What has the world come to? ESPN to honor Caitlyn Jenner with the Arthur Ashes courage award.

It's the ignorant religious zealots out there that scare me/bother me way more than Caitlyn Jenner ever would! Wow, just wow!

On a run with my 14 year old daughter Wednesday she brought up this topic. Thankfully she wasn't punishing the pace and I could talk.

She asked if he was just doing it to make money thru reality TV. I said I didn't know, but that it was a possibility.

She asked what makes people like that. Again I said I didn't know. May be a bad answer but I said we could ask the same thing about lesbians and gays. We just don't know. Something in their brain makes them different. I asked if she knew any gay kids. She said, I don't know, maybe.

Yes, an awesome opportunity to have a good conversation about treating people with respect despite their differences and not saying ignorant stuff in front of your friends because some of those friends may in fact be struggling with issues that they are not ready to talk about yet. And, I told her I hoped she would be the person to stop any ignorant talk from her friends.

She rolled her eyes and told me she knew all that and is a good person and wouldn't make people feel bad.

Well, It is a parent prerequisite to have these conversations.

Perhaps we should just pick up the pace then.

Next question - jeez, why are we sprinting?

ESPN's only goal is to make money. Getting attention, getting people talking about them, is the best way for media outlets to gain viewers/readers and the advertising dollars that follow.

ESPN knew there would be outrage over this choice. As Fox News figured out a long time ago, outrage, whether based on anything real or not, sells like hotcakes.

If you think about it, it's kind of hilarious that anyone would care what a bunch of cash-hungry media executives sitting around a conference-room table in Connecticut are choosing for some made-up "award". As much as I'd like Jenner to shut the hell up about his genitals, ESPN can choke on a bag of dicks for all anyone should care.

Disappointed to see something so insensitive from a cofounder of this site. How in the world do you, a straight white male, even pretend to have any idea what Caitlyn Jenner is going through. It has to be very difficult to be going through life for so many years feeling out of place. Their family is in the spotlight in American pop culture so this has clearly been getting a lot of courage. Others make this kind of brave decision so they can feel better about living in their own skin. Another poster already said that this community has disproportionately high suicide rates and most go through life being bullied for trying to be themselves. The media has also zoned in on Caitlyn's looks, again judging women based upon their looks. Much of the coverage on this has been disgusting and as someone who is so far removed from this community think about what you are saying. Yes, you might not find it brave what Caitlyn has done because you have never been presented with a similar struggles but what she has done is beautiful. She has become herself and she is happier. That is what is important. It's not up for us to decide, debate or ask what the world has come to- hopefully a more accepting and supportive place.

rojo wrote:

Really?

http://www.people.com/article/caitlyn-jenner-arthur-ashe-award-connor-cruise-protest

I'd have a lot more courage if Jenner came out and stated that he was on steroids at the 1976 Olympics. That to me would be courage.

Or hell to change from a man to woman privately without raking in freaking millions. He'll be raking it in with his reality tv show. Shouldn't they be awarding hiim with the narcissism award?

I don't doubt what he's felt all of these years isn't extremely difficult but this is ridiculous.

Says the guy too scared of Rossi's lawyer to publish article that he said he would....

xenonscreams wrote:

Her kids are actually overwhelmingly happy that she went through with this and think that she is much better as herself than as the father Bruce Jenner tried to be but was not very good at being. It turns out it's really hard to pretend to be something you're not for your entire life. Probably not harder than finding out you're dying, but pretty damn hard.

Shut up, democrat.

Hit the nail right on the head with this

The "Death Camp of Tolerance" episode of South Park demonstrates the absurdity of politically correct reactions to this kind of stuff. It even includes a scene where the town gives "Ms." Garrison a "courage" award--and this episode aired several years before "Caitlin" was born. I can't link to the full episode, but here's a synopsis:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_Camp_of_Tolerance

Jenner is not courageous. He lives in the isolated Kardashian bubble where no one has experienced an ounce of discomfort ever in their lives. Just go take a vacation in Aruba for a month when they please lifestyles.

The homosexual or transgender kid down the street that has no one to turn to for help or no resources at his disposal, who has probably considered suicide as a way out is 1000x more courageous than Jenner.

I'm really a 16 year old boy, trapped in the body of a 40 year old man. You should all celebrate me and give me an award for being courageous and true to myself for trying to sleep with 16 year old girls.

American society is becoming more and more like Huxley's vision in "Brave New World", with a little bit of "1984" and the movie "Idiocracy" thrown in for good measure and I don't see that as a good thing.

Truthhh(in my eyes at least) wrote:

I'm astonished that you of all people are claiming the moral high ground. I hope your children have gender identity issues so that you can see it's a real thing, not some "liberal conspiracy."

Gender identity issues only arise from parental issues; or in most cases, lackthereof a parent or two. Nobody is born with gender identity issues. They stem from parents telling their kids that they are the opposite sex or not having a parent at home so they try to compromise. The brain is a powerful tool and you can convince yourself of anything. Don't think gender identity issues are natural. There's a ton of other issues behind convincing yourself you are something you are not.

ESPN's awards or who they tend to focus on is insignificant. It's a business, and its interests don't serve the common good so you have to expect behavior like this.

Jenner should not be receiving this kind of attention. I don't care if he feels like changing himself into an eagle with antlers; let him do it. But this level of attention not only devalues the transformations that millions before him have made or attempted, it also perpetuates the notion that this is a unique, attention-deserving topic. I don't think, as some will say, that this will help inspire others struggling with gender conflict, because if I were them I would want to distance myself as much as possible from the trainwreck that this has been.

As for whether gender conflict is natural or not, genetics might not be the only factor, or even the largest factor, fine. Who we are, how we think and how we percieve and react to situations is determined by a blend of genetics and environment. I don't think people sits down and decides to "convince themselves" of something, like that they a man in a woman's body, that when weighed by most metrics makes their lives more difficult.

Blaming it on the parents is another ridiculous notion. Show research that links parenting and gender identification beyond some loose correlation. It could be the biggest factor but until it's been rigorously tested, stop jumping to conclusions.

ESPN is spot on. good for Jenner making a public statement for acceptance instead of a cowardly secretive disappearance from society that perpetuates the non acceptance of the sport world. Athletics has long been a place of intolerance and machismo. How many high school [L]GBT boys have been bullyed by the football clique? Why should he hide? If he can make money in the process why not? It's a free market. shes providing you more click bait, you should be glad. As far as raking in millions, view it as an emotional damage award for having to tolerate intolerant athletes at every level for so long.

Bruce isn't facing any real danger by telling the world he's a woman. He lives in a rich coddled bubble and no one really gives a crap.

Now, real courage is what you see with those kids who go to school everyday and get bullied and harassed, and sometimes beatup, for saying their the wrong gender.

This award is the PC award now.

In the case of Bruce, his decision would have been courageous had he done it 30 years ago. Now he just looks like a clown.

To me this is not the real issue. Recognizing gender identity as a real thing and empathizing with people struggling with it is good, and a great conversation to have with your kid. The issue for me and many others is that beyond Jenner's gender identity issue, he/she is not a very admirable person. In addition to probably being guilty of vehicular manslaughter recently, Jenner indulges in the crass and banal culture of reality tv with a bunch of vapid, talentless, publicity-seeking sluts to make money. I haven't read the criteria for the Arthur Ashe award, but I find it hard to believe there aren't a few better citizens out there to give it to. What redeeming qualities does Jenner have beyond gender identity issues and winning an Olympic gold medal 40 years ago?

Why on Earth does everyone take the people, shows and films an award shows nominates as the law of what people think? Guess what folks? Real life topics aren't a contest as to what wins and what loses. We can applaud Bruce Jenner for revealing his true self AND whatever else is noteworthy. ESPN is a damn media network solely interested in generating revenue. If they want to nominate the homeless guy down the street for their award because it will give them the greatest exposure and ad dollars, guess who's winning this year? Grow the hell up, Rojo, and keep your political opinions and naive opines on pop culture distinct.

xenonscreams wrote:

Her kids are actually overwhelmingly happy that she went through with this and think that she is much better as herself than as the father Bruce Jenner tried to be but was not very good at being. It turns out it's really hard to pretend to be something you're not for your entire life. Probably not harder than finding out you're dying, but pretty damn hard.

Uh hello, he isn't a very good parent because he's a narcissistic a$$hole.

Getting a bunch of plastic surgeries isn't being yourself, it's the opposite.

Now he got a new reality show. No wonder the screwed up Kardashian kids like him more, he just scored them more $$$$$.

By the way, he's still "deciding" whether his new persona will have romantic relationships with men or women. I thought that wasn't a choice. What a hero for the LGBT community. Not.

Perfectly put. Thank you.