Trans woman & OTQer Megan Youngren's amazing marathon progression.

Lois2 wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

Other than the local 5K, there is zero indication any of your predictions will come true. You're getting worked up over runners that don't exist.

You didn’t answer - it’s hypothetical, not predictions. It may never happen, but hypothetically if bio men did win the top three spots, would that be okay with you?

I feel like either one thinks they can compete totally, or shouldn’t at all. Because either it relates to your biology, chromosomes, hormones and history, or it doesn’t. Like I said the “it’s okay if she doesn’t” win argument is illogical. It’s basically saying there is a difference that isn’t fair but you’ll turn a blind eye for now. Is that the case?

Transgender women will never take the top three spots. Never.

I'm not turning a blind eye. I'm following June Eastwood's results and so far she's been comparable as a female runner. Based on the clip I saw, Youngren is unlikely to ever break 2:40. I'm confident that when it comes to distance running, there will never be a championship level transgender female.

There is zero evidence to support all these doomsday predictions.

It's odd to me that you're so confident that a MtF trans athlete will NEVER be at the championship level. 400m hurdles is not distance, but close enough that I would think that Cece Telfer's recent NCAA championship would introduce at least some uncertainty into that prediction.

come again? wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

Transgender women will never take the top three spots. Never.

I'm not turning a blind eye. I'm following June Eastwood's results and so far she's been comparable as a female runner. Based on the clip I saw, Youngren is unlikely to ever break 2:40. I'm confident that when it comes to distance running, there will never be a championship level transgender female.

There is zero evidence to support all these doomsday predictions.

It's odd to me that you're so confident that a MtF trans athlete will NEVER be at the championship level. 400m hurdles is not distance, but close enough that I would think that Cece Telfer's recent NCAA championship would introduce at least some uncertainty into that prediction.

When I say championship level, I mean D-1 at a national level, or pro. And I don't consider the 400H to have any correlation to distancing running.

For a transgender distance runner to reach that level, it would take a male at a similar level to transgender. I never ran a 4:00 mile but it must be an incredible feeling to have the speed and strength to do so. To transgender and run 4:30 would be awful; kind of like running after having a lung removed.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

come again? wrote:

It's odd to me that you're so confident that a MtF trans athlete will NEVER be at the championship level. 400m hurdles is not distance, but close enough that I would think that Cece Telfer's recent NCAA championship would introduce at least some uncertainty into that prediction.

When I say championship level, I mean D-1 at a national level, or pro. And I don't consider the 400H to have any correlation to distancing running.

For a transgender distance runner to reach that level, it would take a male at a similar level to transgender. I never ran a 4:00 mile but it must be an incredible feeling to have the speed and strength to do so. To transgender and run 4:30 would be awful; kind of like running after having a lung removed.

That's your entire argument for why a trans won't win a championship? Because if you actually were a 4 minute miler, you personally would feel awful running 4:30??? How convincing. Not.

Please remove your head from the sand and wake up to the fact that it's just a matter of time before a fast guy hops the fence and races as a woman and, drum roll, beats all the women.

The opportunity to do so has been available for awhile now and hasn't happened. My head is out of the sand and I don't see anything coming over the horizon. Do you have any evidence to support your belief that's it only a matter of time?

Just won the Mayor's Marathon in Anchorage ($1,000 prize) and 5th overall. Time was only 3:07 but that was because a bear and a couple cubs were blocking the course and caused the entire race to stop for 11 minutes. Course is pretty slow, decent hills and some on trails. I don't know if there are any requirements to reduce testosterone prior to winning money races. Ran 2:50:26 at the Olympic Trials last year.

https://www.peninsulaclarion.com/sports/soldotnas-youngren-wins-mayors-marathon/

Hi Avocado's number! How are you? DM me insta

Took second and broke the course record in Fairbanks. Th article below has a picture of the four women who broke the course record. It is not hard to tell which one Youngren is without looking at the names.

https://www.adn.com/sports/2021/09/18/with-anchorages-anna-dalton-leading-the-way-equinox-womens-record-takes-a-beating-repeatedly/

SDSU Aztec wrote:

Fluffy Duffy wrote:

Please remove your head from the sand and wake up to the fact that it's just a matter of time before a fast guy hops the fence and races as a woman and, drum roll, beats all the women.

The opportunity to do so has been available for awhile now and hasn't happened. My head is out of the sand and I don't see anything coming over the horizon. Do you have any evidence to support your belief that's it only a matter of time?

Niyonsaba.

Yeah. Dani Jones was lucky that NCAA Indoor was cancelled due to covid. Otherwise, she would have been beaten by... wait, Eastwood did not run fast enough to qualify for NCAA. Perhaps that was by design to avoid scrutiny. In addition to finishing in the 15th place, 27 seconds behind the winner.

https://www.tfrrs.org/results/64010/3985715/Big_Sky_Indoor_Track_&_Field_Championships/Women_3000m_Run/

The big mistakes being made repeatedly:

1) Saying that "they" will "never" win big competitions. First, this shows a lack of understanding about how long "never" is*. Second, it pushes a problem down the road by pretending like it will never be a problem, to avoid having to arrive at a real solution.

2) Placing emphasis on "big" competitions, to minimize where this is already a problem. The Connecticut State Championships were big to all the girls involved. The Big Sky Conference meet is big to all the women involved. A minor marathon is big to the people running it and especially those who trained to win.

*When the USA sent the Dream Team to the Olympics, a friend of mine made the comment that "now we will never lose the gold medal." My only reply, "You apparently have no idea how long never is." It didn't take long for the USA to fail to deliver.

head and shoulders above wrote:

Took second and broke the course record in Fairbanks. Th article below has a picture of the four women who broke the course record. It is not hard to tell which one Youngren is without looking at the names.

https://www.adn.com/sports/2021/09/18/with-anchorages-anna-dalton-leading-the-way-equinox-womens-record-takes-a-beating-repeatedly/

Wow and just frickin' WOW!!!!!!

How have we gotten to this point people?

How is someone with a clear physical advantage over their competitors allowed to win races, break records, take home money, rob other runners of personal glory who compete fairly...how?

This is not a Right or Left Political Issue, it's simply wrong and I have zero clue how any normal thinking human being, male or female, doesn't feel the same way. It's as we called it in grade school, cheating!!!!

Full marathon history

9/16/2017 Equinox Marathon, Fairbanks, AK - Age 26 - 4:48:39

9/15/2018 Equinox Marathon, Fairbanks, AK - Age 27 - 3:53:39

9/30/2018 Kenai River Marathon, Kenai, AK - Age 27 - 4:04:26

3/24/2019 Los Angeles Marathon, LA. CA - Age 27 - 3:06:42

6/22/2019 Mayor's Marathon, Anchorage, AK - Age 28 - 3:06:11

8/18/2019 Big Wildlife Marathon, Anchorage, AK - Age 28 - 2:52:33

9/7/2019 Last Chance BQ Marathon, Grand Rapids, MI - Age 28 - 2:53:00

10/6/2019 Portland Marathon, Portland, OR - Age 28 - 2:53:19

12/8/2019 Cal International Marathon, Sacramento, CA - Age 28 - 2:43:52

2/29/2020 Olympic Trials Marathon, Atlanta, GA - Age 28 - 2:50:26

6/19/2021 Mayor's Marathon, Anchorage, AK - Age 30 - 3:07:43

9/18/2021 Equinox Marathon, Fairbanks, AK - Age 30 - 3:11:57

9/26/2021 Kenai River Marathon, Kenai, AK - Age 30 - 2:48:11

Lois2 wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

Other than the local 5K, there is zero indication any of your predictions will come true. You're getting worked up over runners that don't exist.

You didn’t answer - it’s hypothetical, not predictions. It may never happen, but hypothetically if bio men did win the top three spots, would that be okay with you?

I feel like either one thinks they can compete totally, or shouldn’t at all. Because either it relates to your biology, chromosomes, hormones and history, or it doesn’t. Like I said the “it’s okay if she doesn’t” win argument is illogical. It’s basically saying there is a difference that isn’t fair but you’ll turn a blind eye for now. Is that the case?

It's something that exists and doesn't matter if I support it or not. In my opinion, there will never be "bio men" sweeping the top 3 spots of any race. We're taking about a group comprising .3% of the population and for various reasons, only a small proportion of that total will compete in sports.

You seen to be saying something should be done right away before it becomes a problem, but a hypothetical can not be litigated in court. There needs to be a plaintiff and damages and no such person currently exist.

My point was:

If Eastwood could have beaten the women's field by even a bigger margin, why didn't she run fast enough to qualify for NCAA? Was she afraid of getting too much scrutiny?

Additionally, why didn't she run better than 15th place (27 seconds behind) in 3000m, if she could have won the mile by even a bigger margin?

I didn't say whether it was okay for her to compete in the Big Sky championships. That's up to other women in the conference.

I think the women are generally afraid to file suit, as they will be pilloried for picking on the poor trans woman who just wants to compete.

As for damaged parties who should be suing, we can find a few names from the Big Sky Championships in which one woman didn't get the title she deserved, one woman didn't score the point she deserved, and all the women were one place lower than they deserved.

1600 Finals

"Winner"

1 Eastwood, June Montana 4:50.28 10

"Damaged parties"

2 Malaspina, Mikayla Northern Ari 4:54.78 8

3 Thacker, Malaina Idaho 4:55.01 6

4 Olsen, Molly Idaho State 4:57.03 5

5 Eitel, Pipi Northern Ari 5:00.41 4

6 Morley, Bryn Northern Ari 5:00.85 3

7 Bries, Jesselyn Northern Ari 5:01.52 2

8 Reiss, Annika Northern Ari 5:04.70 1

9 Taylor, Harley Southern Uta 5:05.22