Some crazy things going on back then. Here is Wejo:
Some crazy things going on back then. Here is Wejo:
Are you saying I made up what "mindweak" was assuming, and I made up that this is where we part?
Rekrunner is a liar wrote:
rekrunner wrote:
Based off of no evidence at all, but solely and purely on faith.
I don't draw conclusions that I haven't supported with facts, evidence, logic, and arguments.
I do sometimes offer opinions which may have less or no basis.
Maybe you have specific examples?
Rekrunner is a liar wrote:
No I am stating that you are completely making shit up without any support at all. You are inventing conclusions with no supporting evidence or facts at all.
[quote]rekrunner wrote:
You assume that she could not run faster than 69:29 clean. This is where we part.
This Is Getting Ridiculous wrote:
If Jepchumba could run that fast clean why would she dope and risk getting caught like she did? Athletes usually know what their physical limitations are and some accept it while others look to cheat to get faster. One other reason might be to take a shortcut with dope to achieve a certain level by getting more with less training.
Bang on!
Rekrunner really score and own goal with that one.
Oh Please wrote:
Secondly, the number 69:29 was thrown out there as a clean time, when in fact, we don't even know if that's true. That also might be a doped time and only doping for a longer time helped reduce it to 65:xx.
Yes we don't know that she simply wasn't using a smaller cocktail.
Subway Surfers wrote:
casual obsever wrote:
That's actually not a bad comparison, I am surprised.
If the cheating student improved last year from a C student to an A student, and gets caught cheating this year, he will not get retro-actively disqualified for last year's As because of a lack of evidence. However, most of his peers and teachers will be convinced that he started cheating last year. Exceptions are his girlfriend and his mom.
If the cheating runner improved last year from a 1:09 runner to a 1:05 runner, and gets caught cheating this year, he will not get retro-actively disqualified for last year's 1:05 because of a lack of evidence. However, most of his peers and teachers will be convinced that he started cheating last year. Exceptions are rekrunner and Canova.
Rekrunner really score and own goal with that one.
Ah..ha, I think we know now - rekrunner is a school teacher somewhere over there in Europe.
Bigger question, how do these people actually get EPO?
I mean, do you just walk into a pharmacy and ask for EPO?
rekrunner wrote:
Based off of no evidence at all, but solely and purely on faith.
Some of what I say is self-evident.
Some of what I say is based on historical data, like all time performances.
I don't draw conclusions that I haven't supported with facts, evidence, logic, and arguments.
I do sometimes offer opinions which may have less or no basis.
Maybe you have specific examples?
That's a joke, right?
After all, making up stuff is your standard modus operandi.
For example, you wrote just before that question, based off of no evidence at all, but solely and purely on faith:
"Welcome to the forum -- how come you have never posted until now?"
rekrunner wrote:
Are you saying I made up what "mindweak" was assuming, and I made up that this is where we part?
It sounds like you're starting to pay more attention to what Chad has to say. I think you're just having fun right now playing Devil's advocate.
Chad has a BA in human performance and PE - so he might just know a little something on this subject.
Isn't it hilarious that we have gotten through to page 7 of a doping thread, about someone very fast caught on epo and still Rekrunner is denying the benefit of epo?
He's probably going for Jon's record although he is able to change up his words and argument on a whim. Jon is more one dimensional.
m!ndweak wrote:
well sara hall is slightly off,
its 69:29 to 65:51 in a year
so the actually % gain was
5.22% gain...still not too shabby.....i wonder where rekrunner will claim the less than 1% happened
She's not slightly off she gave the minutes. Nobody running 65:51 is going to describe themselves as a 66 minutes runner.
Great that you know how to use a calculator though!
If you guys really want to know what epo does and how it feels, ask Eddy. But, I'm sure he is not properly trained.
https://www.runnersworld.com/runners-stories/a22000371/the-confessions-of-eddy-hellebuyck/
Christian but not the Lion wrote:
rekrunner wrote:
Looks like a false dichotomy. How many athletes do you suppose take EPO based on second hand experience of other athletes?
Who here is speaking from first hand experience of taking EPO and experiencing that it works?
If not, you must be an internet troll with a theory and no data.
Hi Gary, I used EPO and it worked.
Your Welcome
You kinda went from chump to champ...didn't you?
Subway Surfers wrote:
Isn't it hilarious that we have gotten through to page 7 of a doping thread, about someone very fast caught on epo and still Rekrunner is denying the benefit of epo?
I'm sure it's all an act. The use of EPO in athletics over the last 3 years is staggering. Athletes aren't going to chronically use a PED where getting caught would be catastrophic in today's climate if EPO didn't delivery big gains. It's no different in saying that all the NSAIDs on the market today are nothing more than placebo and the millions of Americans who use these medications on a regular basis are just basing it on "faith" & "belief." If NSAIDs weren't highly effective then people wouldn't use them...period. No different in the world of PEDs.
I think rekrunner is having fun - this forum being his primary means of entertainment. He probably laughs at how he gets people all stirred up and angry at his posts. I imagine everyday when he makes his rounds he probably thinks who can screw with today. The more people he gets mad & angry, the more he laughs at us. He probably shares with his family all people he's gotten flustered on these doping threads. I remember how flustered and pissed-off he got Chad a few months back. ?
Yes he must be doing this for kicks, he did say his daughter thought the Rekrunnner guy was funny (which is true ?). Anyhow since we've debated epo's effectiveness his case has only gotten weaker, yet he still holds his position.
My humble opinion on Kenyan doping bursts:
1. There are statistically more Kenyan and Kenyan born endurance runners than any other nation, even more than Ethiopia so may be Kenya is not necessarily doping more than other nations.
2. These runners are mostly from the same area in central/western kenya who are naturally gifted but also because of how many miles they generally had to run to and from school every day from a young age (7 to 10 miles on average, but can be way more sometimes) each way, they are generally quite adapted to distance running from an early age. You wouldn't believe what the punishment for late coming to school is in some of these countries (serious corporal punishment or spending the day digging on the school farm). And the punishment for arriving home late for domestic chores (fetching water, collecting firewood, tending to animals etc ) is also quite severe.
3. It will be interesting to see what happens to east African runners in the years to come since more and more kids are being dropped off to school by parents or picked by school buses (in urban areas. In rural areas kids still have to run to and from school. But may be the distances are getting shorter as more schools are built).
3. My point is Kenyans would still do well without doping.
4. I believe a typical athlete whether Kenyan or even European or American couldn't pick out pain medication from a pharmacy even if they tried. They simply have no medical or pharmaceutical training. And this is my problem with the anti doping regime in place around the world. These athletes are not procuring and self administering these drugs. They would not know which drug to purchase and the doses to take. The anti doping efforts should focus on the athlete's team as well. The trainers, doctors, nutritionists, managers etc. This way if an athlete fails a test his entire team should be banned as well. What happens now is that an athlete who didn't pick out or administer the drug to himself gets banned while his team moves on to another athlete.
5. And by the way most of these athletes are no longer trained by locals but by international groups. These people have as much to gain from drug induced improved performance of an athlete as the athlete himself. Some groups actually take way more of the athletes winnings than the athlete themselves. Which is probably not unexpected because they invest site a lot in an athlete before he or she starts to win any prize money. Training, travel and accommodation, medical expenses and other costs of developing an international class athlete can be quite significant.
6. In conclusion, I am arguing that these athletes are sometimes victims rather than perpetrators. A minority view perhaps but one that should not be dismissed entirely.
Ask the expert wrote:
If you guys really want to know what epo does and how it feels, ask Eddy. But, I'm sure he is not properly trained.
https://www.runnersworld.com/runners-stories/a22000371/the-confessions-of-eddy-hellebuyck/
Anyone know what Eddy is up to these days. I thought at one time he was coaching at a Tucson, AZ high-school?
Then why are they doping??? Have you seen the laundry list of the top Kenyans busted just for rEPO? Kiprop, Bett, Kalalei, Jebet, Jepchumba, Sumgong, Jeptoo.
Aside from Kalalei (who did win the Athens Marathon last year), there's some serious speed here; former WR record holders, Olympic Gold medalists, top marathon title holders. I could see if, maybe, one or two bad apples tested positive, but freaking 7 in the last 3 yrs? And if you don't believe in a 100% detection rate for anti-doping, then how many more escaped detection in the last 3 yrs? 1 or 2?, several?, dozens?
Now...if WADA wants to claim a 100% detection rate then Amen! - they got all the bad apples and things are all well & good now....hooray! However, if they're not anywhere near a 100%, or even a 50% detection rate, then I would say things are pretty bad if 7 athletes were caught doping just for EPO, with 6 out of those 7 top performing Kenyans!
Subway Surfers wrote:
No all the sport needs is a rule, if you didn't live in that country before you were 15, you can't represent them.
The rule the sport needs is the amateur rule to be enforced. When the sport is made strictly amateur again all of the cockroach agents, coaches, race organizers, and doctors who are as much part of this mess as the athletes will be flushed out of the sport and the likelihood of doping will be much reduced. Changing countries for money will almost cease to exist. Money used as prize money can instead go to good causes such as improving healthcare and infrastructure in countries that need it and the sport will be seen as having a much more positive impact on the world.
Great interview with Steve Cram - says Jakob has no chance of WRs this year
I’m a D2 female runner. Our coach explicitly told us not to visit LetsRun forums.
RENATO can you talk about the preparation of Emile Cairess 2:06
adizero Road to Records with Yomif Kejelcha, Agnes Ngetich, Hobbs Kessler & many more is Saturday
2024 College Track & Field Open Coaching Positions Discussion
Hats off to my dad. He just ran a 1:42 Half Marathon and turns 75 in 2 months!