Donavan Brazier 1500m American Record

Not possible, Brazier is a fast-twitch monster (don't be fooled by his skinny appearance). He probably wouldn't even be able to handle the mileage required to train properly for a 1500m since he has a large % of FT fibers in his legs.

If he was about to break any record, the 600m and 1000m would be more likely since they are closer to his ideal racing distance/physiology.

Also the mile record from Webb is MUCH softer than the 1500m from Lagat, and would be broken before anyone runs sub 3:27.4.

Also his PR is 3:35.85, the 8s difference is gigantic, even considering he ran it off low mileage just casually running a 1500m. That's like expecting him to run a 1:38 800m.

weird, I always took Braziers' chances in the 800m AR as a much higher probability

I could see sub 3:29, but definitely seems like a stretch to see 3:27.xx to get Lagats record.

A bit off topic, but does anyone know what kind of V02 max 800m specialists have compared to longer distances runners?

Will U.S. fans of T&F please allow 800m athletes to specialize without speculating on elite 800m athletes 1500m &/or one mile potential. Jim Ryun at his peak fitness rumored to be a 45.xx something 400m man. Most likely Ryun was 400m F.A.T. capable of low 46 400m. Ryun at his peak fitness was same height & weight as Duane Solomon. Ryun had no business racing 1500m at 1968 Olympics based on his size at high elevation. Even though Ryun in 1960s was a great sea level 1500m man, Ryun should have chased 800m gold, 1968, most likely 1972 also. Leave U.S. 800m guys alone. Let 800m guys race 800m.

Chances to break his own record? Probably pretty good chance that he can improve a bit more sure. But why not go after a different record?

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Not possible, Brazier is a fast-twitch monster (don't be fooled by his skinny appearance). He probably wouldn't even be able to handle the mileage required to train properly for a 1500m since he has a large % of FT fibers in his legs.

Everyone is different. I am sure that he wouldn't actually need to run whatever abritrary mileage milestone that you have in your mind to run a strong 1500. I do doubt that he would want to even try to beat the record.

will U.S. fans of T&F ... wrote:

Will U.S. fans of T&F please allow 800m athletes to specialize without speculating on elite 800m athletes 1500m &/or one mile potential. Jim Ryun at his peak fitness rumored to be a 45.xx something 400m man. Most likely Ryun was 400m F.A.T. capable of low 46 400m. Ryun at his peak fitness was same height & weight as Duane Solomon. Ryun had no business racing 1500m at 1968 Olympics based on his size at high elevation. Even though Ryun in 1960s was a great sea level 1500m man, Ryun should have chased 800m gold, 1968, most likely 1972 also. Leave U.S. 800m guys alone. Let 800m guys race 800m.

That may be true, but no. We speculate on all atheletes doing different distances for all T&F events. No reason to stop now.

all hail sham69 wrote:

What do the lets runner's think of this speculative claim?

not without EPO like a-sample lagat

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Not possible, Brazier is a fast-twitch monster (don't be fooled by his skinny appearance). He probably wouldn't even be able to handle the mileage required to train properly for a 1500m since he has a large % of FT fibers in his legs.

If he was about to break any record, the 600m and 1000m would be more likely since they are closer to his ideal racing distance/physiology.

Also the mile record from Webb is MUCH softer than the 1500m from Lagat, and would be broken before anyone runs sub 3:27.4.

Also his PR is 3:35.85, the 8s difference is gigantic, even considering he ran it off low mileage just casually running a 1500m. That's like expecting him to run a 1:38 800m.

Being a fast twitch athlete and winning a gold medal and breaking a American record in a primarily aerobic event. Pretty sure his "fast twitch" muscles won't prevent him from going sub 3:30. Didn't you watch him jog 3:35?

I disagree on your assessment of braziers fast to slow twitch ratio. The fact that he was decent at cross country, and is producing world class times in the 1500m shows he’s still probably leaning quite slow twitch. A world class 400m specialist however would not be able to be a world class miler and probably couldn’t even be a collegiate caliber XC runner.

I think brazier is very capable of running 60-70 mpw and keep quality up to a decent level, but there just doesn’t seem to be a reason to.

I’m personally not counting donavan out for sub 1:41, And I think it’d be a waste of time for him to double mileage in order to become America’s best miler when he could secure the spot of the worlds best half miler.

That being said, 30-35 miles a week just simply isn’t enough to reach your potential in the mile. Not even close IMO. I do think he could go sub 3:30 but an AR is questionable.

There is no way Brazier runs under 3:27.4 before he runs under 1:40.9. Rudisha's record is not as tough as it seems, it was run after two semi-finals without rabbits from the front. Put Rudisha fresh with a rabbit on the day of the Olympic final and he could run 1:39. I think Brazier could run 1:40 low with the new spikes, pacers, and wave light. Until Brazier breaks the world record I wouldn't talk about him going sub 1:40 tho

barf...

1) Brazeer does not run lower below 1:42. Ever. Likely, he already has his lifetime PB.

2) Lol. If he was a fast twitch monster than he could at least go 44 seconds in the 400. What is his PB? Near 47i?? OMG!!

3) The person runs a 3:35 high and now is gonna bust a 3:27?? WTF?? Not gonna go below 3:34. EVER.

4) 1:40 -- 3:27/28. This is as stupid as saying Walmsleys gonna run the next NYM in 2:05.

Here comes the vomit hype wrote:

3) The person runs a 3:35 high and now is gonna bust a 3:27?? WTF?? Not gonna go below 3:34. EVER.

The fact that it came from Craig, his training partner that holds a PB of 3:34, makes you wonder what kind of times they put up in practice. I'm not sure what incentive Craig has to say that his teammate could run 7 seconds faster than him if he didn't think or possible already know that he could.

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Not possible, Brazier is a fast-twitch monster (don't be fooled by his skinny appearance). He probably wouldn't even be able to handle the mileage required to train properly for a 1500m since he has a large % of FT fibers in his legs.

If he was about to break any record, the 600m and 1000m would be more likely since they are closer to his ideal racing distance/physiology.

Also the mile record from Webb is MUCH softer than the 1500m from Lagat, and would be broken before anyone runs sub 3:27.4.

Also his PR is 3:35.85, the 8s difference is gigantic, even considering he ran it off low mileage just casually running a 1500m. That's like expecting him to run a 1:38 800m.

He ran 15:26 and 4:07 in high school. The latter was indoors I believe in his only attempt. Don't spread that nonsense about muscle fibers. You know you can change your composition? It's not the end all be all. You probably think VO2 max is important too.

He's already run what? 3:35? And that's on like 45 miles per week. Imagine if he cared about the 1500.

will U.S. fans of T&F ... wrote:

Will U.S. fans of T&F please allow 800m athletes to specialize without speculating on elite 800m athletes 1500m &/or one mile potential. Jim Ryun at his peak fitness rumored to be a 45.xx something 400m man. Most likely Ryun was 400m F.A.T. capable of low 46 400m. Ryun at his peak fitness was same height & weight as Duane Solomon. Ryun had no business racing 1500m at 1968 Olympics based on his size at high elevation. Even though Ryun in 1960s was a great sea level 1500m man, Ryun should have chased 800m gold, 1968, most likely 1972 also. Leave U.S. 800m guys alone. Let 800m guys race 800m.

This is an interesting take.

He didn't jog a 3:35, he ran a 52 last 400, which is to be expected to because of his speed and speed endurance. That doesn't mean he can hold 1:52 pace for 1500. Nick Symmonds and Brazier were less than a second apart in the 800, and Nick only managed a 3:34.5 and Nick most likely had the better aerobic ability.

Let’s be honest. If it’s going to be anyone it’s Brazier.

Are we saying the 1500 m AR is the 3:27 Lagat ran in 2004 while representing Kenya?

I know he privately became a US citizen earlier that year but a national record has to be ratified under certain guidelines.

For years his 3:29 in 2005 was the record.

What prompted the change?

Didn’t a woman break the American steeple record but it didn’t count because she didn’t file the paperwork in time or take a drug test within three days or something?