In Defense of Galen

A few disclaimers: 1. I ran at U of O, was teammates with Mr. Rupp, and consider him a longtime friend. 2. I do not know with certainty who Jack Frost is but have him narrowed down to 5-6 potential people. All old U of O people from my "era". 3. I am posting from a proxy website to cover my IP address…obviously, I don't want any of this coming back to haunt me or anyone else. 4. I am only a casual observer of this sport. Meaning- only check results when old friends race.

I was informed of this posting recently. Came on here to look at the ruckus and hoopla.

I am going to comment re: the OP by JF. I am doing this out of a cautious hope that perchance it will offer a differing perspective of this "controversy".

By and large, what JF said is true. Perhaps JF could have strayed away from the focus on the Wisco v. Rupp dynamic. Maybe this would have prevented it from being perceived as a personal attack. Having said that. the phone calls, taunting, and weird focus on Mr. Rupp by the then-Wisco dudes was kind of bizarre. This happened most in the 05-06-07 seasons. It laid the stage for the acrimonious relationship between the Al Sal guys and the Schumacher guys. Since then, it seems every small thing between these two groups is blown out of proportion. Big time.

Speaking from a friend's perspective, it has been hard for us to not respond in kind whenever we hear of someone really saying something about Mr. Rupp that we know is just simply not honest.

For instance: lots of attention to this thyroid dealio. Fam basically put him on full blast, out of the blue. Now it has surfaced that Schumacher's guys are on it. I don't know enough about the thyroid implications to opine about legality, morality, what not. But at least now everyone might take a step back. Think about why Mr. Rupp has a million blows on here. Especially when Schumacher's crew has seemingly emerged unscathed for the same actions. Maybe JF thought it was time to open up about it. Lots have known for some time. I first found out about Schumacher-Dr. Brown connection in 2009. I didn't have strong opinions then. And I still don't.

I think what it boils down to is two groups that operate under the same philosophy: what isn't illegal, is by definition legal.

noce wrote:

jack frost wrote:

It's not an accusation, as I've stated before. I was merely pointing out one large, gaping example of a double standard. Still no one will refute that they aren't on the thyroid meds, because it's true.

The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim.

That would be you.

Just curious if you're ok with the accusations against Rupp? If so, have you defended him as well and asked accusers to provide proof?

Curiousone wrote:

Have any of you guys ever heard of random drug testing?? It's where they come knocking at your door at 6am and you have to take the test right then and there or else it's a fail. Oh...and the crazy part is...it's random! Enough of this bs about him being afraid to drug test after a meet so that's why he drops out or runs low key meets.

You have to submit to usada exactly where you are going to be for the next three months. If they come to test you and you aren't where you said you would be, then it's a failed test. Again, I'd like to reiterate the point that the date is RANDOM

So, the exact same testing regime that Marion Jones and Lance Armstrong were subject to for years with ZERO positive tests?

(Microdose much? Before bed much?)

RRRR wrote:

jack frost wrote:

Also, Mr. Know: the only fellow athlete of Galen who has more medals than him, is Mo Farah. There isn't any other current Western distance runner more decorated than these two.

???

Mr. Know never said he was from a Western country. Just because he can type in English, does not mean he is from a Western nation. Might want to think things through before attacking his personal credentials...

People need to broaden their horizons to guess who Mr Know is. Henrik Ingebrigtsen from Norway has the track record, although he wasn't in Boston.

Who could it be...?

jack frost wrote:

"This is coming from somebody who is a fellow athlete of Rupps and has more medals than Rupp has so it's something that us IN the track game no very well."

He's clearly from the US. I didn't attack his personal credentials. I dismissed them. I went through the start list to the NBIG and did not find any athlete in any event that fit the description he boasted of.

Why do you think he's from the US?

And did you look at ALL of the events?

jack frost wrote:

I am not "A Duck", and before I started this thread, I have maybe posted three times several years ago. I do not work for Nike and have no dog in this fight. I merely am providing an objective rendering of the facts and truth.

"No dog in this fight" = old-timey rhetorical flourish A Duck ALWAYS uses.

Also, how could A Duck NOT be chiming in on his favorite topics in this thread? A Duck and Jack Frost are like the fanboy version of Clark Kent and Superman.

Tor wrote:

It (a positive test, proof of doping) could certainly happen, but the comparison to Armstrong at this point isn't appropriate. No one has come forward with any viable allegations that Rupp has used PEDs.

You know, you sound a lot lot Lance Armstrong's supporters. Circa 2010.

jack frost wrote:

He is not using anything other than what Alberto and Ricky Simms have said he is using and you have no reason to believe otherwise.

And how would YOU "know" that?

Do you have a camera in Rupp's house?

A Duck wrote:

NOP is a clean program. Until a recent thread I held back (though I had permission) that Steve Magness had confirmed to me that NOP was a clean program and that he did not leave NOP due to any issue in that area.

So we have the word of someone with a vested interest in us believing that it is a clean program? Great.

That fact that YOU HAD TO ASK HIM THIS shows (1) that you are not the insider you pretend to be, and (2) that your own "information" doesn't allow you to form a fact-based opinion on the program.

jack frost wrote:

I really wonder why you bother posting this stuff. It hurts the sport.

Yet another of your lines that come directly out of the Lance Armstrong script...

jack frost wrote:

Ok, why don't you ask Teg, Solinsky, etc. if they did or did not in fact do what I personally witnessed being done.

Then we will see.

First you said you heard about it second hand, and now you personally witnessed it? Get your story straight.

[quote]MRP KY runner wrote:

Personally, I think that if Alberto would have been able to help advise and coach Chris with the long-term approach that he takes with his athletes that Chris may have avoided his 2011 injury./quote]

As I understand it, Solinsky got that injury by falling down the stairs. It really couldn't have been helped.

A Duck wrote:

NOP is a clean program. Until a recent thread I held back (though I had permission) that Steve Magness had confirmed to me that NOP was a clean program and that he did not leave NOP due to any issue in that area.

Good grief, give it a rest. I find an odd similarity with you Oregon/Rupp/NOP fans and the group of Lance supporters who followed him around as yes men. The mystique of the Nike UO thing they have going on in Eugene makes you put blinders on and ride NOPs coat tails. You feel that because you have intimate knowledge of something 99.9% of insiders don't you feel the need to defend them to the death. NOP is clean? You say that with such certainty. At the same time, you'll sit there and rag on Nick Willis because he runs for Adidas and New Zealand.

I have lots of respect for the entire NOP group in terms of performance. They certainly run faster than I ever will. But I and others don't like the most of what NOP and Rupp are selling because of the self important slant they put on everything else as if ends justify absolutely everything they do. Last year they prohibited Flotrack from showing their workouts because it was some big secret. Really? Is the workout so ground breaking or important that you feel the need to hide it from everyone? You mean to say that the africans are actually sitting on their computers with their 56k modems trying to figure out for NOP is prepping? Come on...

Rupp is the best US distance runner right now. Ok. I get that this was the plan from the start, but at what point do they draw the line in their justification for performance? It seems like they just put Rupp on the free ride to bypass any kind of normal living that takes away from running fast including sleeping in his own altitude tent as student. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that's not available to every student in the NCAA, but its the golden boy of US distance running, so its OK! That is exactly why people don't like Salazar and Rupp, because the list of stuff he is allowed for performance is from here to the moon. Money, NCAA loopholes, personal coaching, dropping out of races only to do 8000m of track work after. Its all OK because its Rupp and because Rupps goal is to run fast. Its like they're starting to ignore whats normal to sacrifice everything on the altar of winning. Thats why I don't believe they are 100% clean. They cant take a step back and look to see themselves in the mirror because they're so preoccupied with being the best. Thats when doping becomes the next natural step.

Some of the members come off fine, i.e. Centro. But others also fit into the self important model quite well. Certain newcomers feel their membership in NOP gives a free pass to treat their former coach like an errand boy. Funny phone calls aside, I would much rather have a beer with the members of Jerrys group than NOP, because they at least seem like they aren't entitled and over privileged.

This is an amazing thread!

I always thought that Solinsky was on thyroid meds!

Wasn't Stuart Eagon good friends with Josh Mcdougal or something?

rupp-certified BS detector wrote:

Tor wrote:

It (a positive test, proof of doping) could certainly happen, but the comparison to Armstrong at this point isn't appropriate. No one has come forward with any viable allegations that Rupp has used PEDs.

You know, you sound a lot lot Lance Armstrong's supporters. Circa 2010.

Sorry to disappoint, but I realized Lance was a doper long before the masses on Letsrun. I haven't posted much, but if you to look back at Armstrong threads, it's quite obvious what I thought about Lance.

Yes, Tor, it appears from your prior posts that you work for USADA. What Rupp is doing is going to be an incredibly tough case for the USADA to crack.

It took a long time to bring down Marion Jones and Lance. But eventually it happened. I wouldn't want to be Rupp or Chris Christie right now. I wonder about Lagat sometimes. Regina was running very fast indoor times at 39 until ...

buddy puddy wrote:

It took a long time to bring down Marion Jones and Lance. But eventually it happened. I wouldn't want to be Rupp or Chris Christie right now. I wonder about Lagat sometimes. Regina was running very fast indoor times at 39 until ...

Regina was running PRs in the same event she'd always run at 39. Lagat's been moving up and getting slower over time. If he runs 3:26 during outdoors, then you might start worrying.