Is that tooo many tempos?
Is that tooo many tempos?
that's what the Kenyans do.
Are you recovering? Are you getting injured? Are you improving? If you can handle it, then it is not too much.
Need more info!? Are you building a base? What event are you training for? Etc.
I honestly cannot think of a scenario in which I would advise someone to run three tempo runs a week. I am not saying that there may not be a scenario where this would make sense some elite athlete, but I am having trouble seeing it.
First off, three days of workouts per week is pretty much the upper limit of what most people should be doing; and even that is often only done for short stretches or for elite athletes. There really isn't much time for recovery if you are doing three workouts and a long run.
Secondly, assuming that you are not adding in a 4th (or more) workout session, it completely ignores other facets of training (such as running economy and vo2max). While different people benefit from emphasizing certain body systems during training, and while training for certain events requires more emphasis on certain systems than others, ignoring the other systems altogether seems inadvisable. If you are adding in a 4th workout, see my note above.
Finally, even if this is being done as part of base training, it seems inadvisable, although I guess if you are working off of a high mileage base and are otherwise relatively immune to injury, this is the most plausible time for doing that (although I would still prefer to see some short fast reps focusing on improving running economy mixed in in place of some of the tempo efforts).
In short, unless you are an elite marathoner or someone who is running 100 mpw during your base training, I don't really think this is the best use of your quality days (and even then I would have some concerns).
Smoove wrote:
Secondly, assuming that you are not adding in a 4th (or more) workout session, it completely ignores other facets of training (such as running economy and vo2max). While different people benefit from emphasizing certain body systems during training, and while training for certain events requires more emphasis on certain systems than others, ignoring the other systems altogether seems inadvisable. If you are adding in a 4th workout, see my note above.
Tempos improve running economy and vo2max. LT training is the most important aspect of distance training. If he is concentrating on mile-marathon, 3 tempos is great if he can handle it.
rdd wrote:
Smoove wrote:Secondly, assuming that you are not adding in a 4th (or more) workout session, it completely ignores other facets of training (such as running economy and vo2max). While different people benefit from emphasizing certain body systems during training, and while training for certain events requires more emphasis on certain systems than others, ignoring the other systems altogether seems inadvisable. If you are adding in a 4th workout, see my note above.
Tempos improve running economy and vo2max. LT training is the most important aspect of distance training. If he is concentrating on mile-marathon, 3 tempos is great if he can handle it.
You can do four or five tempo runs if you wanted, as long as you are doing them right. Sadly too many runners don't know how to do tempo runs. They are not races. Tempo runs should leave you invigorated and inspired, not dog tired. Learn to do them correctly and a whole new dimension in your training will open up to you.
Assuming that there are running economy and VO2Max benefits from doing tempo efforts, and I believe that there are, do you think it is the most effective way of improving those systems and would you really advocate three tempo runs per week as a primary approach to training?
That's really what I am getting at.
Smoove wrote:
I honestly cannot think of a scenario in which I would advise someone to run three tempo runs a week. I am not saying that there may not be a scenario where this would make sense some elite athlete, but I am having trouble seeing it.
First off, three days of workouts per week is pretty much the upper limit of what most people should be doing; and even that is often only done for short stretches or for elite athletes. There really isn't much time for recovery if you are doing three workouts and a long run.
Secondly, assuming that you are not adding in a 4th (or more) workout session, it completely ignores other facets of training (such as running economy and vo2max). While different people benefit from emphasizing certain body systems during training, and while training for certain events requires more emphasis on certain systems than others, ignoring the other systems altogether seems inadvisable. If you are adding in a 4th workout, see my note above.
Finally, even if this is being done as part of base training, it seems inadvisable, although I guess if you are working off of a high mileage base and are otherwise relatively immune to injury, this is the most plausible time for doing that (although I would still prefer to see some short fast reps focusing on improving running economy mixed in in place of some of the tempo efforts).
In short, unless you are an elite marathoner or someone who is running 100 mpw during your base training, I don't really think this is the best use of your quality days (and even then I would have some concerns).
Thanks for the response. Long run would be the only other hard workout in the week. I am in HS and this is our training plan for one week, it seemed like a lot, but they are different types of tempos, long one, 2 medium, a bunch of short 1 mile ones.
At about 50 mpw right now. YEs base building
malmo wrote:
rdd wrote:Tempos improve running economy and vo2max. LT training is the most important aspect of distance training. If he is concentrating on mile-marathon, 3 tempos is great if he can handle it.
You can do four or five tempo runs if you wanted, as long as you are doing them right. Sadly too many runners don't know how to do tempo runs. They are not races. Tempo runs should leave you invigorated and inspired, not dog tired. Learn to do them correctly and a whole new dimension in your training will open up to you.
Malmo,
I think I am one of those runners who doesn't know how to do tempos properly. Can you elaborate a little on how a tempo should be done? Many thanks.
thegripper wrote:
Malmo,
I think I am one of those runners who doesn't know how to do tempos properly. Can you elaborate a little on how a tempo should be done? Many thanks.
here's a link.
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=3422852#3426137thegripper wrote:
malmo wrote:You can do four or five tempo runs if you wanted, as long as you are doing them right. Sadly too many runners don't know how to do tempo runs. They are not races. Tempo runs should leave you invigorated and inspired, not dog tired. Learn to do them correctly and a whole new dimension in your training will open up to you.
Malmo,
I think I am one of those runners who doesn't know how to do tempos properly. Can you elaborate a little on how a tempo should be done? Many thanks.
In case malmo doesn't respond I'll try to fill in lol.
Start slower. Relax more.
Smoove wrote:
Assuming that there are running economy and VO2Max benefits from doing tempo efforts, and I believe that there are, do you think it is the most effective way of improving those systems and would you really advocate three tempo runs per week as a primary approach to training?
That's really what I am getting at.
If it is not around goal race month, then yes three tempos per week will be beneficial. You don't need to do that much vo2 work if the goal race is 1-2 months away. For distance running, LT is far more important than vo2 and economy. Economy doesn't even need a large focus anyway. A few hard strides a few times per week is all you need for that.
At what distance do you think that's true?
I agree re: running economy, although I am an old man and a creature of habit and do 2-3 weeks of fast reps early in a training cycle and as part of my race modeling workouts as I prepare to peak, but that's it, generally.
But for racing 5k, I focus heavily on 5k paced intervals during the bulk of my season (6-8 weeks straight). I certainly don't ignore tempo efforts - they are a once a week thing and they are the one workout that I make sure I get in most weeks. But I don't think doing two tempo efforts while ignoring vo2max intervals would give me my best results.
When I race the marathon, however, I typically get in two tempo sessions per week for the 12 weeks leading up to the race (although sometimes I drop one tempo run and replace it with either a marathon pace run, or, occasionally a 20-22 mile long run).
I think I'd need to be racing 15k or longer as my primary distance before I replaced some intervals with a second tempo run per week.
Smoove wrote:
At what distance do you think that's true?
I agree re: running economy, although I am an old man and a creature of habit and do 2-3 weeks of fast reps early in a training cycle and as part of my race modeling workouts as I prepare to peak, but that's it, generally.
But for racing 5k, I focus heavily on 5k paced intervals during the bulk of my season (6-8 weeks straight). I certainly don't ignore tempo efforts - they are a once a week thing and they are the one workout that I make sure I get in most weeks. But I don't think doing two tempo efforts while ignoring vo2max intervals would give me my best results.
When I race the marathon, however, I typically get in two tempo sessions per week for the 12 weeks leading up to the race (although sometimes I drop one tempo run and replace it with either a marathon pace run, or, occasionally a 20-22 mile long run).
I think I'd need to be racing 15k or longer as my primary distance before I replaced some intervals with a second tempo run per week.
Intervals at 5k pace is tempo work (or at least it can be).
And I didn't say to ignore vo2 work. I said that you don't really have to do vo2 work until 1-2 months before your goal race. Sounds like you are saying the exact same thing so I don't know why you are disagreeing.
I wasn't disagreeing, I was honestly trying to understand. Seems the issue was one of terminology. I use temp on and lactate threshold interchangeably; but I don't use those terms for 5k paced intervals while you do. Sounds like we generally agree.
3tempos wrote:
Is that tooo many tempos?
Depends....
Perhaps you should define to us what you think a temp run is.
Most do not know.
Do you think a Tempo run is the same ad a Threshhold run?
Important questions to ask yourself:
What is the purpose of these workouts?
How does it help you reach your immediate goals?
How does it fit into your long term program?
0 tempos
Smoove wrote:
I wasn't disagreeing, I was honestly trying to understand. Seems the issue was one of terminology. I use temp on and lactate threshold interchangeably; but I don't use those terms for 5k paced intervals while you do. Sounds like we generally agree.
Why don't you use those terms for 5k paced intervals if the stimulus is the same thing?