So my coach wants my team, the girls xc team, to run 2 to 3 X 3200 at 5 to 10 faster than (5k) race pace with 4 minutes rest. Would you do this workout?
We run around 18 minutes for a 5k. 5:45 per mile. So 11:30 for 3200.
Should my team really run 11:20-:25 for 3200 X 2 to 3?
That seems impossible. 10 seconds faster than 5k race pace pretty much is 3200 race pace!!
no, they should be more like 12:00.
this workout should be done at 10k pace with about 6 minutes recovery.
3x3200 should be a bit off 10k pace. 2x3200 should be a bit off 5k pace (@8k pace). You will be able to hit the first rep, but the wheels will come off completely on the second. By the third rep, it will just be a joke. If you want to prove a point, do the first rep much slower than everyone else and then you will pass everyone on the second rep going the same pace. Your coach will be embarrassed.
Moroccan in training wrote:
So my coach wants my team, the girls xc team, to run 2 to 3 X 3200 at 5 to 10 faster than (5k) race pace with 4 minutes rest. Would you do this workout?
We run around 18 minutes for a 5k. 5:45 per mile. So 11:30 for 3200.
Should my team really run 11:20-:25 for 3200 X 2 to 3?
That seems impossible. 10 seconds faster than 5k race pace pretty much is 3200 race pace!!
??? Is this a high school CC team? You have a TEAM that averages 18 minutes?
I highly doubt anyone can even do 3x3200m at faster than 5k pace. I just don't understand this. I hear this stuff all the time. I know a coach who wanted her girls to run 6x400m with each 400m faster than they'd ever even run a single 400m flat out, and another coach who wanted his 15:00 5k guys to do workouts with (and at the same paces as) his 13:40 5k guy, and then he got mad at them for falling apart 1/2 way into the workout. These people actually appeared to be of normal intelligence, but some people just can't coach I guess.
I would run only 2 of them. The first slower than 10k pace, the second 10k pace or faster if you feel like. And with only 1 minute rest. So, it's a tempo sort of effort.
No chance
Just run it at your own pace
That is a mammoth session I owuld rather do a tempo without stopping than that
My friend was an assistant coach for a high school cross country team. One workout the coach prescribed was to do a 10k loop at 5k race pace . . . apparently he could not be convinced that this was a bad workout.
I believe my friend eventually was either fired or quit. Another dispute he had with the head coach was at a meet they were hosting, the finish line was put at the end of the finishing chute instead of the beginning. This apparently caused some amount of chaos at the end of the race . . .
3x3200 at slightly faster than 10K pace is a workout I did a few times when I was concentrating on 1/2 marathons and a marathon. Even at a reasonable pace, the workout doesn't seem like a real good one for someone competing at 5K.
asdgfh wrote:
3x3200 at slightly faster than 10K pace is a workout I did a few times when I was concentrating on 1/2 marathons and a marathon. Even at a reasonable pace, the workout doesn't seem like a real good one for someone competing at 5K.
I probably would, but, would more than likely just run them at what I thought I could do. What's the coach gonna do, yell at you? Use Daniels tables and calculate smart paces. Look at something between MP and T. Start at MP and finish at T if you feel strong enough. I used to do 3 x 2 miles at T with 2 rest and those were pretty tough, but, doable, but, I was in my early 30's with plenty of miles behind me.
I'm trying to think if I could have handled this workout. I think in high school I would have been wiped out after the second one and probably run 20 seconds slower than the first two at 5-10 seconds faster than 5k race pace. I'm basing this on 5k cross country race pace, about 30 seconds slower than a track 5k. This would not have been an effective way to train
After college, like asdgfh remarked, I did a similar workout. 3 times 2 miles with a slow half mile jog recovery but these were all at 8 seconds slower than current 5k race pace, not faster. It was one of the toughest workouts I ever did. I was 24 and had three other Olympic Trials qualifiers sharing the pace.
Maybe you should run the workout how the coach asks. If you blow up you blow up and he learns a lesson.
Could be psychological training from your coach. See how long you can last and if you are willing to respond to some brutally tough training, etc. Just do what your coach says.
physco wrote:
Could be psychological training from your coach. See how long you can last and if you are willing to respond to some brutally tough training, etc. Just do what your coach says.
I thought of posting something to this effect earlier but didn't. There are some "just give it all you got" workouts. If these are all too often, question your coach. If there is one every couple of weeks or months...that is not asking too much. Once a week is.
physco wrote:
Just do what your coach says.
Yep, and if your coach tells you to run off a cliff, just do what he says.
I've used a variation of this workout as a lesson in pacing. As other posters have stated, the kids barrel through the first one (faster than pace), try their best to hang on in the second, and die a horrible death the on the final. What's interesting, is many try to kick on the third (not encouraged by the coach) and find out a tad about what they are made of.
If we repeat the workout later in the season, kids have definite and relatively easy times to hit.
Did it. This is a workout we did in college. Our version was 3 x 2 mile on a well packed dirt road in sub 9:00 with 5:00 min rec. My best average for this workout a few years out of college was 8:54. We had one of our more famous alumni that was in the workout group average 8:42. I was able to run sub 28:40 that year and the alumni was able to go under 28:00 even though that was not his primary event.
You are really giving 99% of XC coaches in this country too much credit.
physco wrote:
Could be psychological training from your coach. See how long you can last and if you are willing to respond to some brutally tough training, etc. Just do what your coach says.
New Master wrote:
Did it. This is a workout we did in college. Our version was 3 x 2 mile on a well packed dirt road in sub 9:00 with 5:00 min rec. My best average for this workout a few years out of college was 8:54. We had one of our more famous alumni that was in the workout group average 8:42. I was able to run sub 28:40 that year and the alumni was able to go under 28:00 even though that was not his primary event.
Wow you had a coach that really got after it! Any recollection of how hard that workout was?
I was 28:44 in college and never did any session like that. Maybe 3 times 3200 doing the 30/40 drill going 9:15 to 9:20. That means a group average of 3 times 2 miles in 13:30 5k pace with 5 minute rest for your group! That is brutal.
not a workout but i had a highschool coach who once told me during indoors before i was to compete in the mile to go at my 1000m pace and then "just hold on and keep going at that pace" for the last three laps. needless to say no one improved under him and he wasnt back come spring track