Say if I take it at 65-70% MHR, around 9-10:00/mi pace. I just would like to run one day really slow but for 2-3 hours. Would that benefit my aerobic system or is that too easy/slow for any real benefit?
Say if I take it at 65-70% MHR, around 9-10:00/mi pace. I just would like to run one day really slow but for 2-3 hours. Would that benefit my aerobic system or is that too easy/slow for any real benefit?
According to Renato Canova, long slow runs are used by his athletes for recovery. He says that (to a certain extent, I would add, obviously, since sometimes complete rest is called for) recovering using long slow runs is better than doing nothing and he supported this with reports from blood tests and training outcomes. He even used the term "supercompensation" to describe how long slow runs function, aiding recovery in combination with hard training, which I found very interesting. In 2013, Nassim Nicholas Taleb--a business writer, risk thinker and statistician, released the third part in his trilogy of books, a book called Antifragile where he elaborates on his ideas of risk, approach to life and strategies. In Antifragile, for the first time, Taleb delves/brings in research and his own conceptions of observations from the natural world. The basic idea is not to approach financial investment and, presumably, life and health, with a middle-ground moderation approach, but to know when to take it slow and when to be aggressive and to practice this in one "bimodal barbell strategy." Anyways, I'm just writing this because I think there is some transcendent and time-tested truth to Canova's program and to the use of long-slow runs as recovery.
Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:
According to Renato Canova, long slow runs are used by his athletes for recovery. He says that (to a certain extent, I would add, obviously, since sometimes complete rest is called for) recovering using long slow runs is better than doing nothing and he supported this with reports from blood tests and training outcomes. He even used the term "supercompensation" to describe how long slow runs function, aiding recovery in combination with hard training, which I found very interesting. In 2013, Nassim Nicholas Taleb--a business writer, risk thinker and statistician, released the third part in his trilogy of books, a book called Antifragile where he elaborates on his ideas of risk, approach to life and strategies. In Antifragile, for the first time, Taleb delves/brings in research and his own conceptions of observations from the natural world. The basic idea is not to approach financial investment and, presumably, life and health, with a middle-ground moderation approach, but to know when to take it slow and when to be aggressive and to practice this in one "bimodal barbell strategy." Anyways, I'm just writing this because I think there is some transcendent and time-tested truth to Canova's program and to the use of long-slow runs as recovery.
How long are the long slow runs and at what pace? That is very interesting. Would be nice to start incorporating those on Sundays for a recovery forma hard week of training.
ultra runners are proof that some people will still wear a trucker hat.
Ask Ed Whitlock, anyone who trained under Van Aaken or, well... me. I got a lot faster when I slowed down and went longer. I improved from 2:50 to 2:30 in the marathon by changing from 80-90/wk at 6:40 pace to >140/wk at 8-9 minute pace. I trained at exactly that HR with the exception of a workout or two per week plus frequent races.
At the top of the forums, there is a link amalgating "great training threads" etc. The thread I'm referring to is this:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=222028
I can't remember which page it's on so I'll look for it. I'm not sure the pace really matters--the point is it's supposed to be easy and for recovery and not for impressing people. Anyway, there are tons of forumites and coaches and athletes that frequent these boards who are more experienced and would have links to threads. Hopefully some might come out of the woodwork to give u more info.
In that thread,
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=222028&page=1
the second post (and the second post by Canova).
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/post.php?board=1&reply=223430
Apparently doesn't specify the long slow recovery run pace in that post.
Link wrote:
Ask Ed Whitlock, anyone who trained under Van Aaken or, well... me. I got a lot faster when I slowed down and went longer. I improved from 2:50 to 2:30 in the marathon by changing from 80-90/wk at 6:40 pace to >140/wk at 8-9 minute pace. I trained at exactly that HR with the exception of a workout or two per week plus frequent races.
You were a 2:30 marathoner? Sheesh, that is impressive to say the least. It must work then. I run 50mpw with 2 doubles a week. Sunday's I usually don't run but form what it sounds like, I should. And I should easy. Instead of a 2 hour bike ride to shake out the legs would an hour of really easy 9-10min pace be better?
Looking forward to seeing more replies!
anybenefit wrote:
Say if I take it at 65-70% MHR, around 9-10:00/mi pace. I just would like to run one day really slow but for 2-3 hours. Would that benefit my aerobic system or is that too easy/slow for any real benefit?
Yeah, rereading your question this is one for the big coaches (and you'll probably want to give more information about your circumstances: fitness, age, goals, what other things you're doing simultaneously, etc.). If you do that pace for 1-hour/45 minutes or less, it could be used as recovery. But based on your idea to go really long, you're imagining/intending some sort of direct performance function for it, rather than just a tool to facilitate recovery/make gains from previous training.
Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:
anybenefit wrote:Say if I take it at 65-70% MHR, around 9-10:00/mi pace. I just would like to run one day really slow but for 2-3 hours. Would that benefit my aerobic system or is that too easy/slow for any real benefit?
Yeah, rereading your question this is one for the big coaches (and you'll probably want to give more information about your circumstances: fitness, age, goals, what other things you're doing simultaneously, etc.). If you do that pace for 1-hour/45 minutes or less, it could be used as recovery. But based on your idea to go really long, you're imagining/intending some sort of direct performance function for it, rather than just a tool to facilitate recovery/make gains from previous training.
Miles per week: 45-50. Running 6 days a week, doubling 2 days with easy 3-5 mile AM runs. 18 years old. I am wanting to improve my 5k time if it is possible within 1-2 months of XC season. Afterwards, I plan to run more miles and build a base to start running marathons. This was initially asked for when XC ends, but if it can be used as a recovery, then let it be intended for in season as well
Kipketer_Pumpkin_Eater wrote:
According to Renato Canova, long slow runs are used by his athletes for recovery. He says that (to a certain extent, I would add, obviously, since sometimes complete rest is called for) recovering using long slow runs is better than doing nothing and he supported this with reports from blood tests and training outcomes. He even used the term "supercompensation" to describe how long slow runs function, aiding recovery in combination with hard training, which I found very interesting. In 2013, Nassim Nicholas Taleb--a business writer, risk thinker and statistician, released the third part in his trilogy of books, a book called Antifragile where he elaborates on his ideas of risk, approach to life and strategies. In Antifragile, for the first time, Taleb delves/brings in research and his own conceptions of observations from the natural world. The basic idea is not to approach financial investment and, presumably, life and health, with a middle-ground moderation approach, but to know when to take it slow and when to be aggressive and to practice this in one "bimodal barbell strategy." Anyways, I'm just writing this because I think there is some transcendent and time-tested truth to Canova's program and to the use of long-slow runs as recovery.
I've read several accounts of Lydiard using the long slow run approach with his athletes as a recovery tool, specifically when they had hit a rough patch from too much racing or hard anaerobic training.
Can't remember the details, but several long, deliberately slow training runs were the key to his athlete bouncing back from a slump and saving a season.