Albuterol Salazar wrote:
Honestly if you've ever seen Galen in person it is very clear that they are doing everything possible (legal or not) to maximize his potential. He looks superhuman
Maximize? Rupp should have Marco Pantani ear surgery.
http://www.canadiancyclist.com/races01/pantani_pinned.jpgsalazar and rupp are innocent until proven guilty.
i'm going to wait for the tv show to come out first before jumping to conclusions.
"Is a coach always necessary? It’s a controversial topic to float" - Controversial when it's AlSal.
http://www.athleticsweekly.com/0/admin/blog/who-needs-a-coach/
ummm, the tv show was yesterday.
[/quote] I took a 5 day "burst" of it when I was stuck in a bad migraine cycle several years ago. At the time, I was very much a hobby jogger who did 2-5 miles once or twice a week and had no intention of ever racing.
The second day I was on Prednisone, I "accidentally" ran 10 miles. Combination of WAY TOO MUCH ENERGY and being too jittery to realize how far I'd gone. Wasn't tired after either. Couldn't go to sleep that night - just wanted to bounce off the walls.
Based on my own experience, I have no problem believing that it can be performance enhancing. It certainly was in my case.[/quote]
I had a similar experience as well. Took it for 5 days for poison ivy and just felt awesome for the whole week/crushed workouts etc. This is long before I had heard anything about it helping performance. The effects were such that I even asked one of the pharmacy majors at my school about it and he said that it was unlikely...not that type of steroid etc.
I will say that I also felt like complete shit for a couple weeks once I came off of it.
You know what I hate more than all this doping news! All the SURVEYS on every story I click on this site! OK just had to get that off my chest. Back to business.
I have always been a Centro fan but not after that response to his twitter about all the things going on at their NOP camp. It sure makes him seem like he is part of all this and I have lost all respect for the guy.
good wiggler wrote:
salazar and rupp are innocent until proven guilty.
...
Proof has nothing to do with whether or not an individual is innocent or guilty. It is only relevant toward the issue of whether or not it is reasonable for someone else to proclaim the individual's guilt or innocence.
now available to the masses wrote:
the BBC story is now on YouTube - starts around 33:30
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pH8KYkKzqA4
Jesus Christ, his former training partner from HS is such a d**che, acting like prednisone the worst crime.
Talk to any osteo; catabolic steroids taken chronically will cause stress fractures and other issues. They do nearly the opposite of anabolic steroids.
Plus, who thinks strong anti-inflammatories should be banned? Prednisone makes you hungry and lazy and cannot be taken long-term. If you think it 'accidentally' gave you anabolic steroid side effects, you're misinterpreting a placebo effect.
- separately, does macrodosing also dodge carbon isotope testing? It seems like it would, but I'm not entirely sure.
what/is/up wrote:
Lydiard would kick Salazar's ass into the f/cking ground.
Know that.
second that for sure. Lydiard would be all over Salazar in the media if he were alive to witness this shit.
EPO is my middle name wrote:
"Travelling to America, Walter George faced the top American miler Lon Myers over a series of three races in November 1882. A total of 130,000 attended these races at the Polo Grounds in New York City. In the first, Myers beat George 1:563⁄5 to 1:57 in the 880 yards. The next week, George led all the way in defeating his rival 4:212⁄5 to 4:273⁄5 in the mile. In the final 3/4 mile showdown, 60,000 watched George and Myers battle on a cold day on a bad track. George led narrowly with a 612⁄5 and 2:02¾ before Myers took the lead. But Myers staggered at the end and collapsed after crossing in 3:13 - behind George who won in 3:10½. Both fell unconscious after the race and George described it as "the most gruelling race I ever ran."
With nothing more to prove in the amateur world, George turned professional in 1885 and challenged Cummings over the mile.
The long-awaited mile challenge race was held on 31 August 1885 at Lillie Bridge, witnessed by some 30,000 spectators. Crowds of people angry they had been denied entry broke through the closed entry gates and ended up completely encircling the running track both inside and out.
Cummings arrived at 5:30 pm and walked two laps of the track. George, caught in traffic, arrived shortly before 6:00 pm and climbed over the crowd with a ladder as the risk of injury pushing through the crowd was too great. Nevertheless, both runners had to force their way through the crowds with their handlers.
Betting was heavy, with Cummings favoured over George. At the gun, George dashed ahead, with Cummings close behind, in a steady rain. Cummings, who had won the coin toss, had chosen the third-of-a-mile rectangular cinder track at the site over the favoured quarter-mile cycling track. At the quarter mile point of the race, hindered by the slow track with sharp corners, George led with 583⁄5, a torrid pace which the crowd enthusiastically cheered.
But Cummings was close enough to be able to touch George's heels with his fingertips. At the half-mile point, they were at 2:01, and the crowd went delirious. At 1,000 yards, Cummings pulled even. At the three-quarter mark, George was at 3:07½, only half a second slower than the world record pace.
Instead of slowing, George kept the pace, and Cummings struggled to keep up. Halfway through the final lap, Cummings gave up and started to walk, and since winning was the main concern today, George slowed to a walk when he was far enough ahead. Cummings, urged by his boosters, started to run again, which caused George to start to run again. He beat Cummings by some 65 yards in a time of 4:201⁄5, remarkably fast given his leisurely last lap."
Here we go wrote:Funny thing about Darth Vader is, he wasn't wrong. Might have had a scary voice and some phatom chokey powers but he wasn't wrong. When was the most popular point in American Track and Field history?? Ill give you the answer,'68 mexico Olympics up until 2000, All of the athletes in this time period had the luck to be competitors in the "wild west" of doping. As soon as the THG scandal hit...America was NO LONGER the face of track and field. You think the intricate connection between popularity and Legalized PED's is a gross misjudgment, while History, Logic and a little bit of research will tell you, It is a universal truth, in all sports. The choice is ours, we can have an honorable, honor system, tattling, finger pointing, exposee crazed existence, dictated too by those whose hopes and dreams rest with the thought that everyone better are only that BECAUSE they dope.......Or we can have a national, money making juggernaut, easily advertiseable because athletes are Bigger, Stronger, Faster and Fresher, longer, pushing the human body to limits unexplored...(except in East Germany).....One sounds awesome.....the other sounds boring as hell, and ready to crater.
Track was the biggest thing back in the 80s -
the 1880s.
130,000 spectators for a 4:21 mile?
These guys did close to zero training, and Walter George incredibly did 51:20 for 10 miles off of scarcely more than a glorified high knees drill.
George also ran 4:10.2 for a record that would stand from 1886 to 1931. Maybe the most talented guy ever.
Anyone who believes he was doping is incredibly cynical, all he had at his disposal would have been narcotics and some natural stimulants.
It's not quite a "universal truth" that doping is needed for popularity.
I see, Mr. lives in the turn of the century...Yes you are right Walter George is WAAAAYYY more recognizable than Flo Jo, or Micheal Johnson, Mike Powell, Mac Wilkins, Brian Oldfield, Valerie Brisco, Carl Lewis, Marion Jones, or Jackie Joyner Kersee. But i guess you prefer to think of the track and field before the modern olympics....or NBA, or MLB...or NFL....NASCAR, the PBA and professional bull riding. Entertainment in the 1880's was kicking cans, pushing a hoop with a stick, and dodging polio.....WHEW to be a trackster back then....MAN i missed out!!!.....-_-. SO guys doing High Knees in Cullottes and wing tips is the way to bring back popularity?? ALERT THE MEDIA. Good lord....Idiocracy is here.
darkwave wrote:
exthrower wrote:There is NO athletic benefit to taking Predisone....none...I took it for asthma and actually performed worse in the gym....It's an anti-inflamitory...
I took a 5 day "burst" of it when I was stuck in a bad migraine cycle several years ago. At the time, I was very much a hobby jogger who did 2-5 miles once or twice a week and had no intention of ever racing.
The second day I was on Prednisone, I "accidentally" ran 10 miles. Combination of WAY TOO MUCH ENERGY and being too jittery to realize how far I'd gone. Wasn't tired after either. Couldn't go to sleep that night - just wanted to bounce off the walls.
Based on my own experience, I have no problem believing that it can be performance enhancing. It certainly was in my case.
A year ago in March, I had a mysterious rash that cover my entire torso. It was like I had a massive measles outbreak. Went to the Doctor and she prescribed a 6 day schedule of prednisone, much like you described. 6-5-4-3-2-1 pills per day.
So it almost knocks out the rash and I go back to my doctor and tell I think I need another dosage. So now I confess to her, "you know that, this stuff was incredible!" She smiled and replied, "good stuff huh?" "YEAH", I said, "I felt full of energy, incredibly alert, and incredibly focused!" She smiled again and said, "there's a reason why we prescribe it for short periods, and have to taper the regimen like that. Even for short periods, prednisone can really throw your entire endocrine system out of whack."
So when I hear "prednisone" all I can think of is this powerful super-drug, and yes, it has to be a PED. You feel like Superman on it. When I hear "prednisone" I also hear the potential for dangerous side effects, even in short term regimens.
exthrower wrote:
Love Your Logic wrote:Hey, I love your logic dude.
So, basing your conclusion off of a sample size of one in a completely different activity you have come the the scientifically sound conclusion that "there is NO athletic benefit to taking Predison...none".
Brilliant!
Please quote me ONE scientific paper that alleges an athletic benefit to taking Prednisone....The reverse is actually true, it has serious side effects that harm physical activity.
Actually, if you were working closely with an endocrinologist, I believe you could counter-balance the side effects. Dr Jeffry Brown is what kind of medical specialist?
Homunculus wrote:
Err...Er wrote:Hate to break it to you but Kara is not really the point of what is going on.
You may like her. You may despise her. Makes zero difference.
Now try to get back on track.
I'm sorry, but with all the pros coming out praising Goucher, I think it's worth putting her claims under a little scrutiny. If the program is that dirty I have a hard time imagining how she is clean. Virtually all of the people outing Armstrong were dirty as well.
These pros are in a good position to suspect. That they are all speaking out in support of Kara suggests to me that they don't think she was dirty -- at least by choice.
EPO is my middle name wrote:
George also ran 4:10.2 for a record that would stand from 1886 to 1931. Maybe the most talented guy ever.
Anyone who believes he was doping is incredibly cynical, all he had at his disposal would have been narcotics and some natural stimulants.
Narcotics and stimulants are the most effective PED's there are. Even "cold medicine," pseudoephedrine, a far cry from the amphetamine that can be made from it, is standard fare for sprinters today.
The professional era of Walter George was far better than anything since. But George was a pharmacist's assistant, and even in the 1870's would have had access to all the opiates and cocaine he wanted.
If sprinters could get away with amphetamine use in competition today, all the records would be obliterated.
prednisone is a very powerful drug for an endurance athlete. longer the race the better it is. that's why so many cyclist have been popped for it through the years. and it's why they wouldn't allow Vaughters to use it during the tour even when he was stung on the face and his eye swelled up like a grapefruit. it works.
like any performance enhancing drug, be it testosterone or epo, the dosage and timing is critical. too much or for too long and of course it won't be performance enhancing.
When it comes to the mystery guy on the video, could it be Anthony Famiglietti?
I remember him telling a similar story a while back about his experience going out to meet with Salazar and the NON group.
A few basic concepts that need to be reinforced to some people:
- even if you don't test positive, it's still against the rules to take testosterone, EPO, etc
- Just because you didn't like a medication the one time you took it, doesn't mean it's not a PED
- just because someone says something, doesn't necessarily mean it's true
- you are PRESUMED or CONSIDERED innocent until proven guilty; that doesn't necessarily mean you ARE innocent
darkwave wrote:
exthrower wrote:There is NO athletic benefit to taking Predisone....none...I took it for asthma and actually performed worse in the gym....It's an anti-inflamitory...
I took a 5 day "burst" of it when I was stuck in a bad migraine cycle several years ago. At the time, I was very much a hobby jogger who did 2-5 miles once or twice a week and had no intention of ever racing.
The second day I was on Prednisone, I "accidentally" ran 10 miles. Combination of WAY TOO MUCH ENERGY and being too jittery to realize how far I'd gone. Wasn't tired after either. Couldn't go to sleep that night - just wanted to bounce off the walls.
Based on my own experience, I have no problem believing that it can be performance enhancing. It certainly was in my case.
I was on a 5-day pack as well. Felt great on day 2 and felt like shit tapering off it. It is powerful stuff. I cant imagine taking it long term
rubber. wrote:
Jesus Christ, his former training partner from HS is such a d**che, acting like prednisone the worst crime.
prednisone is banned by WADA. The acceptable usage is Zero. It is not what a usage level that cannot be tested for.
So let's say that Rupp and Salazar have been "straddling the line" and micro dosing testosterone and/or other things for many years. Let's also say they get busted for illegally manipulating the TUE process to misuse thyroid meds, prednisone, and whatever other shady borderline banned drug. So now they're banned, reputation in the garbage, disgraced, disowned, etc...
THEN...
I want to see the full capability of the Oregon Project. I want the best technology and training in the world to unleash with no regard for anti-doping. I wanna see Salazar's full megalomania released and allowed to TURN THE TIMID RUPPER INTO F-ing DRAGO from rocky IV (except the distance running version, you get the idea). I want the best tech, the best meds, the best training, the best everything that modern man has to offer. And after pumping in the EPO and the T and the HGH and 300 miles/wk on the AlterG-Hydro-Super-techmill-5000, schedule a time trial. 5k, 10k, Marathon, whatever.
I want to know how fast a white man can run.
What is the threshold that separates a "hobbyjogger" from a "sub-elite" runner?
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