matre d wrote:
Basically Kincaid would be the greatest Japanese runner ever if he applied for nationality there.
As if they'd give it to him.
matre d wrote:
Basically Kincaid would be the greatest Japanese runner ever if he applied for nationality there.
As if they'd give it to him.
Jimmbo wrote:
Well the thread title is certainly clickbait as nobody “broke” the marathon. The marathon remains unbroken. However this certainly appears to be due to a confluence of factors, and the three biggest are likely the running culture in Japan, the Tokyo Olympics and the shoes. IF there are PEDs involved, that would be the fourth. NONE of these guys are a threat to set a world record. Or I should clarify that the only world records that a few of these guys might get would be in an ultramarathon di stance.
This post is just flat out wrong. You think it has a lot to do with the "TOkyo Olympics." How so? THey held their Olympic marathon trails 1.5 years ago.
The reality is the Japanese are amazingly good at running pretty good at the marathon. I think it's both genetic and cultural/support. That's been the case for A LONG time.
I mean if we had the same corporate support for US pros as they do in Japan, we could maybe produce something similar. I mean I had at least two guys I coached at Cornell that could break 2:10 in the marathon in super shoes. We were probably like roughly the 40-50th best xc program in the country.I coached for ten year period. So every 10 years, we could produce 100 sub-2:10 guys if they all devoted themselves to running post-graduation.
Okay, that sells it. Time to search the boards and the internet for Japanese training. Clearly, they are doing something right.
rojo wrote:
Jimmbo wrote:
Well the thread title is certainly clickbait as nobody “broke” the marathon. The marathon remains unbroken. However this certainly appears to be due to a confluence of factors, and the three biggest are likely the running culture in Japan, the Tokyo Olympics and the shoes. IF there are PEDs involved, that would be the fourth. NONE of these guys are a threat to set a world record. Or I should clarify that the only world records that a few of these guys might get would be in an ultramarathon di stance.
This post is just flat out wrong. You think it has a lot to do with the "TOkyo Olympics." How so? THey held their Olympic marathon trails 1.5 years ago.
The reality is the Japanese are amazingly good at running pretty good at the marathon. I think it's both genetic and cultural/support. That's been the case for A LONG time.
I mean if we had the same corporate support for US pros as they do in Japan, we could maybe produce something similar. I mean I had at least two guys I coached at Cornell that could break 2:10 in the marathon in super shoes. We were probably like roughly the 40-50th best xc program in the country.I coached for ten year period. So every 10 years, we could produce 100 sub-2:10 guys if they all devoted themselves to running post-graduation.
The Tokyo Olympics of course played a role in drumming up interest in athletics and consequently leading to increased interest in the marathon. Unbelievable how ignorant you can be!
joecrunner wrote:
Okay, that sells it. Time to search the boards and the internet for Japanese training. Clearly, they are doing something right.
. If they are doing something right, why don't the just win Olympic gold in the men's marathon? Or why can't they break 3:40 in the 1500?
People don't like to talk about genetics. It drives me crazy.
It’s probably because it’s not genetics. Asians are notoriously underrepresented in sports because they don’t value it nor have the physical features that many Europeans or West Africans have (in running, East).
Chinese are not good at marathons, Koreans are not good at marathons, etc.
these are the same people that Japanese people came from. You don’t think they just popped up in Japan, do you?
te5n1k wrote:
kmaclam wrote:
And how does 1 country, less than 1/2 the size of Texas SO outperform 'America'??? C'mon Texas, up your game.
Population density of Japan is ridiculous. Its about the size of California, but has 3 times the amount of people (over 125 million total).
Ahhhh......explains everything. Breathing in others carbon dioxide is a game changer. Brilliant!
tough gig wrote:
have to say it..... wrote:
Well, since the team's already set, that should be no problem.
When and how and who?
By their Federation. Just like USA. First 2 at Trials (Grand Championship it may have been called). Then you can bump off 3rd place by breaking National Record. All written down, not subjectivity. This is old news and was gone over in great detail by LRC in preview of their Trials. The NOP guy took the 3rd spot a while ago. This was near the end of the window for being able to take the spot from the 3rd placer.
Now, I don't know whether they extended the window for taking a spot and kicking out the 3rd MGC placer. If so, this guy gets it. However, it was all set long ago (almost a year). But as of then, it was completely decided. Just like USATF's selection has already been made. It seems some of you are concerned they have a non-specific subjective decision like Kenya does. Not the case. Don't know why anyone thinks so after the extensive explanation from LRC editors a year and change ago.
No, I didn't bother looking up the names. No need. Feel free to do so.
rojo wrote:
joecrunner wrote:
Okay, that sells it. Time to search the boards and the internet for Japanese training. Clearly, they are doing something right.
. If they are doing something right, why don't the just win Olympic gold in the men's marathon? Or why can't they break 3:40 in the 1500?
People don't like to talk about genetics. It drives me crazy.
Probably because they don't care about the 1500 and for the Olympics. It's probably a 2 factor issue that they are competing against athletes that grew up at altitude and testing protocols in a more develop country like Japan has something to do with it too.
100% Genetics.
We've trained Japanese to be world class at 1500m and they struggle to break 4:00/mile. There are specialized track corporations in Japan that do not focus on the marathon and aim for success over 800-10,000m on the track.
Stop being so stereotypical - not ever Japanese runner wants to be a marathoner.
I asked Frank why he went to Japan so often to race,
He said, “they love running, they treat me like a god, and the courses are ridiculously short.”
How can there be this many good Japanese marathoners yet they're complete non-factors in Marathon Majors? I get that their sponsors want them to concentrate on domestic marathons but look at Kawauchi -- he gets major pub by running international marathons.
It's culture. The mile, 5k and 10k aren't important runs here -- there after thoughts. The races people care about are the Ekiden and the Marathon. The half is getting popular, which seems to be the trend everywhere.
Even in the 横浜月例 monthly event I take part in, the most popular race by far is the 20km. It's not uncommon to use the 5k as a warm up for the 20k...
I would be really curious someone could compare this course difficultly to the US Marathon Trials in Atlanta?
Aha! Strava makes this easy, Lake Biwa is pancake flat (makes sense around a body of water).
Atlanta had crazy elevation and favored very different kinds of runners as it was a momentum breaker (top 30 men were 2:15 there?)
https://www.strava.com/activities/4862500944/overview
Dairyland wrote:
Koreans are not good at marathons, etc.
Actually Koreans are good at the Marathon. Two of them held the consecutive world record from 1935-1947. They've also brought home some Olympic hardware:
1936: Gold & Bronze (running for colonial Japan)
1992: Gold
1996: Silver
slomo wrote:
I would be really curious someone could compare this course difficultly to the US Marathon Trials in Atlanta?
Aha! Strava makes this easy, Lake Biwa is pancake flat (makes sense around a body of water).
Atlanta had crazy elevation and favored very different kinds of runners as it was a momentum breaker (top 30 men were 2:15 there?)
https://www.strava.com/activities/4862500944/overviewhttps://www.strava.com/activities/4862748162/overviewhttps://www.strava.com/running_races/4379
I legitimately think this course compares to Chicago. Flat, out-and-back (Chicago is a series of out-and-backs), not too many turns but they are sharp.
Dunno, could just be poor luck. But 40 under 2:10 in one race (even with super shoes) is insane depth, akin imo to how nobody cared if you were a 2:20 guy in the U.S. during the 80's.
rojo wrote:
matre d wrote:
Basically Kincaid would be the greatest Japanese runner ever if he applied for nationality there.
As if they'd give it to him.
Of Course they would, Japan is like 98% Japanese, Don't the Leftist Professors, Students, Media and Politicians in Japan complain about not enough Diversity in Japan? And don't the Japanese worry that the lack of Diversity increases the threat of Japanese Privilege in Japan which nobody in Japan would want.
douglas burke wrote:
rojo wrote:
As if they'd give it to him.
Of Course they would, Japan is like 98% Japanese, Don't the Leftist Professors, Students, Media and Politicians in Japan complain about not enough Diversity in Japan? And don't the Japanese worry that the lack of Diversity increases the threat of Japanese Privilege in Japan which nobody in Japan would want.
You are SO DRUNK, bro!
breaking 2:10 is pretty good and all, but isn't the world record 2:01 now?
I’m a D2 female runner. Our coach explicitly told us not to visit LetsRun forums.
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