If a guy like Steve Jones could run 2:07 30 years ago shouldn't a guy who likely has a bit more raw talent be able to run faster?
Moen. 2:05. Wins Fukuoka. How??
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I’m glad an actual European has the European record, rather than a Kenyan who lives in Kenya getting paid to run for Turkey, which is hardly even Europe at all (only a small portion of Turkey is even actually considered Europe). I’m excited to see what he does in the future. He’s only 26, which is pretty young for the marathon and suggests that he could definitely go faster in the next few years (maybe go for a medal in Tokyo too).
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4% wrote:
It's the shoes. 125 x 0.04 = 5.
125 +5 = 2:10
multiply by 1.04 instead -
mathy wrote:
4% wrote:
It's the shoes. 125 x 0.04 = 5.
125 +5 = 2:10
multiply by 1.04 instead
Idiot. -
The math is right...eerily so...
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If Renato Canova could do this to a guy in a winter, imagine what COACH J.S. could do to this guy!!!
Magic Winter???
Sondre Moen + Coach J.S = Sub 2 'thon for sure -
This is rich, a European record set during Mo's prime that he will never beat. Should have transitioned last year
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Again some doubt for something for me normal, when an athlete of good talent has continuity, motivation, tough and correct training, living (as Kenyan) in altitude for the most part of the year (223 days from the first of January).
The big performance of Moen, but especially the WAY he did, can clearly show two things :
1) White runners, with high talent (but not exceptional like many Kenyans and Ethiopians), if chose to be ATHLETES having a main focus only for some year in running, can be like the best African, and sometimes also better.
2) Clean runners, with high talent (but non exceptional like many Kenyans and Ethiopians), if chose to be ATHLETES having a main focus only for some year in running, can be at the top of the World, not depending their performance on the fact if are African or not.
Of course now there is some sceptic idiot who looks at doping as main reason of his improvement. Who know Moen (and my clear position) well know that he never used any supplement, also legal, because this is against our principles, and I think it's the best way for making the mind weak.
The big improvement of this year was very gradual, and now seems like an explosion only because there were more than 4 minutes between his previous marathon in Hannover and today, but we have to see at the time passed between them :
237 days, during which it's possible to build new situation, including a great increase of self confidence and personality.
In training, I already saw the potentiality for running 2:06, but what surprised also myself today is the interpretation of the race, and the personality he showed, attacking after 30 km, with 29'16" between 30 and 40 km and the last 2.195m still faster (for an average of 2'55" per km in the last 12.195m).
I will write, how already I did after his HM of Valencia in 59:48, his full plan between Valencia and Fukuoka (ALWAYS IN ALTITUDE).
I hope that this results, instead being considered connected with some doping, can bring people to think that the limits we put in our mind about the clean performances are not real, and depend not from the doping of the other athletes, but on the fact that NOBODY WANTS TO DO A CLEAR CHOICE OF LIFE DEDICATED AT THE ATHLETICS FOR A SHORT PART OF HIS LIFE, something Sondre did full time this year, with 223 days (till Fukuoka) in altitude, the most part alone, having focus in training, eating and resting only.
The quality of his training improved day after day. In January, it was for him difficult to run two following days between 3'45" and 3'50" per km, because his legs were stiff and tired after a normal workout. Today, he's not able running slower than 3'40", an sometimes I had to force him to run at regeneration speed, not faster the 3'45".
The increase of his aerobic base gave him the opportunity to have frequent sessions with high volume of km at HM speed (between 2'47" and 2'52" per km) and at Marathon speed (between 2'57" and 3'02" per km), and now these two different speeds are normal in the development of his training.
After this, we have to ask ourself : "Which are the real limits for one athlete of high but not exceptional talent, who has continuity in training, right modulation between hard sessions and recovery, big motivation, ability to grow mentally and as self confidence, AND DO EVERYTHING IN HIGH ALTITUDE ?
And, when we know it's possible this when white and clean, can we really believe that everybody running fast is doped, and EPO can give advantages for athletes REALLY well trained in altitude of 1 minute in 10000m and 4 minutes in Marathon ?
Do you think I can suppose Sondre could run under 2:02 assuming EPO ?
And somebody still has the courage to ask me "which proof you are that EPO doesn't work", continuing with the example of Lombard or Lance Armstrong, without understanding the difference from athletes at different level as talent, motivation and training (IN ALTITUDE) , or from runners and bikers ?
Clean your minds, start to believe in yourselves, and go in hard CLEAN training if are really interested in improving their performances. -
Renato, what kind of volume has sondre been running in his build up? Has it increased from his previous years of training before coming under your guidance? Or, has there just been changes in specific focus of training?
Congrats to you and Sondre on the performance. -
huh69 wrote:
This is rich, a European record set during Mo's prime that he will never beat. Should have transitioned last year
If Mo transitioned, I'm sure he could crush the European women's record! -
Renato, how much of his improvement do you attribute to the vaporfly 4% shoes he raced in? It is clear they improve economy. Have you done any tests in training with heart rates on the same courses at the same pace with different shoes?
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Renato, did Moen finally get the reindeer milk smoothie recipe from the Finns? Is that the reason for his improvement?
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Renato, thank you ONCE AGAIN, for coming here and clearing things up for us. Ignore the fools who think anyone who runs fast all of a sudden, MUST be doing drugs. You have shown that if you LOOK AT THE FULL PICTURE you can see that Moen put in the work and changed his mentality and executed a great race. I think this is the important point in Moens win yesterday: Black or white you can run and win if you follow certain training principles and have some level of talent.
Well done to you and your athlete! -
shorters stache wrote:
Renato, what kind of volume has sondre been running in his build up? Has it increased from his previous years of training before coming under your guidance? Or, has there just been changes in specific focus of training?
Congrats to you and Sondre on the performance.
See http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8495930 where he explains his training in detail from page 5 onwards (its a great read).
Including:
"The total volume of km during the first 3 months of the year, before Hannover Marathon, is as follows :
January : 925 km
February : 772 km
March : 789 km" -
Thanks for clearing that up for us Renato and delivering us a replay of Lance's "I'm sorry for those who don't believe in miracles" speech from 2005.
How about some hard data, like his VO2Max? Surely you must have noticed there was some untapped potential there when you started coaching him? His training must have been exceptionally poor before yours to allow for such improvements ! The guy couldn't run two consecutive 3'40/km sessions? Is this a joke? A 3hr marathoner can do that...Hope you don't top yourself when this guy gets what's coming to him. -
Just going to chime in here so that Renato doesn't have to waste any of his keystrokes on you. You're saying that a 3hr marathon runner could run at 3:40/km on consecutive days while doing approximately 30km/day, between large-volume workouts? Either I've misunderstood you, or you've misunderstood him.
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Congratulations, Renato.
This board and society does not celebrate victories well.
Congratulations, Moen, as well. -
Renatosmiracle wrote:
Thanks for clearing that up for us Renato and delivering us a replay of Lance's "I'm sorry for those who don't believe in miracles" speech from 2005.
How about some hard data, like his VO2Max? Surely you must have noticed there was some untapped potential there when you started coaching him? His training must have been exceptionally poor before yours to allow for such improvements ! The guy couldn't run two consecutive 3'40/km sessions? Is this a joke? A 3hr marathoner can do that...Hope you don't top yourself when this guy gets what's coming to him.
I think Renato was saying that after a long hard workout, Moen's legs were tired and found the next day at 3:40 to be tougher than it should have been. -
Tommy2Nuttz wrote:
Renato, thank you ONCE AGAIN, for coming here and clearing things up for us. Ignore the fools who think anyone who runs fast all of a sudden, MUST be doing drugs. You have shown that if you LOOK AT THE FULL PICTURE you can see that Moen put in the work and changed his mentality and executed a great race. I think this is the important point in Moens win yesterday: Black or white you can run and win if you follow certain training principles and have some level of talent.
Well done to you and your athlete!
+1 -
You need to read the post.
He could not do 3.40-45 pace the days after a Workout. Sondre has been training very well for years, but has had a near career- ending injury in his foot. That set him back for years. He had to work part time, because of three years without results.
After a couple of months of training, he ran 28.43 on the track.
Now you know something.
When you wrote your post, you knew Nothing.
Sondre is a humble, hard working great guy.
I know this. You do not know anything.
