I think a key with her training, that is being overlooked, is that she possibly might be able to physically build aerobic fitness faster (which is a multi-year process) over that of just running more. The typical collegiate female can run maybe 20-30 miles per week of intense running at most, before breaking down. Valby’s running is all quality, so she is probably putting in that amount of intense running, and then getting additional fitness gains with some intense cross-training on top of that.
It’s all the better if the fitness-building cross-training has specific benefits to improving running economy, and this is where Valby’s selection of the Arc Trainer, over the elliptical or Anti-gravity treadmill comes in, for it builds leg muscles conducive to running.
The replacement of running with cross training is very interesting. Curious to see how many athletes who run normal, high mileage would adapt to cross training in addition to running. For example, if an athlete runs 70 miles a week, primarily on singles how would adding a “double” on the elliptical a few times a week progress their fitness? Of course, even with the low impact it could still lead to overtraining on the metabolic level. Interesting discussion!
Your reply that Valby would be just as good if she instead mostly just ran is indicative of the short-sighted old-school dogmatic training philosophies that have hounded this board for years
One person’s success, doesn’t prove that running to train for running, is shortsighted, old-school and dogmatic.
But the shortsightedness, old-school, and dogmatic is when saying “just run more” will always be as good as any modifications to that approach.
The replacement of running with cross training is very interesting. Curious to see how many athletes who run normal, high mileage would adapt to cross training in addition to running. For example, if an athlete runs 70 miles a week, primarily on singles how would adding a “double” on the elliptical a few times a week progress their fitness? Of course, even with the low impact it could still lead to overtraining on the metabolic level. Interesting discussion!
I don’t think there is a cookbook formula, and maybe somewhat specific to the runner. At this stage, it definitely would take more work to figure out than “just run” 80/20. The benefits would increase as the athletes become more in-tune with their body response to the different training modalities, something standard for triathletes.
One person’s success, doesn’t prove that running to train for running, is shortsighted, old-school and dogmatic.
But the shortsightedness, old-school, and dogmatic is when saying “just run more” will always be as good as any modifications to that approach.
Who is saying “just run more”? Current elite runners seem to be running less mileage than those of previous generations.
I looked up the training of Cranny and Monson, and they do no aerobic cross-training. It’s going to take more than the results for one runner to believe a significant amount of training on a arc trainer is going to improve performance.
A) not all of these runners are using cross-training methods (shoes, competition, other variables could explain)
B) not all of these runners are using the same cross-training methods
C) cross training is not a ‘valby’ effect, as everyone else has stated, it has existed for a LONG. TIME. She isn’t the first runner to shed a light on it, either.
Are you intentionally trying to stir people up against valby? Because that’s all this ‘effect’ chart is doing, by giving credit to one runner uninvolved with this.
It’s going to take more than the results for one runner to believe a significant amount of training on an arc trainer is going to improve performance.
Valby and Leachman makes two.
Leachman also suffered a long string of injuries before switching to mostly cross training. There’s no parallel universe to compare their approach to where they would be if they were sturdy enough to run everyday. For sure, running outdoors would be fare more enjoyable than suffering on an arc trainer.
Cross training is not new. Allowing healthy runners to race while running 3 hours a week or less, we will see. Are there enough gym aerobic machines at every school? It's still sub-optimal. Training in this manner, an athlete is missing some training aspects of training. Come Olympic Trials, you will see.
I already stated cross-training is not ‘new’, but what is different is that Parker Valby has shown an extremely bright light on it over the past couple of years. Cross-training was one of Katelyn Tuohy’s high school ‘training secrets’, but she was also injured in high school, so besides the lack of broad awareness and visibility back then, it would have still been primarily associated with just injury rehab.
Independent of the OlyTrials results, we definitely can see a big improvement in yr-over-yr times, which I don’t think is primarily shoe related. Even for the collegiate women not yet incorporating serious cross-training into their regime, there nonetheless may be some psychological fallout from Valby’s training success; I.e., ‘a rising tide lifts many boats.” “That girl is successful running only 3-days a week? I have to pick it up, to not look so bad.” , etc.
Do you agree in order for Parker Valby to race sub-14:20, 5000m she will have to run at least 5 hours a week? I stated you will notice a flaw at U.S. Trials. This type of training isn't ideal for speed development. Through 4500m of 5000m race she may be in lead pack, U S Trials.
A) not all of these runners are using cross-training methods (shoes, competition, other variables could explain)
B) not all of these runners are using the same cross-training methods
C) cross training is not a ‘valby’ effect, as everyone else has stated, it has existed for a LONG. TIME. She isn’t the first runner to shed a light on it, either.
Are you intentionally trying to stir people up against valby? Because that’s all this ‘effect’ chart is doing, by giving credit to one runner uninvolved with this.
I’m not sure how serious it is. But do you think the latest year-over-year improvements is primarily due to the shoes?
I think Valby possibly has a contribution of upping-the-game in the female collegiate ranks indirectly, psychologically, rather than by influencing their training, directly, for the time being.
But to all of you that keep saying cross-training is not new, you have to have blinders on to not admit that her experience with it the last couple of years has significantly changed the optics on it in the running community.
I already stated cross-training is not ‘new’, but what is different is that Parker Valby has shown an extremely bright light on it over the past couple of years. Cross-training was one of Katelyn Tuohy’s high school ‘training secrets’, but she was also injured in high school, so besides the lack of broad awareness and visibility back then, it would have still been primarily associated with just injury rehab.
Independent of the OlyTrials results, we definitely can see a big improvement in yr-over-yr times, which I don’t think is primarily shoe related. Even for the collegiate women not yet incorporating serious cross-training into their regime, there nonetheless may be some psychological fallout from Valby’s training success; I.e., ‘a rising tide lifts many boats.” “That girl is successful running only 3-days a week? I have to pick it up, to not look so bad.” , etc.
Do you agree in order for Parker Valby to race sub-14:20, 5000m she will have to run at least 5 hours a week? I stated you will notice a flaw at U.S. Trials. This type of training isn't ideal for speed development. Through 4500m of 5000m race she may be in lead pack, U S Trials.
Parker Valby is the youngest female American to break 15min. She is the fastest USA collegiate female over that distance. She just ran arguably the greatest cross-country season in NCAA history.
Valby’s only been at this new way of training for two years, yet you want to try an invalidate if she gets beat at the Olympic Trials by Professional Athletes with years of experience?!? You can’t see how obtuse that is?
She didn’t invent it but made it cool for the rest of us.
Cross training was popularized by 2 mega trends:
With the workforce becoming more inactive due to office work, the workforce needed “quick” and easy ways to exercise. In cane the exercise eqt industry.
To combat health issues like diabetes, obesity, cardiovascular issues, the govt turned to the cross training industry to help. And of course the medical industry.
Indirectly, the industry was designed not for us but we benefited. Go ask Parker.
Swimming and biking/elliptical/arctrainer is the best. But depends for example, NAU/CU/BYU and other hi-alt locations can cross country ski. I personally cross train by speed skating at a local lake on Tues/fri.
Consider top triathletes and their ability to become top runners.
Triathletes are the ultimate cross trainers. Some have achieved very good running results as part of their triathlons. Some believe that if they focused more on running and less on biking and swimming, they could also become top runners.
Top triathletes that have tried to become top runners generally have not succeeded. Yes they improved their running times, but they did not achieve success in running like they did in triathlon.
Think Gwen Jorgenson, Dave Scott, Mark Allen and others.
Maybe all the cross training allowed them to build big aerobic engines without injury that allowed them to be better runners than they otherwise would have been if they only ran.
Maybe the cross training limited or inhibited specific refined adaptations as runners (technique, efficiency, muscle elasticity, or ?) that were needed to become top runners.
Maybe top level running is much more competitive than top level triathlon training, and/or requires certain attributes are best refined and enhanced through running alone.
So while Valby and some top triathletes have achieved good success via cross training, I can not think of any elite record setting or medal winning runner at the global level that has succeeded primarily by cross training.
Maybe Valby will prove me wrong, and I hope she can.
But if you want to maximize your ability in running, you need to run.
Swimming and biking/elliptical/arctrainer is the best. But depends for example, NAU/CU/BYU and other hi-alt locations can cross country ski. I personally cross train by speed skating at a local lake on Tues/fri.
Surprised no one called me out on the above stmt. there’s MANY purposes for cross training. The above stmt is for injury prevention only. Apologies for the inaccurate stat :(