If Webb went to college in Kenya and attained Kenyan citizenship, would he be "just as Kenyan" as Kiprop?

I posted several months ago on a thread similar to this topic and I will state it again.....

I would rather have Bernard Lagat as a fellow American than Sade Williams (the girl who was arrested for the hate crime in Long Beach last year).

At least Lagat is educated, communicates in standard english, and probably knows more about the history of this country than Ms. Williams.

I am very proud to say Bernard Lagat is a fellow American.

- Philip Passen

what i don't understand, essentially, is the purpose of these discussions. this basically comes down to what shirt a guy has on his back. it's arbitrary.

naked olympics- who would you root for?

according to some posters logic on these threads, the answer is for athletes with similiar genitals to them...

commie wrote:

naked olympics- who would you root for?

Hypothetical Hal wrote:

So let's say Webb went to Kenya for schooling, takes in some altitude, what have you. You know, basically spent more than half his life there, and up and attained Kenyan citizenship. Enter Kip Keino: "We like your style, li'l cat. Come. Join us. *arms outstretched*" Would he be "accepted" as "just as Kenyan" as any other "real" Kenyans? Discuss.

Someone needs a history lesson about how America started. We are a nation of immigrants. Always were. Kenya not so much. The analogy doesn't work.

That said. Of course not. While I think the Kenyans are by and large a very welcoming people so they'd probably be fine with Webb joining ranks, they would probably not stake their national pride on his success, just the way we have not (yet) with Lagat or never did with Meb.

The pale skin, big head, and short legs probably don't help either.

Just like someone else needs a recent history lesson. Qatar, Bahrain, anyone? Do all inconvenient analogies not work, or just this one, in your world?

good god.

I am Kenyan. Though I might be biased, I think Kenya is a very welcoming and open society by any measre, and Kenyans pride themselves at that. Webb would definitely be "Just as Kenyan" as any other KEnyan. You should see how happy Kenyans were when Dunforth brough home medals from the African championsips.

Lagat= Kenyan

Chicano wrote:

Your scenario would never happen, as Keino would not waste his time with someone who could never make a Kenyan Team.

Seriously they have so much depth that Kenyan teens are kicking Webb's ass.

Well, let's assume for a second that Webb could run, oh I dunno, 3:46 for the mile, and let's say 1:43ish in the 8 -- just for good measure. While we're at it, throw in solid performances on up through 10K. Then, let's say that he flat-out gets lucky and DOES go on to make a Kenyan team. Is he viewed as being just as Kenyan? For such a simple question, simple answers certainly aren't forthcoming. BTW, it doesn't have to be Webb; could be anyone in a similar situation.

jff wrote:

This is retarded! America is a melting pot -- Kenya is not!!

This poster might be onto something. They aren't so much a country of immigrants after all.

The Kenyan flag is based on that of Kenya African National Union. The colours symbolize black majority, red for the blood shed during the struggle for freedom, and green for natural wealth; the white fimbriation was added later and symbolizes peace. The black, red, and white traditional Maasai shield and two spears symbolize the defense of all the things mentioned above.

Maybe if Alan stayed in the minority without Teg and a few others showing up he'd be okay.

But Brits and other people didn't populate Kenya. Kenyans are from a specific region and are part of certain tribes. They're tribal loyalty is very strong and goes back 10's of thousands of years.

The US, on the other hand, is populated by immigrants- from the very first Americans who came over Beringia, the land bridge, to people like Lagat, who came recently.

He is a citizen and is an American as much as anyone in this country.

My grandparents were Italian immigrants, does that make me less American? Is Lagat's son more American than he is?

Lagat's son will be more American than himself. He will have grown up here. If you were dropped in China and received citizenship would you be as Chinese as the people born there? Would you be as familiar with the culture? The history? Would you have any roots there? Or bammo would you be just as Chinese because a piece of paper said so?

Real life examples:

I am white and was born and grew up in Kenya. Does that make me Kenyan or not?

I grew up in Kenya moved to American, have now spent the best part of my life in America, am I American?

I am black, my parents/gransparents were forced to come to America and I was born here. Am I American?

I grew up in South Africa, moved to America and have my home in America, but my grandparents were Irish? Am I Irish, South African or American?

I speak with an American accent, been here since I was seven years old but live in America. I was developed by an American coach and owe my success to the American system, but I am still Russian.

I am originally Kenyan but another country offered me a chance to pursue my dreams by supporting me financially, but on condition that I change my name and nationality.

I am american but I coach non American athletes who take medals away from American athletes does that make me any less American?

I grew up in America but have British grandparents, I went to college in America, was a decent 400m runner but well outside the American top 10. I was offered the chance to run in Olympics for England even though I had never been there before, does that now make me English?

Thats just the ones I can think of.

Welcome to the global world where nationality comes down to a combination of where you were born, where you live, who supported you, what benefits you and what cultural traditions you follow.

The irony of this whole thread is that Americans are supposed to be the champions of "Freedom" but are the same ones passing judgement on someone who is exercising his freedom by changing nationalities.

The bigger irony is that these people want to be American and I have seen comparitevely less criticism of Americans running for other countries or NCAA athletes who do not convert to American citizens even though their success is down to the American system.

It's where your born that counts!

Examples of how to avoid answering the question.

Alan Webb would get pretty much the same reception we give Lagat. Some would be OK, some not, some would not care. Some people attribute this to racism. I think that it may be a little bit of racism but mostly nationalism. America is not the most racist place in the world like some try to make it out to be. It could however be the most Descriminitory. Why? because of having the most deverse country in the world it also gives the most oppritunity for discrimination. There you have it folks.

Qatar and the other country bought their athletes. Lagat became a naturalized American after living here for 8 or 9 years. Does someone need to be hit over the head to see the difference?

orbitboy wrote:

Why do people care about this issue? Is xenophobia THAT rampant?

rhetorical

torrs wrote:

orbitboy wrote:

Why do people care about this issue? Is xenophobia THAT rampant?

rhetorical

Rhetorical how? If anything, that question shoud read "Is xenophobia THAT rampant IN THE WORLD?"