Sorry that I misinterpreted your comments. I happen to think very highly of the program and its coaches. ISU (the program and the university) has come a long way since I was there, and that's a reflection of the fine work that both McNichols and Gartland have put into the school.
They might have gotten a Brit, but he did not finish 33rd at Jr. World Cross 99 in Belfast. Check the results.
Alber ran horrible in that race. You won't see that happen this year. Wait and see.
Yes he did. I was there.
Ok I was wrong. He was 32nd!
John Gartland the best distance coach in the state. No way!! He runs his team into the ground day in and day out causing everyone to never reach their full potential. Just look at all the talent he has had over the recent years. ISU should have ran away with the every MVC title. He had a 2:11 800 meter runner, who got injuired and never broke 2:15 after that. Ummmm... can we say OVERTRAINED!! That is exactly what happened to just about everyone of his distance runners. Oh, let not forget to mention that he likes to curse, yell, and scream at his runner's when they are performing poorly. All I can say is good luck to all the new people on the team because they sure are going to need it.
AM: look in the mirror, and that's who you should blame.
Sounds like runner78 knows a loser (or is a loser) who had an unfulfilling career at ISU. Looking for a scapegoat? I agree with ex_tree that runner78 (or whomever) needs to look in the mirror.
Yeah, Gartland is a hard-nosed and demanding coach. But he's handling a D-1 program, not some high school squad of part-time runners/part-time soccer players. Once a runner gets to the D-1 level, the time for coddling and pampering is over. If runner78 (or the 2:11 800 chick) was looking to be a fun-runner, she should have gone to the University of Indianapolis.
And can the crap about Gartland over-training his runners. Compared to the major D-1 programs in the state (and nation), most of Gartland's workouts are very controlled.
Yeah, but at the end of the day you're still in Indiana.
There are still a few of us who don't have a negative opinion of the state or its D-1 college running programs, but I would agree that most potentially elite runners go out of state in search of the best opportunities for development.
And that is said with all due respect to ND's and Butler's abilities to recruit foreign runners (both out of state and abroad).
I have heard through the grapevine that the Invaders have a few new guys so they may be good this year. Top 3 at club nationals is my prediction....
I really don't get why Indiana teams are arguing over whos the best, it's only Indiana! It seems mostly like ND guys, who may be afraid that they no longer are just given that distinction at the beginning of every season and ISU guys, who once were second best in the state and are too stupid to figure out it's when the state sucked worst are the ones arguing over, well nothing. But hey i'll help solve the argument with my rankings.
1. Butler(the team that screams no respect every year, hey you have to earn that first guys, and I don't know how many Americans have had success there, not many)
2. Indiana(if you ask them they should win nationals this year and every year they would ask for respect but for some reason they think they get it just because Bob Kennedy went there or something)
3. Notre Dame(OK these guys are usually good but not so much this year but god do they bitch, a bunch of spoiled bitches, you aren't that good this year face it)
4. Purdue(they can't recruit, if their training logs were published people would laugh so hard they'd piss their pants at some of the just stupid workouts these guys do, they do manage to be middle of the pack Indiana)
5. Indiana State(this is an average Missouri Valley team that cries for the same respect Butler cries for oh yeah as everyone will see this fall Terre Haute is the worst place to go to college on earth, you guys are not good see above also)
6. Ball St. (shaggy is their coach, and his training might make Purdue's just look bad instead of crazy, they have a bunch of couldn't-have-beens and never-will-bes they resemble some high school teams)
7-the rest: IUPUI, Valpo, Southern Indiana(an ok DII school), IPFW, Wabash, Anderson, DePauw, who cares it's Indiana after all)
No one's bitching here. We'll let our running speak for us.
We're just the only team with a national fan base, I'd guess it's some 12 year old boy talking shit for us.
That's a great men's preview but guess what the men aren't the be all and end all of Indiana (the state not school) cross country. Do some research and rank out the women.
J&SB: If Gartland is such a great coach then why are all his distance runner's injuried during CC season or after the season and then do not compete during indoor and outdoor track? Umm.. makes you wonder... This has been the case the past few years. It has more to do with just having poor biomechanics. All I am saying is that if I was a coach who kept having distance runners who kept getting injuried, then I would be doing some evaluation on my worokouts. I think anybody do the samething. All I know is that I am running a hell of lot faster then I ever did during the 4 years at ISU. That is all that matters to me. It's just a shame that it did not happen while I was there. I wish I knew then what I know now and that is that I was overtrained at ISU. It is pretty pathetic that out of all those distance runner's the past few years at ISU that they have only had 1-2 runners competing at MVC in the 800-10K. That is a fact. In my eyes, any coach who has a much of injuried runner's all the time is not a great coach. Period. Most would agree to that.
Just when was the last time that Gartland has had a CC runner compete in Nationals?? It's been quite a long time. He's had that talent, but he did not know what to do with it. All of his workouts were done super fast and never controlled. The runner's were red lining it during every workout. Umm..perhaps that is why so many runner's have been injuried. Something to think about, uh.
What were your marks at ISU? You said you've improved since then, what events are you racing now?
23 - IU
24 - Butler
25 - ND
I think they're all underranked.
My fastest track time outdoor at ISU was 18:10.That was my fastest 5K indoor or outdoor. I ran a 17:13 in an indoor meet this year. I also ran my first Marathon this past November and I ran 3:08:32. I am training totally different then I did at ISU and it has worked. My times prove it.
How many years have you been out of college? You would espect improvement after college as you continue to get older and stronger. I had a GREAT college coach, but I ran much faster after college than I did during college. I was older and stronger and led a lifestyle much more conducive to running success (i.e. 8-10 hrs of sleep per night, consistent day to day schedule, proper diet, etc..).
I know Gartland had some fantastic success back in the 80s at Western Michigan.