Julien Wanders' last 'special training block' before Stockholm DL. 100% PR shape

At age 18 this guy was running 8.35 for 3k and 30.10 for 10k, they are good times for a teenager but hardly outstanding, the 3k wouldn't even be national level here in the UK, the 10k would be good but not outstanding and mainly because it isn't contested by many juniors. Now he is arguably the best caucasian distance runner in the world. The progression is staggering and hard to comprehend.

He is running quicker through 5k on his way to his half marathon times than his 5k pr from around 18 months ago. Show me some other people with this kind of conversion/improvement in endurance and I'll be less shocked.

wowzers wowsz wrote:

At age 18 this guy was running 8.35 for 3k and 30.10 for 10k, they are good times for a teenager but hardly outstanding, the 3k wouldn't even be national level here in the UK, the 10k would be good but not outstanding and mainly because it isn't contested by many juniors. Now he is arguably the best caucasian distance runner in the world. The progression is staggering and hard to comprehend.

He is running quicker through 5k on his way to his half marathon times than his 5k pr from around 18 months ago. Show me some other people with this kind of conversion/improvement in endurance and I'll be less shocked.

Within 4 years my 5k pace became my marathon pace....not out of the question at all.

Yeah but you weren't already running 30min 10ks at that time you were much further away and when you are slower like you were gains come much easier

Pretty easy to spot some dopers. If they have been world class, or have at least trained at a high level and then suddenly make some ridiculous jump, then definite dopers. FloJo and Barry Bonds come to mind. Ridiculous training sessions without breaking down also a giveaway (Kiprop).

Renato Canova wrote:

Another stupid idiot....... the most important tribe in Letsrun.

Renato, I do think there are some baseless accusations on LetsRun but in terms of EPO and people training in Kenya, can we not at least acknowledge they have a right to be jaded?

I certainly understand your argument that EPO isn't needed or beneficial for someone who has the freak genetics of a Kipchoge but let's be honest, there have been A LOT of EPO positives.

Kiprop, Jeptoo, Sumgong, Kirwa, Jebet, Bett, Kisorio, etc.

That being said, I do think the people who think the Kenyans are beating the Americans because they dope are idiots. It may change which Kenyan is ruling the world but i think they are superior on average to Americans.

Alabama BS wrote:

Pretty easy to spot some dopers. If they have been world class, or have at least trained at a high level and then suddenly make some ridiculous jump, then definite dopers. FloJo and Barry Bonds come to mind. Ridiculous training sessions without breaking down also a giveaway (Kiprop).

So you're of the opinion that Wanders is a doper?

Julian is the real deal. Moved to Kenya and created a training group. Has worked very hard over the last 3 years to professionalize his training. This is a lesson for the U.S. men. This is what you have to do to be world class.

This was my thought as well. Those repeats weren't done at ridiculously fast pace. The combination of volume and decent pace are what make those workouts solid. By that same token I don't get where somebody would say he's in PR shape just because of those workouts. It's a great workout, but the paces aren't insane, nor is the volume insane.

If those are correct, they look like this in translated terms:

a.m. 3k easy, 10x800 (400j) at 10k pace (27:17+), 10x400 (400j) at 5k pace (4:12/1600=13), 3k easy=3k easy, 8k@10k pace, 4k@5k pace (13:07.5+), 8k jog recoveries enroute, 3k easy=26k or 16.15 miles

p.m. 3k easy, 5k@10k pace (27:10), 5k@easy or moderate 5:49/M, 3k easy=16k=10 miles

Basically, he ran 26.2 miles in the day if this is accurate, with 13k at 10k pace and 4k at 5k pace, which makes it pretty unlikely, especially considering that it was probably at an altitude of 7 or 8 thousand feet. If he actually did it, a sub 27 is not at all unlikely this year.

Dude, honestly, that is not a hard session.

10 times 800 his 10 k intensity with a jog Race specific work kept quite easy

10 times quarters at his mile pace is speed endurance and sharpening

A fartlek in the midday is also reasonable.

This is like a very common set up for a session at pre comp period, regardless of a coach.

To lots of oafs Who cry foul on doping - you are idiots. Go train and you'll realize this is a doable workout, no doping needed

Yeah I mean the volume is pretty high, but for a special block, this is what I'd expect from someone running probably 130 mpw. Assuming he's in 1/2 marathon PR shape (59:13) then that means he's running the 800s at about 12k race pace and 400s at about 8k race pace. Then in the afternoon, the 1000s at about that 10-12k race pace again. There's a reason Canova says they take like 4 days easy after work days like this. I'm actually surprised the rest is that long, but take into account the altitude and it seems appropriate given the volume of work for the day.

When I was in 14:20 / 29:40 / 1:05 shape - I definitely could have done the morning session at my respective paces (especially with that 400 jog recovery) but that would have been a pretty killer day - but after about 3-4 days easy, I think I would have been good to go. I was also only running about 80-90 mpw at the time.

Sometimes it can be hard for people to wrap their head around elite workouts when they see 2:11 800s and 63 sec 400s and for them that's basically their ALL OUT speed. For these guys, it's a walk in the park.

skwal4 wrote:

Swiss-atletics Federation is very serious and tests his top athletes very frequently even if they are living in Kenya.

If you are such an expert, please tell us where in Kenya the Swiss anti-doping agents are based, so as to randomly test Wanders several times per year in Kenya.

Hobbyjogger High wrote:

Dude, honestly, that is not a hard session.

10 times 800 his 10 k intensity with a jog Race specific work kept quite easy

10 times quarters at his mile pace is speed endurance and sharpening

A fartlek in the midday is also reasonable.

This is like a very common set up for a session at pre comp period, regardless of a coach.

To lots of oafs Who cry foul on doping - you are idiots. Go train and you'll realize this is a doable workout, no doping needed

Getting 13k of 10k pace work and 4k of 5k pace work in a day, all at altitude, with active recovery, is most certainly a "hard workout". You're kidding yourself.

calling B S wrote:

skwal4 wrote:

Swiss-atletics Federation is very serious and tests his top athletes very frequently even if they are living in Kenya.

If you are such an expert, please tell us where in Kenya the Swiss anti-doping agents are based, so as to randomly test Wanders several times per year in Kenya.

Yeah, I have to agree with calling BS. I've seen no proof that there are Swiss anti-doping officials in Switzerland. I think we can rest assured there aren't any in Kenya!

Just seems strange that a clean athlete wouldn't go out of his way to distance himself from the dirtiest nation on the planet when it comes to distance running.

200 meters

Bernardo BALOYES COL COL

Aaron BROWN CAN CAN

Alonso EDWARD PAN PAN

Kyle GREAUX TTO TTO

Ramil GULIYEV TUR TUR

Henrik LARSSON SWE SWE

Alex QUIÑÓNEZ ECU ECU

Jereem RICHARDS TTO

200 meters women

Dina ASHER-SMITH GBR GBR

Irene EKELUND SWE SWE

Crystal EMMANUEL CAN CAN

Ivet LALOVA-COLLIO BUL BUL

Jenna PRANDINI USA USA

Jamile SAMUEL NED NED

Dafne SCHIPPERS NED NED

Elaine THOMPSON JAM JAM

400 meters

Rai BENJAMIN USA USA

Michael CHERRY USA USA

Luka JANEŽIČ SLO SLO

Michael NORMAN USA USA

Vernon NORWOOD USA USA

Nathan STROTHER USA USA

Bralon TAPLIN GRN GRN

Baboloki THEBE BOT BOT

800 meters

Harun ABDA USA USA

Peter BOL AUS AUS

Joseph DENG AUS AUS

Nicholas Kiplangat KIPKOECH KEN KEN

Andreas KRAMER SWE SWE

Marcin LEWANDOWSKI POL POL

Ryan SÁNCHEZ PUR PUR

Erik SOWINSKI USA USA

Amel TUKA BIH BIH

800 meters women

Habitam ALEMU ETH ETH

Renée EYKENS BEL BEL

Natoya GOULE JAM JAM

Hanna HERMANSSON SWE SWE

Nelly JEPKOSGEI KEN KEN

Lovisa LINDH SWE SWE

Raevyn ROGERS USA USA

Lynsey SHARP GBR GBR

Ajee WILSON USA USA

Noélie YARIGO BEN BEN

1500 meters women

Malika AKKAOUI MAR MAR

Claudia Mihaela BOBOCEA ROU ROU

Caterina GRANZ GER GER

Amy GRIFFITHS GBR GBR

Esther GUERRERO ESP ESP

Olha LYAKHOVA UKR UKR

Kerry MACANGUS GBR GBR

Katie MACKEY USA USA

Sarah MCDONALD GBR GBR

Diana MEZULIÁNÍKOVÁ CZE CZE

Laura MUIR GBR GBR

Yolanda NGARAMBE SWE SWE

Jemma REEKIE GBR GBR

1500 meters

Kalle BERGLUND SWE SWE

Bethwell BIRGEN KEN KEN

Timothy CHERUIYOT KEN KEN

Elmar ENGHOLM SWE SWE

Filip INGEBRIGTSEN NOR NOR

Henrik INGEBRIGTSEN NOR NOR

Jakob INGEBRIGTSEN NOR NOR

Brahim KAAZOUZI MAR MAR

Elijah Motonei MANANGOI KEN KEN

George Meitamei MANANGOI KEN KEN

Timothy SEIN KEN KEN

Charles Cheboi SIMOTWO KEN KEN

Ayanleh SOULEIMAN DJI DJI

Samuel TEFERA ETH ETH

Cornelius TUWEI KEN KEN

Aman WOTE ETH ETH

10,000 meters

Juan Luis BARRIOS MEX MEX

Soufiane BOUCHIKHI BEL BEL

Paul CHELIMO USA USA

Kirubel ERASSA USA USA

Robel FSIHA SWE SWE

Hagos GEBRHIWET ETH ETH

Awet HABTE ERI ERI

Ali KAYA TUR TUR

Aras KAYA TUR TUR

Gevin KERICH KEN KEN

Aron KIFLE ERI ERI

Shadrack KIPCHIRCHIR USA USA

Peter KIPROTICH KEN KEN

Rhonex KIPRUTO KEN KEN

Isaac KIPSANG KEN KEN

Kelvin KIPTUM KEN KEN

Leonard KORIR USA USA

Amos KURGAT KEN KEN

Jemal Yimer MEKONNEN ETH ETH

Charles MUNERIA KEN KEN

Juan Antonio PÉREZ ESP ESP

Amanal PETROS GER GER

Vincent Kipsang RONO KEN KEN

Napoleon SOLOMON SWE SWE

Timothy TOROITICH UGA UGA

Mogos TUEMAY ETH ETH

Julien WANDERS SUI SUI

100 meter hurdles

Tobi AMUSAN NGR NGR

Kendra HARRISON USA USA

Elvira HERMAN BLR BLR

Sharika NELVIS USA USA

Cindy ROLEDER GER GER

Nadine VISSER NED NED

400 meter hurdles

Thomas BARR IRL IRL

Carl BENGTSTRÖM SWE SWE

TJ HOLMES USA USA

Abdelmalik LAHOULOU ALG ALG

Jacob PAUL GBR GBR

Sebastian RODGER GBR GBR

Kenneth SELMON USA USA

Karsten WARHOLM NOR NOR

High Jump women

Mirela DEMIREVA BUL BUL

Marie-Laurence JUNGFLEISCH GER GER

Erika KINSEY SWE SWE

Mariya LASITSKENE ANA ANA

Yuliya LEVCHENKO UKR UKR

Yaroslava MAHUCHIKH UKR UKR

Sofie SKOOG SWE SWE

Levern SPENCER LCA LCA

Elena VALLORTIGARA ITA ITA

Pole Vault

Thiago BRAZ BRA BRA

Konstantinos FILIPPIDIS GRE GRE

Raphael HOLZDEPPE GER GER

Emmanouil KARALIS GRE GRE

Sam KENDRICKS USA USA

Piotr LISEK POL POL

Paweł WOJCIECHOWSKI POL POL

Seito YAMAMOTO JPN JPN

Pole Vault women

Angelica BENGTSSON SWE SWE

Michaela MEIJER SWE SWE

Olga MULLINA ANA ANA

Eleni-Klaoudia POLAK GRE GRE

Iryna ZHUK BLR BLR

Long Jump

Juan Miguel ECHEVARRÍA CUB CUB

Tajay GAYLE JAM JAM

Jeff HENDERSON USA USA

Luvo MANYONGA RSA RSA

Thobias MONTLER SWE SWE

Serhiy NYKYFOROV UKR UKR

Andreas OTTERLING SWE SWE

Miltiadis TENTOGLOU GRE GRE

Zarck VISSER RSA RSA

Shot Put

Maksim AFONIN ANA ANA

Franck ELEMBA CGO CGO

Jakob GARDENKRANS SWE SWE

Arttu KANGAS FIN FIN

Arwid KOSKINEN SWE SWE

Joe KOVACS USA USA

Wictor PETERSSON SWE SWE

Shot Put Women

Frida ÅKERSTRÖM SWE SWE

Brittany CREW CAN CAN

Aliona DUBITSKAYA BLR BLR

Sara GAMBETTA GER GER

Sarah MITTON CAN CAN

Fanny ROOS SWE SWE

Discus

Fedrick DACRES JAM JAM

Mason FINLEY USA USA

Ehsan HADADI IRI IRI

Christoph HARTING GER GER

Simon PETTERSSON SWE SWE

Daniel STÅHL SWE SWE

Ola STUNES ISENE NOR NOR

Lukas WEISSHAIDINGER AUT AUT

Discus Women

Valarie ALLMAN USA USA

Denia CABALLERO CUB CUB

Yang CHEN CHN CHN

Andressa DE MORAIS BRA BRA

Bin FENG CHN CHN

Vanessa KAMGA SWE SWE

Yaimé PÉREZ CUB CUB

Sandra PERKOVIĆ CRO CRO

Mélina ROBERT-MICHON FRA FRA

Marco Jäger wrote:

Last 'special block' before Stockholm 10000m race.

AM - 3k easy followed by 10x800m and 10x400m. Avg 800m - 2'11" . Avg 400m - 63". 3k easy at the end. Jog lap between all repeats.

PM - 3k easy followed by 5x(1k hard,1k moderate). Avg 2'43" / 3'37". 3k easy at the end.

He ( ore more like his coach) ask for the injury to come! Just crazy training.

rojo wrote:

Renato Canova wrote:

Another stupid idiot....... the most important tribe in Letsrun.

Renato, I do think there are some baseless accusations on LetsRun but in terms of EPO and people training in Kenya, can we not at least acknowledge they have a right to be jaded?

I certainly understand your argument that EPO isn't needed or beneficial for someone who has the freak genetics of a Kipchoge but let's be honest, there have been A LOT of EPO positives.

Kiprop, Jeptoo, Sumgong, Kirwa, Jebet, Bett, Kisorio, etc.

That being said, I do think the people who think the Kenyans are beating the Americans because they dope are idiots. It may change which Kenyan is ruling the world but i think they are superior on average to Americans.

Naa! The Kenyans are not superior. We have to look at the standing situation that Kenyans runs for their lives, Americans not! But what USA need is a smarter way of training with the few talents compared to Kenya you got.

_ wrote:

sorry but anybody in the camp knows Julien is doping

amen