some ultrasound therapy from your PT. and try the standard exercise to strengthen your vastus medialis. Your entire quadriceps are not most probably not weak. Just the one to the inside of your leg.

I would suggest placing a rolled up towel underneath your knee, and raising your knee while pressing down on the towel with your leg. Make sure the movement is restricted to the last 10-15 degrees of flexin. You could do the same by crossing one leg over the other and placing a rolled up towel underneath the knee of the leg on the top. The towel must be on the right thigh and your left leg must be placed on top of it, and repeat the exercise. The Medialis works only during the last 10-15 degrees of flexion

This takes a long time maybe a month or two. Make sure you do 3-4 sets per day 10 counts each, holding the muscles contracted for 10sec. I would personally recommend tapping or you know just kinda gently slapping your medialis to get it to function better(This is not a joke, it works, since the blood flow to the muscle increases) and it'd be better if you could place a hand on the muscle to feel it move.

Do this a couple of days, and you'll notice the diff. Even you don't see any difference, don't stop! Persistence is the key. your just 22 years old. your knee will come to normal. maybe in a year. Bu aggravating it will only worsen. Take ample rest, ice regularly and workout your medialis. Avoid squats, jumping running, or bending your knee as much as you can avoid it.

If the exercises are causing you any sort of severe pain(mild pain is possible on the first 1-2 days) stop all exercises and REST! rest! and ice(avoid ice burns)

- Source- Personal experience & PT. Do this consistently and you'll start to feel better, a lot better!

Are you SURE you have that and not ITBS?

not getting younger wrote:

I am pretty sure I have chondromalacia. I present all the symptoms.

I have tried all the strengthening/stretching tricks, even took a year off from running. Recently started to get back into it and now after 3 weeks it's getting bad as ever on JUST 10 MILES per week.

I'm mid 40's. Have I permanently lost the cartilage under the knee cap? Part of me just wants to say "screw it" and run a lot anyway if I've already got a permanent, incurable injury. The rational side of me says hold on but is starting to lose all hope.

Is there anyone over 35 who has ever FULLY recovered from this?

Yes, cartilage degeneration is permanent regardless of age. I got it at 22 and things have only gone downhill since.

Hello!

I am a female (27) with chondromalacia patella since Nov 2010 (marathon runner)

I went to an israeli doctor (very good doctor) in Jan 2012.

He said, CHONDROMALACIA PATELLA IS 100% CURABLE and you will know that it has been cured when all grinding/crinching noise when you extend leg/squat has gone!

Cartilage is being regenerated until you are 90!!!!

And for any males out there, things are even more optimistic!

The key is do not engage in any activity that cause even the slight discomfort (not to even mention pain)!!!!! That is because pain is a sign that cartilage is being irritated, hence further damage.

People think that it is incurable because they keep on climbing stairs, running etc Even intense swimming can cause pain! BUT you should move, keep the blood circulating and MILDLY irritating the patella cartilage to encourage its renewal!

I did not get over this yet, but I will, completely! I am improving. I am taking oral collagen supplements to enhance cartilage renewal and celadrin to lubricate the joints. You all will het over it as long as you do not have any anatomical defects, that is wrong position of the patella since birth! BE CAREFUL though not to overstrengthen the quadriceps, ilotibial band because a muscle imbalance will dislocate the patella resulting in further cartilage damage. Do isometric exercises, but not with any discomfort/pain, find out what works for you, and please STRETCH a lot!!!

Kisses to all you pesimistic guys out there! If I recover (with level 3 chondromalacia) you all will!

Many many people have chondromalacia without pain. It is probably just patellofemoral pain syndrome which can be the underlying cause of chondromalacia anyway. You got some good advice so far. Make sure you are not heel striking when you run. If you have chondromalacia bad enough, stem cells may offer hope in the future but this is not likely the cause of your pain.

Hey Tatiana,

Sounds like you give us all hope... I am a 42 year old man with grade 3 chondromalacia, Baker's Cyst.... I also have patellar tendinosis and quad tendonosis... I am a bartender, but not in a position to change jobs... I do have a maltracking problem, so says my MRI... Not sure how long I've had it? I've tried PT, ice/heat, stretching, and nothing really working :(... Do you think if I follow your regimen, I can fix this issue?

Thanks,

Adam

you can always email me at

asfazit@aol.com

..I'd like to hear about your progress :)