What can bekele run an open 400m in prime shape fresh?

400m wrote:

What can bekele run an open 400m in prime shape fresh? also what could EL G and Lagat have run in there primes? would they beat bekele?

To answer the last question, yes. I would put them at mid-high 47, Bekele at high 48.

kartelite wrote:

400m wrote:

What can bekele run an open 400m in prime shape fresh? also what could EL G and Lagat have run in there primes? would they beat bekele?

To answer the last question, yes. I would put them at mid-high 47, Bekele at high 48.

haha? mid-high 47? I hope thats a joke.

El G could probably go 46 low-mid.

Lagat 46 high.

Bekele 48 low.

No way wrote:

El G could probably go 46 low-mid.

Lagat 46 high.

Bekele 48 low.

My God, someone stupid enough to believe a man who had to run the kick out of kickers from 6-800 meters out was faster over 400 meters than Seb Coe. Moron.

Alan Webb gets out kicked also and he ran :47.X in high school, so it is possible that El G and lagat were faster.

gee that makes sense wrote:

No way wrote:

El G could probably go 46 low-mid.

Lagat 46 high.

Bekele 48 low.

My God, someone stupid enough to believe a man who had to run the kick out of kickers from 6-800 meters out was faster over 400 meters than Seb Coe. Moron.

exactly my point.... If Alan Webb could run 47. in HIGH SCHOOL then Bekele can prob run at least a 47 flat now and EL G could have ran a 45 low, easy. lagat somewhere in between the two (maybe 46 point). keep in mind, lagat has run 51 at the end of a 5k and bekele ran 52 the last lap of a 10k...the OLYMPIC 10K AT THAT.... These runners fresh out the blocks can all run under 48 for sure. Think about you PR in the mile, for all of you 4:20 milers out there, thats a 65 second quarter average... now imagine running one... of course you can run at least 8 seconds faster. EL G runs 55s in his 2000m world record!

Yes they would beat Bekele. I doubt Bekele can run faster than 48 high, maybe even 49. Obviously he isn't slow, but it's his incredible ENDURANCE which makes him the best 10k runner on the planet. El G could run 46 high or 47 low. Lagat 47. Seb split a 45, and I'm sure he could've run close to that in an open 400 if fresh/peaked.

running a 4.20 is alot different to running a 3.50 or sub mile, you have to recognise how fit and effiecent these runners are. EL G was never the best kicker, others were faster, but how did he win most races? of a fast or slow pace? these guys are so fit that than can close in close to 400m PR or a slowish pace. 45.XX no way 46.XX no way 47 high maybe.

Another point what did the ethiopian 400m guys do? Bekele wouldn't be mixing it with them

Bekele has been reported running 47.6 in the 400m. His endurance is great but you don't churn out a 51.0 last 400m in a 3000m or 5000m fast race if your only a 48 HIGH or 49 open 400m runner.

i have a feeling people are severely overestimating the thopy's open 400 speed :

look down here a few posts :

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2470009

- kennster ~ 51.7

- geb ~ 50.7

if your not happy, i used same calculator for others which gave :

- coe ~ 46.0

- cram ~ 46.5

- ovett ~ 47.2

- hicham ~ 47.7

- webb ~ 47.8

few things about the 'thopys : they have gone 52+ in extremely slow races ( for them ) - you need to add ~1s to that to convert to an open 400, so fastest they've gone is = ~ 53+ open 400 on last lap ( still 2 or 3s outside a predicted completely rested open 400 )

because of their superb endurance they can bring nearly all their open 400 to last lap of a slow race

Vipam wrote:

Bekele has been reported running 47.6 in the 400m

where ???

for the thopys, assuming they coud go 26'10 in their prime ( ultimate flat-out perfect race ), then

26'10 with

52.0 ->~

1'48.7 , 3'31.7 , 4'47.0 , 7'20.7 , 12'36.0

51.0 ->~

1'47.1 , 3'29.5 , 4'44.5 , 7'17.9 , 12'33.3

50.0 ->~

1'45.6 , 3'27.3 , 4'42.0 , 7'15.1 , 12'30.6

49.0 ->~

1'44.0 , 3'25.0 , 4'39.5 , 7'12.3 , 12'27.9

48.0 ->~

1'42.4 , 3'22.8 , 4'37.0 , 7'09.5 , 12'25.2

47.0 ->~

1'40.8 , 3'20.6 , 4'34.5 , 7'06.7 , 12'22.5

46.0 ->~

1'39.3 , 3'18.4 , 4'32.0 , 7'03.9 , 12'19.8

i'm having a hard time believing anything better than 50s...

I also predict that if Wariner moves up to 800 meters he will run 1:38.63.

imposter, i didn't give any of those above times to 0.01s, so i woudn't have for jw

jw needs to run a 600m tt to get any idea :

assuming he coud still go 43.5 when he attempts 600m ( likely impossible to keep that speed though )

43.5 with

1'15 ->1'49.3

1'14 ->1'47.0

1'13 ->1'44.7

1'12 ->1'42.4

1'11 ->1'40.2

1'10 ->1'37.9

he needs to basically break the 600mwr just to get into hypothetical 1'44 territory

ventolin wrote:

- kennster ~ 51.7

- geb ~ 50.7

- coe ~ 46.0

- cram ~ 46.5

- ovett ~ 47.2

- hicham ~ 47.7

- webb ~ 47.8

Those look pretty good, although Geb ran 49.9 (open, not relay) at a club type meet in addis according to Jos Hermans. And I don't see Bekele losing by a full second to Geb over 400m, even if both raced it in their prime.

tissue box wrote:

kartelite wrote:

To answer the last question, yes. I would put them at mid-high 47, Bekele at high 48.

haha? mid-high 47? I hope thats a joke.

How? Which way?

fUrCeOsNhN wrote:Those look pretty good, although Geb ran 49.9 (open, not relay) at a club type meet in addis according to Jos Hermans. And I don't see Bekele losing by a full second to Geb over 400m, even if both raced it in their prime.

49.9

hmmm...

few factors :

- likely ht : add 0.2 for auto & we are 50.10

- addis few 1000 feet altitude, so maybe add 0.5s for sea-level equivalent : that gets 50.10 to about 50.60

- which year he ran it : he woud likely have had more 400 speed in early/mid '90s ( he went 12'44 / 26'43 in '95 ) than late '90s when he'd likely piled on even more endurance & lost some speed ( 12'39 / 26'22 in '98 ) - i can't access that predictor from this terminal - i'll try later when i get home to see what 12'44 / 26'43 gives for 400 )

as for kennster being 1s slower over 400 - may depend on what above shows, but he's been outkicked by likes of chebbi, songok, big & lil choge & k2 so i certainly don't believe his 400 is as good as geb's was ( i don't see all those guys capable of having outkicked geb - especially not over 1500 )

ok, got home :

in '95 off 12'44 / 26'43 ->~

50.2 , 1'46.4 , 3'29.7 , 4'45.8 , 7'21.9

now, obviously neither his 5k/10k times were ideally run/paced, so for argument's sake call them ideally run ( 1st stab ) as

12'42 / 26'40 ->~

49.9 , 1'45.9 , 3'28.8 (?!) , 4'44.8 ' 7'20.4

ooooh, that 1500 looks to quick , i think that we'll have to knock a bit more off the 10k to slow that 1500 ( & also as we have had a lot more ``26'40 guys than <12'45 ones )

12'42 /26'35 -%% ~

50.7 , 1'46.9 , 3'30.1 , 4'46.1 , 7'21.5

i'm not sure, now 1500 looks tad slow , i'll settle for

12'42 / 26'37.5 ->~

50.3 , 1'46.4 , 3'29.5 , 4'45.4 , 7'21.0

that's my pick ( for now ! )

I think this question has been asked about 1000 times on this forum, and every time people think that Bekele could run 47 seconds because of the way he finishes his 5k-10k. That's just not the way it works. As one of the other posters notes, these guys are absurdly efficient and are aerobic beasts, so when they need to drop the hammer, they can get pretty damn close to their top speed. I'd be surprised if he could go under 49.