This would never have been an issue if, say, Tobi Amusan had false started.
Who cares, why are you so miserable on every single thread? If Allen was Kenyan, you would have posted 100 threads on this subject. Its irrelevant why someone cares, at least there is someone still asking questions to get answers for all 4 athletes DQd and any future potential false starters.
I genuinely appreciate the creative questions you asked yourself and then answered. No, it doesn't change the DQ but just because it can't change the past doesn't mean we don't deserve to know the truth or have answers. And, if this affected you, your world record attempt, your dreams, then you'd appreciate someone combing through the data to find evidence that supports you being wrongfully DQ'd. Above that, this site is about making things as transparent as possible throughout the running community. I hope this wrongful DQ is acknowledged. Whether that happens or not, I hope the facts put pressure where it needs to be so policies can be updated/ this can be avoided in the future.
Yes. It just looks undeniable that there was something wrong with the reaction timing at Worlds. The longer the folks at World Athletics try to stonewall, the harder it will be on them as evidence rolls in.
I'm thinking they are petrified to reveal a problem, for fear that it would invalidate the results, make track look bad, ruin their individual reputations, and get them sued.
The scarier question is, did the problem in reaction timing also appear in the actual event times? That's why the Amusan situation is troubling.
The fundamental error was not letting Allen run in the final anyway--at the discretion of the starter.
This has been happening for years and suddenly you folks are upset about it? You cannot make this up.
Did you just crawl out from under a rock? This has not been happening for years, the reaction times are majorly off at 2022 Worlds.
The poster wrote that people were being punished for having faster reaction times. It has been happening for years. The only reason this site cares is because Allen is an American.
Having had a week to recover from Worlds, over the weekend, I did so me more research into the reaction times. The whole idea that somehow the sprinters were reacting quicker to an 'American' starter seems like a bogus idea to begin with (Devon told his agent Paul Doyle the starter had a thick accent and the same starter wasn't used for all sprint events in Eugene yet all sprint events showed faster times), but nonetheless I wanted to rule it out.
So what I did was compare the reaction times of the 21 US sprinters at Worlds to their reaction times at USAs. Guess what? All 21 of them reacted faster at Worlds than USAs, with 16 of the 21 reacting faster than 0.15 at Worleds whereas ony 1 did that at USAs. Lastly, the slowest reaction time in the World final was equal to the fastest reaction time at USAs.A
Moving forward, I'd like to make this the Official Devon Allen False Start / Worlds Reaction Time Discussion Thread. There were so many threads on the topic at Worlds, it's best to have one single thread so we know what to focus on.
The other threads are still up but have been closed to new posts. I thought about merging them all into 1 thread here but think it's best to start anew.
Is there any other comparisons people would like to see be done? What could possibly explain the quicker reaction times at 2022 Worlds than mis-calibration?
Even if the equipment is now more accurate, should they not then be adjusting the false start time down from 0.1 to 0.085 or something?
I said it before and I'll say it again.
The 0.100 is a semi-arbitrary number based on research. But who is to say, even scientifically, that 0.100 is legal but 0.099 is clearly not?
My solution is for reactions between 0.090 and 0.100, have a yellow card. Or even 0.095 and 0.100. You watch them in slo mo, it is so marginal and I don't think they have anticipated (which is the point of the false start rule).
Did you just crawl out from under a rock? This has not been happening for years, the reaction times are majorly off at 2022 Worlds.
The poster wrote that people were being punished for having faster reaction times. It has been happening for years. The only reason this site cares is because Allen is an American.
Maybe, but it is a legitimate discussion to have. It happened to others at worlds.
Devon got a bad deal. Any system of measurement, timing or otherwise, will have a +/- and his reaction time would have fallen within that range at 1/000th of a second. The field should have been given a green card and the race re-started. It's hard though to walk back from what the officials decided to go with which is the strictest rule interpretation. It's done and that's what they went with. A DQ. A related issue though with the timing though is that women's 100m semi with the WR and all the NRs and PBs. What's up with that? The timing system has issues at the Worlds,
It was obvious that the delay from set to the gun was much shorter with less variance than usual. That's the reason the reaction times were "quicker". It had nothing to do with the equipment.
This would never have been an issue if, say, Tobi Amusan had false started.
It would have been a HUGE issue. If after setting the WR in the heats, she false started in the final, you don't think that would have been huge?
This is their way of calling you racist and/or xenophobic. These types of posts should result in PERMANENT IP ADDRESS BANS. It's unfounded and extremely divisive and honestly ruins very important threads.
*repost from previous thread since this has been christened the official thread*
Between 1999 to 2019 only 13 men recorded RTs between .100-.119 in the Mens 100 heats (not quarters, semis or finals, just heats). In 2022, 16 men had RTs between .100-.119! 🙄
WCs Year Location: competitors between .100-.119 / total competitors (.1-.119 RTs listed)
*repost from previous thread since this has been christened the official thread*
Between 1999 to 2019 only 13 men recorded RTs between .100-.119 in the Mens 100 heats (not quarters, semis or finals, just heats). In 2022, 16 men had RTs between .100-.119! 🙄
WCs Year Location: competitors between .100-.119 / total competitors (.1-.119 RTs listed)
No RT data on World Athletics site for 1997 or earlier editions of WCs
If the athletes/agents choose to proceed with a lawsuit, good chance they're gonna win.
In case it's not obvious, that's 16 of 56 (28.6%) RTs in the 100 heats between .100-.119 at Eugene and only 13 of 695 (1.9%) RTs in that range during the previous 11 WCs.
As damning as that is, looking at the actual false-start RTs might be even worse. Eugene was an extraordinary outlier in that department as well.
Personally hoping that Alfred, Allen, Gaither and Tabakaucoro are all compensated. I wonder if the four of them all realize just how ridiculous this data looks. Has anybody heard anything from the non-american athletes that were effected?
It would have been a HUGE issue. If after setting the WR in the heats, she false started in the final, you don't think that would have been huge?
This is their way of calling you racist and/or xenophobic. These types of posts should result in PERMANENT IP ADDRESS BANS. It's unfounded and extremely divisive and honestly ruins very important threads.
You are NOT very intelligent so you fit in here nicely. Just because one points out that Rojo is more concerned about Americans does not mean one is accusing him of anything other than that. Not sure if you have ever seen Devon Allen. He is biracial and Rojo is going to bat for him BECAUSE he is an American, not because of his skin color. No racism allegations from anyone intelligent here so maybe think before you kiss up to Rojo with your stupidity.
*repost from previous thread since this has been christened the official thread*
Between 1999 to 2019 only 13 men recorded RTs between .100-.119 in the Mens 100 heats (not quarters, semis or finals, just heats). In 2022, 16 men had RTs between .100-.119! 🙄
WCs Year Location: competitors between .100-.119 / total competitors (.1-.119 RTs listed)
No RT data on World Athletics site for 1997 or earlier editions of WCs
If the athletes/agents choose to proceed with a lawsuit, good chance they're gonna win.
In case it's not obvious, that's 16 of 56 (28.6%) RTs in the 100 heats between .100-.119 at Eugene and only 13 of 695 (1.9%) RTs in that range during the previous 11 WCs.
As damning as that is, looking at the actual false-start RTs might be even worse. Eugene was an extraordinary outlier in that department as well.
Personally hoping that Alfred, Allen, Gaither and Tabakaucoro are all compensated. I wonder if the four of them all realize just how ridiculous this data looks. Has anybody heard anything from the non-american athletes that were effected?
Exactly all this, but it’s more than that, you don’t have to use just WC’s.
It’s the resurrection of the old Eugene-13. Clermont times can also be hugely bogus.
This is their way of calling you racist and/or xenophobic. These types of posts should result in PERMANENT IP ADDRESS BANS. It's unfounded and extremely divisive and honestly ruins very important threads.
You are NOT very intelligent so you fit in here nicely. Just because one points out that Rojo is more concerned about Americans does not mean one is accusing him of anything other than that. Not sure if you have ever seen Devon Allen. He is biracial and Rojo is going to bat for him BECAUSE he is an American, not because of his skin color. No racism allegations from anyone intelligent here so maybe think before you kiss up to Rojo with your stupidity.
yes you are literally accusing him of being xenophobic. xenophobic definition - having or showing a dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries.
Do you not realize that this is an American message board? Do you think the Ethiopian news outlets covered the controversy with the Eugene throws circles being too slippery when wet? Do you want Kenya to throw a parade for Ingebritsen for winning the 5k?
NO website in the world shows more support to more athletes, American or not, than letsrun.
Completely agree. It makes no sense to punish someone because they are faster in reacting, it is part of the race. Should be set to .000. If you are faster than that, you went before the gun sound. If it is slower than that, you reacted to the gun sound.
Have a number above .000 is arbitrary. It's bad for the sport.
To have a guy like Devon Allen, who singed a three-year deal with an NFL club who have millions of fans — that's an opportunity for athletics to attract some people to athletics....