What do I get out of this workout?

Oh wow you really need to work on your endurance. That's the biggest drop off in time I've ever seen from an 800 to 1600. And if you can run 52.7 for 400, you should go under 2 flat in the 800. Get in some longer normal runs, and your endurance will get a bit better. If you want to go even further, put in one tempo run a week (but you have to be doing longer runs before incorporating tempos)

Honestly I want to focus a tad bit more on the 400m and let my 800m time get better off my 400, anything above the 800m I have no interest in honestly. But yes I do agree with you NOP I need better endurance for the 800.

These workouts aren't too great. Do lots and lots of plyometrics and dead lifts. Get that 200m time down at least another second. Learn to sit.

I agree A Highschooler but this is only during cross country I'm not actually doing track workouts until November which is when speed work and plyometrics come into play more. We do box jumps right now during cross but that's the only plyos' we do so far.

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At first glance, looks like maybe too many hard days. How long is the hill? How steep is it? How much rest on the 400s? How fast and how much rest on the ladder?

SlowFatMaster: the hills are maybe 90-110m long, the steepness is not too steep but far from flat, when I run my 400s I run every other one with the team so 2-3minute rest (full recovery), the ladders rest is the time we have to make it to the finishline as such:

400- 1:20 rest 1:20-1:30

800- 2:40 rest 2:40-2:45

And so on...

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For a 400-800 guy focusing on the 400, this program might be OK. If you are doing this program and the rest of the team is not, it sounds like the coach is giving you individual attention, which is good.

That said, if you ever want to improve your endurance side, my favorite workout for that is cruise intervals. They got me from barely hanging on by my fingernails at the end of an 800 to actually having something left and passing people in the final straight. For a 400-800 guy like me, I think they are better than long runs or straight tempo runs. I still do long runs (not very long) and tempo runs too.

I use the McMillan definition and McMillan calculator for these. If you don't use the McMillan calculator, just take your 5k time, add a minute. Say your 5k time is 19:00, so add a minute for 20 flat. That is your pace for the cruise intervals. So 20 minutes for 5k is 4 minutes per 1000 or 48 seconds per 200 or 24 seconds per 100.

Get an Ironman watch and set it to beep every 24 seconds. Run 1000 in 4 minutes, jog 100 in 48 seconds, go right into another 1000 in 4 minutes. Start with 3 or 4 of them and work up to 6 or 8. Then progress to 1200s, and eventually 1600s. When you can do 4 or 5 1600s in 6:24 with that same 100 jog in 48 seconds, then go back to 1000s but change the pace to 46 or 47 seconds per 200.

Best of luck!

[quote]SlowFatMaster wrote:

For a 400-800 guy focusing on the 400, this program might be OK. If you are doing this program and the rest of the team is not, it sounds like the coach is giving you individual attention, which is good.

That said, if you ever want to improve your endurance side, my favorite workout for that is cruise intervals. They got me from barely hanging on by my fingernails at the end of an 800 to actually having something left and passing people in the final straight. For a 400-800 guy like me, I think they are better than long runs or straight tempo runs. I still do long runs (not very long) and tempo runs too.

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I agree with this. If you want to focus on the 400, then you still have to fit in at least one purely aerobic session a week for your 800.

And I'd recommend that one session be cruise intervals like these suggested.

As an alternative, work out a 1km course on a good flattish surface (park/trail, not road), and start with 4 of them moving to 5. Short recoveries (60-90 secs). Must be at or below lactic threshold. Tough but not killer. Concentrate on perfect form and rhythm and keeping your breathing relaxed (as much as you can).

I've done these with my kid (13), who is also a 400/800 type, to replace long runs and longer sessions. I think they work great as an aerobic session and if you're doing limited aerobic work for whatever reason, they're more benefit than a long run or a tempo run.

In base if you want two aerobic sessions a week use them combined with a medium run (say 25-40 mins, starting slow and getting to a good rhythm for the last 10-20 mins). In comp season keep the cruise intervals but replace the medium run with an 800 lactic workout or a combined 400/800 workout. And keep up with the sprints.

Work on your speed, strength and flexibility all year.

There - simple.

Thank you both SlowFatMaster and Karma Police, the most help and input I received on this website.

Absolutely you are getting a lot out of those workouts. You're improving you aerobic fitness and endurance. You obviously have an endurance issue, and xc can fix that. It will make you faster in the 400 as you won't be as tired at the end of the race. You could spring it in better than the rest. If you use xc as your fitness ans winter/spring as sprinting, you will see a big drop in all your times. Keep it up, dude.

You need to run faster than 24.0 to break 50 for 400m. Since you ran your 200m race without blocks, I suspect you haven't been doing track very long. If you haven't, most anything you do will keep you improving and you should carry on with what your coach has you doing.

If you have been a long time youth runner and this is your 4th year of HS track, you are NOT a 400-800 runner. You are a miler who refuses to train for the mile. If you don't want to race the mile that is fine but you still need to train like a miler to run your best 400 and especially 800m.