It’s super hard to imagine someone making the choice to take hormones and get a sex change because they wanted to win a running race.
It’s super hard to imagine someone making the choice to take hormones and get a sex change because they wanted to win a running race.
Really? Most of the time people do it for no real reason.
at this point in time wrote:
With more and more research coming out it's becoming clearer that there needs to be stricter rules over who can compete in the women's category. This is not to say that we exclude trans women. But we should be looking into how to make the rules the most fair.
When mens and women's sports were separated it wasn't due to gender identity. It was due to physical differences. Let's not forget that. On the same token, excluding an entire group of women is antithetical to sports and humanity. Let's remember that too.
So stricter rules. But with that, let the trans women play.
I expect that if the NCAA rules of needing hormone suppression for a year are followed, this is pretty much a non issue for distance running. Transwoman might still be faster than biological woman but the evidence suggests that the gap shrinks from ~10% to less than 2%. You aren't going to have hoard for 4:20 boys switching genders and dominating. When some 3:58 miler decides he is transgender, those couple of seconds though could make a difference. In some other sports, I am not as sure. And obviously this all assumes that the drugs and hormones are being taken.
This is a non-sequitur. We are discussing actions not intentions, who cares what the reasons are for transitioning. The point is what is fair or equitatble -- biological males who transition into women have an unfair advantage and as such should not competing against cis women.
samesame wrote:
It’s super hard to imagine someone making the choice to take hormones and get a sex change because they wanted to win a running race.
adsfdasfasfsafadfa wrote:
at this point in time wrote:
With more and more research coming out it's becoming clearer that there needs to be stricter rules over who can compete in the women's category. This is not to say that we exclude trans women. But we should be looking into how to make the rules the most fair.
When mens and women's sports were separated it wasn't due to gender identity. It was due to physical differences. Let's not forget that. On the same token, excluding an entire group of women is antithetical to sports and humanity. Let's remember that too.
So stricter rules. But with that, let the trans women play.
I expect that if the NCAA rules of needing hormone suppression for a year are followed, this is pretty much a non issue for distance running. Transwoman might still be faster than biological woman but the evidence suggests that the gap shrinks from ~10% to less than 2%. You aren't going to have hoard for 4:20 boys switching genders and dominating. When some 3:58 miler decides he is transgender, those couple of seconds though could make a difference. In some other sports, I am not as sure. And obviously this all assumes that the drugs and hormones are being taken.
It's also not an issue because there aren't any transgender female distance runners.
samesame wrote:
It’s super hard to imagine someone making the choice to take hormones and get a sex change because they wanted to win a running race.
Strawman, nobody’s ever said that’s the sole reason people do it. It just happens to be a consequence of that choice that has a direct negative unfair impact on other people.
FINALLY!! SOMEONE WITH SOME COMMON SENSE!! AND TRUE SCIENCE BEHIND THEM!holy cow!
Tulsi Gabbard forgot all about him. Talk about a blast from the past.
A RHINO if you ask me.
RINO*
I consider myself a pretty progressive liberal democrat. Left of Joe Biden but slightly right of the AOC crowd.
This is one topic I take a hard line on.
If a man wants to transition to a women I fully support that, embrace it and applaud their courage.
I do not believe that same woman should be allowed to compete against other woman though. I think you give up that right when you transition.
If I was a woman competing against a trans-woman I would forfeit in protest. I think trans- women competing against naturally born women is one of the biggest miscarriages of justice in the high school and collegiate systems. Women deserve the right to compete against women who don’t have the benefit of elevated testosterone even if suppressed. .
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RunRagged wrote:
I dunno what your definition of of "distance runners" is, but June (formerly Jonathan) Eastwood of the U of Montana trounced all the female competitors in the mile at an NCAA regional event in February of this year:
https://youtu.be/acEwFJBerIU
That's Big Sky Conference championships. Even if Eastwood had qualified for NCAA, she would have been a non-factor.
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samesame wrote:
It’s super hard to imagine someone making the choice to take hormones and get a sex change because they wanted to win a running race.
Really? People undergo surgical body modification all the time to appear more attractive, and take hormones to feel younger.
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Just Another Hobby Jogger wrote:
RunRagged wrote:
I dunno what your definition of of "distance runners" is, but June (formerly Jonathan) Eastwood of the U of Montana trounced all the female competitors in the mile at an NCAA regional event in February of this year:
https://youtu.be/acEwFJBerIUThat's Big Sky Conference championships. Even if Eastwood had qualified for NCAA, she would have been a non-factor.
She still beat a bio women who otherwise would be the conference champion.
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Precious Roy wrote:
I know an OBGYN. She told me that you would be shocked at the number of times the determination of biological sex at the time of birth is not clear.
Further, this bill, while well intentions are present to protect biologically female athletes from being eclipsed by trans women, effectively has the consequence of banning trans people from collegiate athletics. That is no better a situation than having trans women competing with biological women.
Trans women should be allowed to compete with biological women, but biological women should be given proper recognition for their achievements. If a trans woman wins a race, the first biological female should also be recognized as the winner. In tournament sports, biological women would be given a second chance after losing to a trans woman. And so on. We can all learn how to get through this tough issue without having to exclude anyone or having biological female athletes losing opportunities in championships, etc.
I don't think trans women should be allow to compete against biological women. Trans women have a biological advantage. If it can be proven that we hormone treatment they have no advantage I could change my mind, but that is not the case.
A trans woman could have the option of competing against men or find a rare trans event.
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