Allie O and Karisa Nelson join Brooks Beasts

devastedTheRealone wrote:

Seattle?

How long until Jamin is devastated, head down, pounding tables after races?

Sally Vix wrote:

truth^ wrote:

her times compare pretty closely to Grant Fisher's in reality......

I want to compare absolute time differences. She is 45 seconds off the World Record. Take a 3000 meter male runner. I am again talking absolute times. Runner Jose is 45 seconds of the World Record of 7:20. So he has run 8:05. A fine time but hardly one that will set the running world on fire. Who is giving Jose $100K to join their program?

There are 50 COLLEGIANS who have run 7:57 or better. Is anyone going to really pay Jose $100K since he ran an 8:05?

LOL...wut? one of most non-sensical posts i've seen in awhile.

Allie is about as good as Grant Fisher. Is that something you don't understand?

Why all this twisting to try to discount a runner who is top 10 all-time in the NCAA in multiple events and an obvious contender to make the Olympic team in the 5k and 10k and probably favored to make the Worlds steeple team this year?

Her 5k PR is 6 seconds from the 3rd place time at the 2016 Olympic trials.

She almost broke 32:00 in her first 10k. That obviously bodes well for marathon potential.

She is 1 second from the Olympic A standard in the steeple and likely the #4 contender for 3 spots on the Olympic team.

One injury and she would be favored to make the team.

Yet, somehow you are trying to compare her to an 8:05 male 3k runner? Why not just use her own 3k time? She's almost top 10 all-time in the NCAA in that event as well.

What are the odds of an 8:05 3k male making the Olympic team? What are Allie's? Those are the numbers that actually matter.

How far she is behind the world record in the steeple is pretty irrelevant compared to those facts. You think her sponsors care more about her making the Olympic and Worlds team or closing the gap on the steeple world record holder, who no one in the US outside of the track community has heard of?

Sally Vix wrote:

I want to compare absolute time differences. She is 45 seconds off the World Record.

I could run within 45 seconds of Rudisha. That means I'm a better runner than the #2 marathoner in the world.

team Unruly Bush wrote:

Sally Vix wrote:

I want to compare absolute time differences. She is 45 seconds off the World Record.

I could run within 45 seconds of Rudisha. That means I'm a better runner than the #2 marathoner in the world.

I'm 44 seconds from Bolt....where's my contract?

Sally Vix wrote:

Any one suggesting that she is getting 100 or 200K annually is nuts. She was a fine NCAA runner in a week NCAA field. Her steeple PR is about 45 seconds slower than the World Record. A comparable male NCAA steepler with a 45-second differential would have a PR of about 8:38 PR. That is a fine collegiate time but 38 seconds slower than Jager. Is any professional group going to pay an NCAA male steepler who turns pro $100 or $200K a year when his PR is about 8:38 and 38 seconds slower than the top American runner? Seriously? Someone said $100K for 3 years which I could find believable. She may not be a world beater but seems very likeable and kind of an underdog runner because of her small stature.

You can't compare male and female performances using seconds off the world record. For example, scoring 45 on a 50 point exam (90%) is not the equivalent of scoring 95 on a 100 point exam (95%).

Ostrander is 30 seconds slower than the American record. This is 5% slower.

Your hypothetical male runner is 38 seconds slower than Jager's American record. This is over 7% slower. A better comparable time is 8:25 which matches Allie's 5%. What kind of money do you think an 8:25 steepler should get coming out of college?

Sally Vix wrote:

Actually, I do run. 85 miles a week all of last year at the age of 58 and after Div 1. Do you run?

Hey, I ran D1 too in the early 1980s. I won't say the team but it was in the Pac10.

85 mpw is impressive. Too often I drink more glasses of beer/wine than run miles, but I try to do 20-25 mpw.

Some people have an axe to grind here. Let's look a little closer since most seem to pick the results that support their argument. First let's get it out of the way that everyone already believes all athletes should sign with the BAC. Great. Now that we have that out there let's take a more rational approach and realize not everyone is the same. Most BAC athletes make 60-70% what they would at another program. They do that to follow a coach or some other reason that pulls them in that direction. Thats fine but the reality is that as a professional, that amount of $$ difference over a career adds up. Goals are different athlete to athlete and $ does matter and figure into decisions.

On the note that this group doesn't produce. When people say that don't have medals or as many Olympians or whatever that is true. They aren't getting every single NCAA champ each year. They do happen to develop the athletes they get very well. Many athletes have run PR's as part of this group and there have been World Team members. Nick Symmonds, Cas loxsom, Katie Mackey, Drew Windle.

Izaic Yorks was 2nd outdoors last year to Centro and Wynne ran 3:51 indoors. Kerr has run 1:46.0, 3:33, and 13:28 in the last month. Katie was a 4:10 college athletes and all-American and she has developed quite well (4:03/15:00 I believe). My point is that there is obviously success in this group and that "anyone choosing this group" must not care about their career opinion is off. Allie is a fun athlete to watch and she will be successful anywhere she believes she will be successful. Talent is talent. There aren't any magic workouts out there despite what the media machine feeds you.

Mackey also coached other non-Brooks athletes when the team was first starting. People forget the team has only been around since 2013.

Brie Felnagle made a XC world team, Justine Fedronic and Angie Petty made Olympic and World teams.

Allie Ostrander made the right choice IMO. I have to assume she got paid what she’s worth from Brooks, and she’s joining a proven great team and coach.

I'm no statistician, but... wrote:

Sally Vix wrote:

Actually, I do run. 85 miles a week all of last year at the age of 58 and after Div 1. Do you run?

Hey, I ran D1 too in the early 1980s. I won't say the team but it was in the Pac10.

85 mpw is impressive. Too often I drink more glasses of beer/wine than run miles, but I try to do 20-25 mpw.

That is nice. You are younger than I but we are both fortunate to be able to run at our ages (again you are younger than I). All my former running mates are long retired.

She has never to my knowledge spoken about going to med school. I thought she was a physical education major.

Who took Hull?

A 4.0 phys ed major. Medical diagnosis is the next step.

Thems the breaks wrote:

A 4.0 phys ed major. Medical diagnosis is the next step.

She was an exercise science major. Not the same at all, but definitely more likely to result in the medical field with that major than phy. Ed.

Hm...was not expecting this. Given her prowess at mountain running, I was hoping she'd join up with a team that has some crossover into the trails (zero idea what that would be, but maybe NAZ Elite, at least from the Hoka trail shoe perspective??). Though I have heard murmurings that Brooks is going to make a move into the trail space, so maybe this is a good fit?

(and yes, I realize that 99% of you aren't even considering the mountain running path for her, but I still think she'd have way more success there than on the track)

Pat McGregor was Karisa's coach when she was NCAA champ. Is he going to Brooks also or staying at Kentucky? Didn't the big thread say he was going there last year?

Allie O is already a mountain running World Champion (2015 Junior Worlds).

She is probably known as much in the trail running world as in the track world.

If Brooks really is going to start making trail shoes, she would be a great addition as one of the most recognizable female athletes.

Many college steeplers have made good trail runners.

Her first race as a pro will be a trail race (Mt Marathon).

I expect to see her in New Hampshire at the USATF mountain champs in September.

She is probably a better mountain runner than a track runner.

mtnrunner wrote:

Allie O is already a mountain running World Champion (2015 Junior Worlds).

She is probably known as much in the trail running world as in the track world.

If Brooks really is going to start making trail shoes, she would be a great addition as one of the most recognizable female athletes.

Many college steeplers have made good trail runners.

Her first race as a pro will be a trail race (Mt Marathon).

I expect to see her in New Hampshire at the USATF mountain champs in September.

She is probably a better mountain runner than a track runner.

doubt she runs with all the smoke in the air in Seward..can't imagine doing a race level effort in that would be very healthy.

She is probably a better track runner than a mountain runner. She's world class on the ascent, not so much on the descent.

I imagine she could work on that and get there, but in track she is much closer/already at that level.

the Beasts have a lot of money into their roster. No more. Tying about big bad Nike. Outside of Bowerman, I bet they have the 2nd biggest pay roll for groups. (NOP only has 4 athletes).

Sally Vix wrote:

truth^ wrote:

her times compare pretty closely to Grant Fisher's in reality......

I want to compare absolute time differences. She is 45 seconds off the World Record. Take a 3000 meter male runner. I am again talking absolute times. Runner Jose is 45 seconds of the World Record of 7:20. So he has run 8:05. A fine time but hardly one that will set the running world on fire. Who is giving Jose $100K to join their program?

There are 50 COLLEGIANS who have run 7:57 or better. Is anyone going to really pay Jose $100K since he ran an 8:05?

Damn dude you’re dense.