Marathon Training Thread - Week Ending 4/10

NoleRunner, good luck with the job. This may be getting ahead of ourselves, but if you would rather commute into the city and live in the suburbs, I would suggest the Tarrytown area. Main reason being there is a train station there (40 minutes to grand central) and the ultimate runner's paradise that is Rockefeller State Park. It's miles and miles of wooded, packed dirt trails...very hilly too. I run there at least 3 times a week. I feel like I am competing with 4TM now haha. By the way, have you ever been there 4TM? It's not exactly super close to the city. Great for long runs though.

Oh yeah man. I went to Columbia undergrad and we would go there frequently. I now live in larchmont in Westchester, and make a trip every now and then. My town actually has lots of trails as well. The colonial greenway is a pretty nice trail system.

Gurnee - Very interesting...2 red bulls even before the start of the race? I'm a coffee drinker, but even I'll cut that out at least 2.5 hours before the start to...uhhh....evacuate everything. How close to the start do you have that 2nd red bull? Does the carboniation not bother you? I don't have that many carbonated drinks (save for beer), so when I do, I'm usually burping quite a bit. To each his own though, I've seen guys destroy some quater pounders before track meets without any ill effects.

NoleRunner - Wow, a potential job in NYC! When will you know something? I'm coming up to Jax to do the Run for the Pies in June...even though I'll probably a lot slower than I am right now.

4TM - It's certainly not your ideal taper, but, rest assured...you didn't lose any fitness. With Boston still being ~6 days away, that's still a lot of time to work whatever you caught out of your system.

Nole -

Thanks, I took a little over 3 mins jog/walk rest on the 2x3mi and then 200m jog which ended up being 67-73 seconds.

That's the fastest I've done the 400 workout, but in college we would do it on grass instead of the track (although we would not jog for the rest, it was mostly standing/walking).

Pablo – Yes the lackluster training only tipped me to scratch -- it was primarily an unfortunate accumulation of other things, including this bad cold. If I lived in the area I’d surely just run anyway, but it’s clear across the country and missing work for two days is part of the problem. It’s probably for the best. I’ll just look forward to another race and the possibility of getting back down closer to 2:40 with more quality work. My best is 2:30 – but that was over ten years ago now and I haven’t run 2:39 since 2007. Thanks to 4TM for suggesting Grandma’s. I’m so accustomed to seeing major races fill up far in advance that I didn’t even think of it. I just checked though and it’s still open! Has anyone here run it? Any drawbacks? I might sign up this week. Good luck to everyone who is running. I'm eager to see the posts on Monday night.

[bpablob] - It was a very long day. Because he's blind the crowd were saying how well he was doing so it made for an embarrassing day for him also.

[bnoleb] - I haven't had any races so it has really just been base. 12 weeks from marathon now so will recover from Sundays long run and the move into specific work. Will see how much the milage suffers then. Cheers.

try again

stamford - Thanks man, I really appreciate the suggestion. I should hear something back very soon. Do you know anyone in need of a room mate? You know me by now... I run a lot, but it's not my life. 26 years old. I put my email up incase you want to contact me there. Thanks again dude.

pablo - Hoping to hear back by this Friday. You guys will be informed. Run for the Pies is legit man, love that race. Altho, I never run my best there bc of the heat and everyone goes out too hard. You ever run it before?

Running4IAM wrote:

I know a lot of you guys are pretty focused on your upcoming races, so when the chaos settles, would someone mind directing me a little as to where i should go from here. I want to start a true training cycle, and not spin my wheels with poor training. As always thanx, and Good Luck to you guys.

Hmm, well that all depends on what you're training for, when said race will be, etc.

Regarding your hamstring/beat up legs issue...it just sounds like you need some more down time. It's only been, what, 3 weeks since your marathon. Give it some time, give your legs some rest. What I've found with hamstring issues is that if you're hammys and/or calves are tight, it will always stem down to your feet and pretty soon you'll have a full blown injury on your hands. The last thing you want to do is start a new training cycle already feeling tired/run-down or hurt...so get healthy first!

NoleRunner - No, I've never done the Pies race before. I'll probably take a little down time after my race tomorrow and then start putting in base mileage for Chicago starting in May. So I'll probably be in good shape when the race rolls around, but I won't have any workouts underneath me. Hoping to finish in the $$$ positions though (top 3 I think).

pablo wrote:

Gurnee - Very interesting...2 red bulls even before the start of the race? I'm a coffee drinker, but even I'll cut that out at least 2.5 hours before the start to...uhhh....evacuate everything. How close to the start do you have that 2nd red bull? Does the carboniation not bother you? I don't have that many carbonated drinks (save for beer), so when I do, I'm usually burping quite a bit. To each his own though, I've seen guys destroy some quater pounders before track meets without any ill effects.

pablo: I experimented quite a bit with what would sit well with me in a race. Caffeine always worked well for me, but coffee made me have to pee. Somewhere along the way I had a free red bull in the fridge and tried it out before a local 8K during the off-season and had a huge race. After reading that Brian Sell drinks it mixed with Gatorade for his races, I decided to experiment further. It sat really well, "stayed" with me longer than coffee (not as high of a high, and not nearly as low of a low), and was easily accessible when I travel (every gas station in america sells it.) I would HIGHLY recommend experimenting first if anyone decides to try it. And it's an acquired taste. To me, it tastes like "victory." :)

Ok, who here is crazy enough to try the Aussie carbo loading method the day before a marathon without prior tinkering? I think i may be crazy enough to try it. I took today off and am itching to try it tomorrow. Meanwhile i have gained around 3 pounds. Good luck to all those enduring mid-taper madness.

CTA wrote:

Ok, who here is crazy enough to try the Aussie carbo loading method the day before a marathon without prior tinkering? I think i may be crazy enough to try it. I took today off and am itching to try it tomorrow. Meanwhile i have gained around 3 pounds. Good luck to all those enduring mid-taper madness.

It's crazy but also stupid. The marathon is about letting out what you built up for many months. Why jeopardize something that has taken so much time to build?

Question about fueling and taper:

So I think i want to do a more or less normal taper for my upcoming marathon.

However, my concern is from past experiences with long runs and long workouts, I have found that if I did something short the day before or the in the days leading up to it, it seems like I don't fuel correctly. That is I haven't eaten enough or it just doesn't seemed to be in my legs in the same way as it would be if I had done a 13 mile run the day before and I filled up on food afterwards.

I don't know exactly how to describe this. Let me try again: I feel like the way my body stores food I eat changes based on the type run I do. For instance, say I have a 16 mile run with 10 miles at MP planned. If the day before I run two even doubles of say 6 and 6, the next day I feel like my legs have stored energy in a different way than it should for the 16 mile run. It's like they are ready to put out for a shorter distance.

However, if I were to do a 10 mile single run the day before the energy stored in my legs would feel like it would kick in much later in the run and stick with me. It's hard to describe.

In more simpler terms, I have been running between 80 and 90 miles per week for the last couple months. If i want to do a serious taper and I am only running 5 or 6 miles in the 3 days leading up to the marathon, how do I eat enough to get the energy stored for the race? Finally if i feel like I fuel better if I do 10 or 11 miles on the wednesday before a saturday marathon, is that a good idea, or is that just unnecessary running before the race?

I am just not as hungry when I run 5 miles. Is this where people just force themselves to eat more than they want?

Like Blznbison said, I have a lot of months of training riding on this debut marathon and i dont want to tank it because of something like fueling.

CTA - A little late to answering your question, but I've known guys to try the Aussie carb load thing the day before without prior tinkering. They felt no ill effects because of it...but that doesn't mean it's for everyone. If you want to try it, I'd say go for it. The marathon in general is one huge experiment...so you've gotta find what works, and more importantly, what doesn't work for you. The thing I'd be most worried about is the all out sprinting at the end of the run. Sometimes you can tweak a muscle running all-out, especially if you haven't done so in a while. So be careful. The carb loading is the fun part, if you have no problems (read: GI issues) loading carbs, then I wouldn't imagine the Aussie carb load would give you any problems.

That's quite an interesting problem. Running 10 or 11 miles the Wednesday before a Saturday marathon isn't recommended, but not unheard of. If you keep it super easy, you probably won't have any problems...but why bother? I mean, there's nothing you can do (running wise) that will help your marathon in the final week...you can only f**k it up. For higher mileage guys, the taper is usually difficult, because we're so used to having the pedal to the floor all the time...when you back off, you don't know what to do with yourself. It's a necessary evil...maybe not to the extent that same people take it, but the taper does help.

As far as you not feeling as hungry after a 5 mile run rather than a 10 mile run....well, yeah...you burned more calories during the 10 miler, thus you need to replenish more. Don't force yourself to eat anything, if you're not hungry, don't eat. Carbohydrate heavy foods are pretty filling to begin with, so if you're eating lots of carbs in the days leading up to the race...you shouldn't feel all that hungry all the time. I wouldn't worry about weight gain either, I always put on around 2-3 lbs during the taper...most of it is water weight because the carbs seem to help retain it better than my regular diet.

I don't really know if that helped you at all...but I couldn't really understand what you're trying to say.

Damn. Forget to wish VF Runner good luck tomorrow in Gansett! Don't know if you'll see this before you run...but go get 'em!

Yeah, that helps pretty much.

I definitely agree that I would not be trying to get anything out of a 10 mile run on the wednesday before. There is just something about running an hour or so that gets my legs to the point of feeling ready for a long haul the next day. I think i have experimented and about 55 minutes works well too. So ill try to keep it to the minimum and jog 55 minutes that wednesday.

It's just all seems like a risk. I can predict how I would feel if i went about somewhat normal training, albeit easier, in the week leading up, but then there is that possibility of really feeling better than ever if i do a drastic taper. i might take the risk this time and chalk it up to a learning experience debut marathon.

Anyone see latest NOAA forecast for Boston. Wow. 22 mph WSW winds with gusts to near 40. If this forecast holds do we need to pus asterixs for our times. Good luck tomorrow VF.

Another wrote:

If this forecast holds do we need to pus asterixs for our times.

Yes. Yes you will.

[/jealous I'm not running Boston]